New WNST protest planned

[Why Not?]

Making Angelos aware that it's not just the crappy team that drives us away. It's also things like letting Jon Miller go, chasing away Davey Johnson, not honoring the '66 O's last year, not putting Baltimore on the road jerseys (or anywhere else in the logo), rude ushers, no HD on MASN, forcing us to go to only select media outlets to hear from team personnel, constantly threatening to sue, etc (I could go on all day).

I don't think anyone would care about any of that if the team was winning. It's all pretty nit-picky stuff that seems meaningful in the context of a decade of losing.

[SilentJames]

I don't think anyone would care about any of that if the team was winning. It's all pretty nit-picky stuff that seems meaningful in the context of a decade of losing.

BINGO!

No one really cared when the Orioles took Baltimore off the roadies THIRTY YEARS AGO!

After a decade of losing these little things are magnified and seem so much worse. If the Orioles had the Yankees' record we would not be talking about this.

But the Orioles HAVE had a decade of losing and these are the easy things to please the fans that would be cheap and easy to do. There is no good reason NOT to do it, but they don't.

Is it stupid and illogical, yes. Is it a carnal sin and hellworthy trespass, no.

[howie14]

Are you serious? Have you been following the same team over the last 10 years? Ripping them for 24/7 wouldn't even do it justice. Pretty much everything the O's have done over that time has been the wrong thing. What have the O's done over the last 10 years that they should be praised for?

I was absolutely serious. Note I didn't say "praise" anywhere in my comment. You're putting words in my mouth and I'm not playing.

No Sean, no matter how bad these ten years have been, no matter how much you want all of us to just go out and kill ourselves over this baseball team, no they don't do everything wrong. WNST just tells us they do.

[NewMarketSean]

I was absolutely serious. Note I didn't say "praise" anywhere in my comment. You're putting words in my mouth and I'm not playing.

No Sean, no matter how bad these ten years have been, no matter how much you want all of us to just go out and kill ourselves over this baseball team, no they don't do everything wrong. WNST just tells us they do.

Name 5 things they've done right over the last 5 years.

[btownoriole]

You do get how insane that sounds, right?

I don't think it's insane, because I'm convinced that the first protest had an impact (McPhail's hiring). I know I'm in the minority on that and that's fine. Intelligent minds can disagree. Besides, the only man who truly knows will never admit it even if it did.

You're right.

He doesn't know all that stuff already, he doesn't hear it any time he goes into public, he doesn't read any newspapers or watch any television.

It will take the SECOND coming of a handful of chanting fans paying him money for the point to get across.

If he gets it, then why doesn't he do anything about it?

I don't think he gets it. Otherwise he wouldn't continue to do it. And when I hear comments from the warehouse that "once we start winning everything will be ok" I start thinking about Irsay and the Colts in the 70's. They won 3 straight division titles but things weren't OK. And the fans thought that just not going to games would be their statement. That strategy didn't work out very well.

[btownoriole]

I don't think anyone would care about any of that if the team was winning. It's all pretty nit-picky stuff that seems meaningful in the context of a decade of losing.

It's not nit-picky stuff to a lot of fans. I go back to the example of my brother - and he's not the only person I know who feels that way. Again, I couldn't even PAY for him to go to a game with me to watch the FIRST PLACE Orioles in '05, and he followed the '88 team every day.

I wish this franchise would take the time to understand all segments of their fans and not just make assumptions based on the way they think fans SHOULD react.

[howie14]

Name 5 things they've done right over the last 5 years.

You're setting up your usual strawman. Still not playing. BTW, I doubt you even think everything is as black and white as that.

I think the team is awful and think PA is a disaster. I just don't believe that he's totally evil or that the Orioles intentionally do horrble things to hurt the fans. Nestor does, or at least publicly claims to.

If you actually listened to WNST's morning show or read Nestor's commentary you would know that there is absolutely no actual journalism being practiced there, just personal attack. Even if the team does only ONE thing right over five years, WNST will never report it.

Funny, the other media in town are all able to clearly point out how bad this team has been-and it has been very bad- with having to go overboard find trouble even where none existed.

[dslats715]

You're setting up your usual strawman. Still not playing. BTW, I doubt you even think everything is as black and white as that.

I think the team is awful and think PA is a disaster. I just don't believe that he's totally evil or that the Orioles intentionally do horrble things to hurt the fans. Nestor does, or at least publicly claims to.

