Interesting note from Jim Callis chat today.

[TyCobb]

Last time I checked, Joe wasn't the best player in the league... ever. Most likely not even the best at his position. He was an excellent player, don't get me wrong, but Albert Pujols, he was not.

What?

He has the same career wOBA as Pujols and played CF not 1b.

[TyCobb]

I can think of 3 CF's around Joe D's era that were better. He played in NY and they played up the Yankee angle. They sold the sizzle and not the steak.

Could you name me those 3 CFers?

[dhaze]

It's still mind boggling that Joe D won the '41 MVP over Teddy. Williams was superior across the board.

[Satyr3206]

Could you name me those 3 CFers?

Willie Mays, Mickey Mantle, and Hack Wilson. Mantle was a little later and Wilson slightly before but all three were significantly better. At least in my opinion. Duke Snider could be mentioned too.

[RandyM]

Just wait for him to be a FA.

Just like Teix .

[Mooreisbetter27]

I don't have an opinion either way and I don't follow wOBA at all.

But Dimaggio's career OPS is 977. Pujols has had only one year where he was below that and that was 955.

Take that however you want. Like I said, I don't have an opinion.

[TyCobb]

Willie Mays, Mickey Mantle, and Hack Wilson. Mantle was a little later and Wilson slightly before but all three were significantly better. At least in my opinion. Duke Snider could be mentioned too.

.............wOBA

DiMaggio - .439

Mantle - .431

Wilson - .423

Mays - .413

And none of them played in the same era as Joe D.

[QBsILLEST1]

I don't have an opinion either way and I don't follow wOBA at all.

But Dimaggio's career OPS is 977. Pujols has had only one year where he was below that and that was 955.

Take that however you want. Like I said, I don't have an opinion.

And once again, even if you can find one or 2 stats that are comprable between the 2, it is a stated fact that Pujols plays in much tougher competition than JoeD ever did....

[crawdad]

What?

He has the same career wOBA as Pujols and played CF not 1b.

I think people often have a hard time comparing eras and positions. Joe's positional value sets him up very well. If Joe was a 1B, I'd think we would have a good argument as to which was more valuable.

[crawdad]

And once again, even if you can find one or 2 stats that are comprable between the 2, it is a stated fact that Pujols plays in much tougher competition than JoeD ever did....

Well, I mean, in that case we can make the argument that Devon White is superior to Joe. I think it is more apt to compare players to their own era than by what they would do over time.

I think my favorite one was extrapolating Matt Stairs back to the 1920s and finding he would have been equivalent to Babe Ruth. We've come a long way.

[Satyr3206]

.............wOBA

DiMaggio - .439

Mantle - .431

Wilson - .423

Mays - .413

And none of them played in the same era as Joe D.

This is my last post about this because I think the thread needs to get back on track.

That's one stat that wasn't even used in their era. Look at HR's, RBI's, Slugging %. Mantle and Mays were easily comparable fielders. Mantle and Mays were both active before DiMaggio retired. Wilson retired slightly before DiMaggio. Therefore I think those are comparable era's.

[TyCobb]

This is my last post about this because I think the thread needs to get back on track.

That's one stat that wasn't even used in their era. Look at HR's, RBI's, Slugging %. Mantle and Mays were easily comparable fielders. Mantle and Mays were both active before DiMaggio retired. Wilson retired slightly before DiMaggio. Therefore I think those are comparable era's.

And this is where I quit while I am ahead.

[OsfanHook]

Back to the topic I wouldn't make the trade. Reimold, Arrieta and Snyder is to much for him. This board lacks one thing: Patience. I am a fan and have been for a long time but I would wait one or two more years, stockpile a few more arms and players see how a few of these guys like Snyder, Waring and others do and then deal from a position of power. The first focus is to get the pitching in order and that is happening. Once the pitching kicks in next year then start looking at 3B, 1B and DH. I would not block Bell or Waring at this point. Maybe add a DH but 2011 has to be the target.

[DrungoHazewood]

Willie Mays, Mickey Mantle, and Hack Wilson. Mantle was a little later and Wilson slightly before but all three were significantly better. At least in my opinion. Duke Snider could be mentioned too.

Mays and Mantle were probably better than DiMaggio.

Snider pretty clearly wasn't.

Saying Hack Wilson was better is akin to saying that Melvin Mora is better than Mike Schmidt.

Well, I mean, in that case we can make the argument that Devon White is superior to Joe. I think it is more apt to compare players to their own era than by what they would do over time.

I think my favorite one was extrapolating Matt Stairs back to the 1920s and finding he would have been equivalent to Babe Ruth. We've come a long way.

But one thing you must do is account for the increased competition, the slope of history. Otherwise you end up with the conclusion that all the best players in history played 80 or 100 years ago, since they were able to dominate lesser leagues by so much more.

[BRob51]

Last time I checked Pujols didn't skip 3 years of his prime to fight a War.

Joe didn't fight, but he served as an instructor. Vince wasn't allowed to fight, but battled to get into the navy, and finally did. Vince will always be better than Joe in my book.