Do you want anyone from the Marlins?

[Sports Guy]

If you are able to get Josh Johnson for a deal headed by Arrieta and you can get JJ to sign a 3 or 4 year extension, it should be done...depending on what else you would need to put with Arrieta.

[crawdad]

If you are able to get Josh Johnson for a deal headed by Arrieta and you can get JJ to sign a 3 or 4 year extension, it should be done...depending on what else you would need to put with Arrieta.

Yeah, I think that is the major point.

[srock]

Nick Johnson is not my ideal target for 1B, but we could do much worse. In lieu of a big power bat, I would take him as a low cost OBP machine at 1B. Of course, I would prefer the power bat, but acquiring one appears problematic at best.

30 years old, has made $5.5 million a year for 3 years. OPS+ over 120 without HR's, but OPACY could return him to a 15-20 HR guy along with OBP over .400.

Taking a flier on Troy Glaus at 3B, and we could have some cost effective stop gaps for the next 2-3 years.

[Lt Melmo]

Are people not mentioning Nolasco because he would cost too much, or because you're down on him? Out of every player in the OP, he's the one I would target, if the M's are down on him.

[Enjoy Terror]

The Marlins management changed after their first World Series, and Marlins philosophy about dumping potentially expensive players happened after their second World Series. It's a completely different team now. They do have a really great scouting department though, I think that's apparent.

[Sports Guy]

Yeah, I think that is the major point.

Obviously...but shooting down the idea is pretty terrible...Johnson is a very good pitcher.

The problem is, he is only under control for 2 more years and you have to get an extension to bring him here.

[Stotle]

If you are able to get Josh Johnson for a deal headed by Arrieta and you can get JJ to sign a 3 or 4 year extension, it should be done...depending on what else you would need to put with Arrieta.

Obviously if FLA is willing to agree to a silly deal, sure do it. If I can get Fielder for a package headed by Snyder, I'd do that, too.

[Stotle]

Obviously...but shooting down the idea is pretty terrible...Johnson is a very good pitcher.

The problem is, he is only under control for 2 more years and you have to get an extension to bring him here.

Shooting down the idea is not terrible. The only way the idea works is if you operate under the assumption that FLA is willing to move him for below market value. That could be the case if, as with Beckett, there was some desparate need to shed another player's contract. But there is nothing at all that would compell FLA to simply make a bad deal "just because".

[Sports Guy]

Obviously if FLA is willing to agree to a silly deal, sure do it. If I can get Fielder for a package headed by Snyder, I'd do that, too.

Depends on how you define a silly package.

If JJ can be had for Arrieta, either Reimold or Snyder, Britton and a guy like JJ or Mickolio, that's a trade you have to make IMO...That's not a silly trade...That's not the Marlins getting ripped off or anything like that.

But if you can get JJ to sign a 3-4 year extension and make a deal like that, you do it.

[Stotle]

Depends on how you define a silly package.

If JJ can be had for Arrieta, either Reimold or Snyder, Britton and a guy like JJ or Mickolio, that's a trade you have to make IMO...That's not a silly trade...That's not the Marlins getting ripped off or anything like that.

But if you can get JJ to sign a 3-4 year extension and make a deal like that, you do it.

Well, I'll go with the more valuable package in your example.

JJ for Arrieta, Reimold, Britton and Mickolio.

1. I don't think FLA goes for that. Two pitchers with a shot to be mid-rotation guys, a slugging LF that missed a not-insignificant time to end the season and a power arm in the pen.

2. If you're using your excess pitching and OF to get Johnson, what are you doing to bring in a bat or two?

[Sports Guy]

Well, I'll go with the more valuable package in your example.

JJ for Arrieta, Reimold, Britton and Mickolio.

1. I don't think FLA goes for that. Two pitchers with a shot to be mid-rotation guys, a slugging LF that missed a not-insignificant time to end the season and a power arm in the pen.

2. If you're using your excess pitching and OF to get Johnson, what are you doing to bring in a bat or two?

The young TOR starter is a bigger need than the bat.

Get the bat in other ways.

[BringBackMagic]

Why is nobody mentioning Cantu as an option. He may be had for fairly cheap, he plays first and third (both organizational needs) and hits for decent power. I know it would be said that we already have that Ty Wigginton, and Cantu would be a redundant addition, but he theoretically has his best years ahead of him and could put up 20 HRs next season split between the corner infield spots and occassionally DH.

[BringBackMagic]

Also, I fully agree with Stotle. Johnson would be a great arm to have, but there is no way he is had for anything less then Tillman/Matusz + Snyder/Bell and another two key pieces such as Erbe and Waring. It would probably take more than that IMO.

We have two guys in our rotation already that could be as good as Johnson by 2011.

If we are going to trade pitching, I want a middle of the order bat.

[Stotle]

The young TOR starter is a bigger need than the bat.

Get the bat in other ways.

A young TOR starter is the most expensive thing to get in baseball, which is the whole premise of "Grow the arms and buy the bats."

That isn't a formula MacPhail pulled out of thin air. It's the idea that you have to drastically overpay to get a "young TOR starter", and "established starters" are bad value in FA because of the potential for injury rendering your deal a failure, so you grow your own. That leaves you the resources you need to address the other necessities on your ML squad, which you can implement in a more effective manner.

[Sports Guy]

A young TOR starter is the most expensive thing to get in baseball, which is the whole premise of "Grow the arms and buy the bats."

That isn't a formula MacPhail pulled out of thin air. It's the idea that you have to drastically overpay to get a "young TOR starter", and "established starters" are bad value in FA because of the potential for injury rendering your deal a failure, so you grow your own. That leaves you the resources you need to address the other necessities on your ML squad, which you can implement in a more effective manner.

You are arguing 2 different things...If it takes a lot more than I said, then you move on.

Let me ask you this...Let's say the marlins would trade him for that package..Would you make that trade?