If you actually listened to WNST's morning show or read Nestor's commentary you would know that there is absolutely no actual journalism being practiced there, just personal attack. Even if the team does only ONE thing right over five years, WNST will never report it.

Funny, the other media in town are all able to clearly point out how bad this team has been-and it has been very bad- with having to go overboard find trouble even where none existed.

If you want to bash WNST thats one thing, but don't toot 1300's horn. Besides Viviano all their "local" hosts are awful. Anita Marks has NO idea about baseball or the orioles.

[NewMarketSean]

You're setting up your usual strawman. Still not playing. BTW, I doubt you even think everything is as black and white as that.

Wow. Nice response. You say I am wrong to say that they have done pretty much everything the wrong way over the last 10 years and when I challenge you, you come back with some straw man crap.

Is it because you can't for the life of you, come up with 5 good things that the Orioles have done in a baseball sense over the last 10 years?

I think the team is awful and think PA is a disaster. I just don't believe that he's totally evil or that the Orioles intentionally do horrble things to hurt the fans. Nestor does, or at least publicly claims to.

I never said they were evil. And I don't think Angelos hates the fans. I do however believe that they are a poorly run business with contempt for the fans at times, ie, don't care about what they think. Not sure what Nestor says about them but I believe that you may be going overboard a little too when it comes to what Nestor says.

If you actually listened to WNST's morning show or read Nestor's commentary you would know that there is absolutely no actual journalism being practiced there, just personal attack. Even if the team does only ONE thing right over five years, WNST will never report it.

I haven't listened to WNST in years. And I don't miss it. I've turned sour on Nestor over the years but I won't go out of my way to bash the man like some people on here will just because he doesn't like the Orioles.

As for journalsim. He's not a journalist. He doesn't have to adhere to those moral codes. He's paid to give his opinion, nothing more. He's had a personal relationship with the Orioles, covered them and got them a lot of attention over the years, and Nestor feels burned by them in return. I am sure its not black and white, but come on... do you think he would say the things he says if he hadn't been treated poorly by the organization?

Its funny. You guys treat Nestor the same way that you criticize others for treating ANgelos. Nestor is not evil.

And do you really think it is unlike the Orioles to turn people away or turn them against the team? Let's see, what have they done in the past? They've run off Mussina, Palmeiro, Jon Miller, Davey Johnson, Nestor, and Sports Guy, and have been criticized by pretty much every source in the business as being a poorly run organization. Excuse me if I side with Nestor over the Orioles when it comes to this.

Funny, the other media in town are all able to clearly point out how bad this team has been-and it has been very bad- with having to go overboard find trouble even where none existed.

Thats because they DO have journalistic morals to adhere to. Nestor can discuss the Orioles on a personal level, which is why he is so venomous towards the team. And I hate to break it to you, but an overwhelming majority of fans feel the way Nestor does.

[66-70-83-??]

I hear where you are coming from, and I can't say I disagree with too much of what you're saying, but I will say that Angelos nixing that trade WAS a good move. He tried to let his baseball guys have control, and they almost made a collosally bad trade. He nixed it because it stunk, and maybe, just maybe, THAT and the fact that they spend A LOT of his money this offseason on more worthless players was the reason for MacPhail's hiring. Maybe PA wants like hell to let his baseball people run the show, but saw just how incompetent Flanny and Duke were and didn't want them to make things even worse.

I agree an owner should not be calling all shots, but when you are about to trade a guy that is a hot commodity for the junk we were receiving from Atlanta, he has EVERY right in my mind as the owner of the team to nix that trade.

So, you are comfortable with PA being the final arbitar of baseball personnel moves ?

Wow.

Then the O's should save a huge chunk of money- lay off all the "middle men" in the player personnel departments. In fact- if PA's baseball judgement is better than the scouts/FO- it is the right thing to do.

If you are OK with PA making any baseball decision- then don't complain when we get 10 more years of losing.

[Dipper9]

So, you are comfortable with PA being the final arbitar of baseball personnel moves ?

Wow.

Then the O's should save a huge chunk of money- lay off all the "middle men" in the player personnel departments. In fact- if PA's baseball judgement is better than the scouts/FO- it is the right thing to do.

If you are OK with PA making any baseball decision- then don't complain when we get 10 more years of losing.

Way to pull one line of my post and rant on me "out of context!"

What I said was maybe that move (the almost trade of Roberts) is what made Angelos realize he had the wrong guys in control!

