Trembley on "Average 3Bman" RBIs

[El Gordo]

The only thing worse than someone who spends their time talking about something as though they can do it is someone who spends their time lecturing that person.

So you think pointing out the difference between virtual reality and reality, to someone who seems confused about it, is giving them a boring and needless lecture? Rather they should remain confused?:scratchchinhmm:

[El Gordo]

That doesn't mean anything other than those fans, whether purposely or not, are uninformed.

Perhaps, but they are more representaive of the market than you are. If they weren't we would be hearing about the difference between RBI's OPS and OBP etc, all over the the TV and other forms of media coverage, The fact is we don't. This stuff hasn't reached the mainstream yet. It will, but not soon. The media sound bites aren't being directed at you, so why should they conform to your supposed level of "sophistication".

[Old#5fan]

And if this is what you think I said, you're dumber than a box of hair.

Well, didn't you post that rbi's do not reflect the skill of a hitter? So in making such a blanket statement as that are you not inferring that rbi's have no relationship to hitting skill? So if that is true, the fact that Hack Wilson had 190 in a season would apparently not be indicative of his hitting skill in any fashion?

There is no other conclusion that can be drawn from such a blanket statement that you made for all to see. If you cannot by mere deductive reasoning - hell, not even that, just flat out common sense tell that rbi's in such high numbers would have to indicate advanced skill in hitting ,than you are not living in the real world but in some kind of numerical fantasy land that is meaningless!!

[RShack]

Perhaps, but they are more representaive of the market than you are. If they weren't we would be hearing about the difference between RBI's OPS and OBP etc, all over the the TV and other forms of media coverage, The fact is we don't. This stuff hasn't reached the mainstream yet. It will, but not soon. The media sound bites aren't being directed at you, so why should they conform to your supposed level of "sophistication".

I noticed that during the last series vs. TOR, one of TOR-TV's full-screen stat graphics about player performance included OPS. Hadn't seen that before...

[TyCobb]

Well, didn't you post that rbi's do not reflect the skill of a hitter? So in making such a blanket statement as that are you not inferring that rbi's have no relationship to hitting skill? So if that is true, the fact that Hack Wilson had 190 in a season would apparently not be indicative of his hitting skill in any fashion? There is no other conclusion that can be drawn from such a blanket statement that you made for all to see. If you cannot by mere deductive reasoning - hell, not even that, just flat out common sense tell that rbi's in high numbers would have to indicate skill in hitting than you are not living in the real world but in some kind of numerical fantasy land that is meaningless!!

I don't believe a human can have logic this bad.

[TyCobb]

I noticed that during the last series vs. TOR, one of TOR-TV's full-screen stat graphics about player performance included OPS. Hadn't seen that before...

Boston and Yankee put it up.

Doesn't ESPN use it?

[Lucky Jim]

Well, didn't you post that rbi's do not reflect the skill of a hitter? So in making such a blanket statement as that are you not inferring that rbi's have no relationship to hitting skill? So if that is true, the fact that Hack Wilson had 190 in a season would apparently not be indicative of his hitting skill in any fashion?

There is no other conclusion that can be drawn from such a blanket statement that you made for all to see. If you cannot by mere deductive reasoning - hell, not even that, just flat out common sense tell that rbi's in high numbers would have to indicate advanced skill in hitting than you are not living in the real world but in some kind of numerical fantasy land that is meaningless!!

Point out where I ever used the word "reflect."

Point out where I said that RBIs and hitting skill have "no relationship".

Go to my posts, now, and use my own language to show where I said either such thing. Use the quote function.

[BaltimoreTerp]

So you think pointing out the difference between virtual reality and reality, to someone who seems confused about it, is giving them a boring and needless lecture? Rather they should remain confused?:scratchchinhmm:

Yes, because it suggests that you are the one that believes any of this actually matters.

Perhaps, but they are more representaive of the market than you are. If they weren't we would be hearing about the difference between RBI's OPS and OBP etc, all over the the TV and other forms of media coverage, The fact is we don't. This stuff hasn't reached the mainstream yet. It will, but not soon. The media sound bites aren't being directed at you, so why should they conform to your supposed level of "sophistication".

Stotle already brought it back up, but what about my original post in here with the quotes from Theo? Remember, he was talking to members of the media who were SPECIFICALLY asking about Drew's RBI production, as opposed to Trembley who was just being asked in vague terms about improving the team.

He obviously believes these concepts are mainstream enough to be understood immediately by the fans and media.

[El Gordo]

I noticed that during the last series vs. TOR, one of TOR-TV's full-screen stat graphics about player performance included OPS. Hadn't seen that before...

