Number 13 Prospect: SS - Pedro Florimon

[QBsILLEST1]

I think we agree for the most part. I think where we disagree slightly is what is someone's projection. There aren't that many prospects that "really" project as true TOR's. You can say if the person improves their 40 command to a 60 and develops their slider which is a 50 to a 70, sure. That said being a projection of a #2 or even a #3 starter isn't a bad project to have. There are probably on 4 - 8 true TOR in baseball right now even though there are many more teams. This isn't a slight on our prospects.

I know there arent many pitchers that truely project as a TOR starter. I dont recall projecting anyone being a TOR starter here, can you explain to me what you are referring to? A guy like Wirsch at this point and time may have an absolute ceiling of a TOR guy, but a whole lot would have to go right in order for that to occur. But, he already has excellent command, a good curve, GB tendencies and has major projectability left, so its definitely a possibility that as he fills in, his fastball gets into the low to mid 90's, and if you mix that with the fact he already has a good curve and excellent command with GB tendencies, hes well on his way to becoming a TOR starter, but at this point where he is developmentally, he doesnt project as a TOR starter. But at the same time, theres such a large gap between floor and ceiling for him, that he has a chance to start headed towards that ceiling.

And I agree, theres nothing wrong with having a bunch of #2 or #3 starters, but I really do not see what you are replying to or what point you are making exactly.......

[Frobby]

No wonder you think our system is in shambles. You dont think there is anyone left in our system who is likely to be an everyday player? There are a ton of arms left who just dont have track record and are therefore unable to be ranked this highly. Jarret Martin, Ashur Tolliver, Randy Henry, Jacob Cowan, Aaron Wirsch, Ryan Berry are all arms who you couldnt individually say will likely be a everyday MLer, not without much of a track record, but there will be some everyday MLers coming from past the #14 slot, I put my word on it. And the idea of a high floor(likely to be a MLer) is only half the equation. Most of the arms mentioned here have a chance to be more than just an everyday MLer, they all have high ceilings.

I find it quite interesting, if you read Britton's(#2 OH prospect) scouting report and then go read some of the pitchers I listed above, you will be shocked that some of the guys we drafted has better stuff than Britton. You could make an argument for Henry having the best stuff in the MiL system not named Matusz. But since he hasnt pitched he really cannot be thrown to the top of the heap, he doesnt have the pedigree, injury struck him at the worst time....

To be fair, a system where prospects in the ten to twenty range are LIKELY to be starters would be an incredibly deep system. Likely, to me, generally means more often than not.

That's generally how I mean "likely." But like I said in my post, I think in general while we have a lot of high ceiling pitchers in the lower minors, they are still facing high odds of being good major league starting pitchers. That's no knock on them, those are just the facts of life when it comes to failure rate as guys move up the ladder. Think about Pedro Beato, Tim Bascom, and many others I could name if I looked at old top 10 lists. So while I agree that the list isn't only about floor, it's also true that making a list is not only about ceiling. And the fact that someone ranked below 14 will probably be better than Florimon doesn't mean there is any one individual pitcher who is likely to be better. It would be great if one of the pitchers you named ended up having more value than an average major league starting shortstop, which I pegged as Florimon's ceiling.