And yes, to answer your question, I DO think the owner should have SOME say in how his COMPANY is run. Should he have to approve everything? Hell no! But if he has a favorite guy he doesn't want to see traded for spare parts, then he has every right to nix it. Sorry you don't agree, but try to read my entire post instead of a single comment!

[66-70-83-??]

I kinda get the feeling that people here who don't like the protest are using Nestor as the scapegoat. Does it really matter if he's getting some attention out of it. I mean, its a small station and the guy has been fighting to have a successful Baltimore sports talk station for a long time. I understand not wanting to protest a team you love but the arguments here are more about Nestor and less to do with his protest.

I went to the protest last year and it was so much fun. Being in a packed section, cheering for the players like Ravens' fans brought back a lot of memories of meaningful September baseball. There was nothing that was hateful or obnoxious about it.

Some probably are using Nestor as the scapegoat. Others just can't get past their hatred of Nestor and look at it objectively.

I don't understand the timing of the protest. It probably won't have the impact that the last one had. I would wait until next year to see what McPhail does (or is allowed to do by PA).

Nestor/WNST is the only media outlet in town that has been holding PA's feet to the fire. The others (Sun, WBAL, etc...) have been bought/silenced by PA due to business relationships with the Orioles.

If this was Philly, NY, or Boston- several papers/stations would have jumped into the fray years ago and likely effected positive change.

[Dipper9]

Some probably are using Nestor as the scapegoat. Others just can't get past their hatred of Nestor and look at it objectively.

I don't understand the timing of the protest. It probably won't have the impact that the last one had. I would wait until next year to see what McPhail does (or is allowed to do by PA).

Nestor/WNST is the only media outlet in town that has been holding PA's feet to the fire. The others (Sun, WBAL, etc...) have been bought/silenced by PA due to business relationships with the Orioles.

If this was Philly, NY, or Boston- several papers/stations would have jumped into the fray years ago and likely effected positive change.

You need to listen to more than WNST. The FLAGSHIP station of the Orioles, 105.7, has Terry Ford on at nights and he RIPS them the same way he used to do on Nestor's station. You have the menatlity of Nestor and Drew...like those two are the only ones that see the light and the rest of us are just idiots for following such a disfunctional franchise. I got news for them...WE are the true Die Hard Fans...nothing more, nothing less. But bashing Angelos for EVERYTHING is just wrong and bad journalism. He does plenty to get bashed for, no need to make stuff up like they do on WNST.

[66-70-83-??]

Way to pull one line of my post and rant on me "out of context!"

What I said was maybe that move (the almost trade of Roberts) is what made Angelos realize he had the wrong guys in control!

And yes, to answer your question, I DO think the owner should have SOME say in how his COMPANY is run. Should he have to approve everything? Hell no! But if he has a favorite guy he doesn't want to see traded for spare parts, then he has every right to nix it. Sorry you don't agree, but try to read my entire post instead of a single comment!

I took nothing out of context.

You just don't get it- you can't be against the owner making baseball moves on the one hand, but turn around and say "I am glad he nixed THAT trade, though". That destroys the whole premise of the baseball men making baseball decisions. You can't pick and choose which decisions you want the owner to jump in on and nix.

An owner of any business should stick to his level of competence and to his own responsibilities- and delegate the rest to those who he hired.

That is why the Orioles have been so dysfunctional for so long. PA sticks his nose in everyones business and meddles. There are many examples of this.

[Dipper9]

I took nothing out of context.

You just don't get it- you can't be against the owner making baseball moves on the one hand, but turn around and say "I am glad he nixed THAT trade, though". That destroys the whole premise of the baseball men making baseball decisions. You can't pick and choose which decisions you want the owner to jump in on and nix.

An owner of any business should stick to his level of competence and to his own responsibilities- and delegate the rest to those who he hired.

That is why the Orioles have been so dysfunctional for so long. PA sticks his nose in everyones business and meddles. There are many examples of this.

I can't argue with you there, but I think it is unreasonable to expect an owner of any team to completely stay out of all the business. Jerry Jones is heavily involved with the Cowboys (shoot he is on the sidelines with them) but they win so nobody says boo. That is the issue here. The issue is we do not win. If we were winners, there would be no issue with what Angelos does. And the reson we are not winners has alot to do with Angelos, but it has just as much to do with incomptent FO, bad minor league system, and underperfomring major league players. My main problem with WNST is they make EVERYTHING Angelos' fault, and that's just not true.