You see it now and then, it's creeping in. But how often do you hear the TV commentators referring to it as they do BA, RBI etc. I'm pretty sure they are aware of new metrics, they just don't mention it much, because it is considered arcane.

[El Gordo]

Yes, because it suggests that you are the one that believes any of this actually matters.

Stotle already brought it back up, but what about my original post in here with the quotes from Theo? Remember, he was talking to members of the media who were SPECIFICALLY asking about Drew's RBI production, as opposed to Trembley who was just being asked in vague terms about improving the team.

He obviously believes these concepts are mainstream enough to be understood immediately by the fans and media.

To begin with, what was the context of that interview? There's a big difference between a post game interview, and a round table discussion on ESPN or XM radio, e.g. Secondly, it's an exception that proves the rule. How often do we hear local sports media discussing these things or asking questions using terms like OPS or peripherals etc. They just don't do it that much because they know their audience. This shouldn't be that hard for you to grasp.

[RShack]

You see it now and then, it's creeping in. But how often do you hear the TV commentators referring to it as they do BA, RBI etc. I'm pretty sure they are aware of new metrics, they just don't mention it much, because it is considered arcane.

Oh, I agree with your basic point. DT was talking in std baseball-speak to standard fans. Meanwhile, a few folks here are making a big deal out of the fact that they have the secret decoder ring and are dissing him because he didn't speak using their code... as if it matters...

[El Gordo]

Oh, I agree with your basic point. DT was talking in std baseball-speak to standard fans. Meanwhile, a few folks here are making a big deal out of the fact that they have the secret decoder ring and are dissing him because he didn't speak using their code... as if it matters...

I gather that DT is familiar with the OH, and reads it on occasion. Too bad we couldn't set up some kind of question answer session online, so we can clear up some of these misconceptions.

[TyCobb]

Oh, I agree with your basic point. DT was talking in std baseball-speak to standard fans. Meanwhile, a few folks here are making a big deal out of the fact that they have the secret decoder ring and are dissing him because he didn't speak using their code... as if it matters...

Well only 7 3bs in the league had more than 90 RBIs (and I am counting Youkilis and Cantu who both are really 1b)

If it was really average for a 3b to have 90-100 RBIs you would think there would be close to 15 guys doing it.

For a guy who profession is to manage a baseball team you would think he would know that RBIs has more do to with the guys batting ahead of the player than the players hitting abilities.

Jose Lopez (from Seattle) had 96 RBIs with a .272/.303/.463 line. A wOBA of .325 which is actually 2.2 Runs Below Average.

Ben Zobrist had 91 RBIs with a .297/.405/.543 line. A wOBA of .408 which is good for 39.4 Runs Above Average.

[RShack]

Well only 7 3bs in the league had more than 90 RBIs (and I am counting Youkilis and Cantu who both are really 1b)

If it was really average for a 3b to have 90-100 RBIs you would think there would be close to 15 guys doing it.

For a guy who profession is to manage a baseball team you would think he would know that RBIs has more do to with the guys batting ahead of the player than the players hitting abilities.

Jose Lopez (from Seattle) had 96 RBIs with a .272/.303/.463 line. A wOBA of .325 which is actually 2.2 Runs Below Average.

Ben Zobrist had 91 RBIs with a .297/.405/.543 line. A wOBA of .408 which is good for 39.4 Runs Above Average.

I know you can look up numbers on the internet, you don't have to prove it to anybody.

Jeez Louise, DT was just saying he wants a 3B who can hit the dang ball and knock in a bunch of runs, OK? I hope he gets one. Sorry you didn't like how he said it.

[El Gordo]

Well only 7 3bs in the league had more than 90 RBIs (and I am counting Youkilis and Cantu who both are really 1b)

If it was really average for a 3b to have 90-100 RBIs you would think there would be close to 15 guys doing it.

For a guy who profession is to manage a baseball team you would think he would know that RBIs has more do to with the guys batting ahead of the player than the players hitting abilities.

Jose Lopez (from Seattle) had 96 RBIs with a .272/.303/.463 line. A wOBA of .325 which is actually 2.2 Runs Below Average.

Ben Zobrist had 91 RBIs with a .297/.405/.543 line. A wOBA of .408 which is good for 39.4 Runs Above Average.

All you have to do is try to imagine Rick Dempsey, Anita Marks, Tom Davis, Jim Hunter, Gary Thorne, or Buck Martinez saying any of this, to prove my point. Sorry but I do believe you've gotten your head stuck somewhere the sun don't shine.:laughlol: