Warehouse Excuses - Nothing Ever Changes!

[Sports Guy]

For years, many of us hated the direction Thrift was taking us and for years, many said we were wrong.

For years, many of us hated the direction B and F were taking us...For years, many said we were wrong.

For years, many of us hated the direction Duquette and Flanny were taking us...For years, many said we were wrong.

All of those people that said posters like myself were wrong for years, now make fun of those former GMs and realize how terrible they were.

We have the same discussions on this site every single year...Every year, the list of excuses is the exact same, just put in a different context. It simply never changes.

Now, this doesn't mean we aren't on the right path because obviously we are. But just as we are on the verge of something, people want to say we still shouldn't spend money because we are a year away...We should wait to see who flops and who succeeds and then go from there..The problem is, what happens if next year the economy is better and teams are spending like crazy again? or if the FA class isn't good enough? Or if your potential trade chips failed to develop or got hurt?

Then what's the level of excuses?

What is said at that point?

It will just be another round of excuses justifying us waiting and waiting and waiting.

[TinCup]

Two words....well, actually three words....

"Small - market - team" (= Orioles)

'Nuff said.

Mind you, i don't believe the O's should be a small market team, but IMHO they sure are run like one.

[MemorialStadKid]

For years, many of us hated the direction Thrift was taking us and for years, many said we were wrong.

For years, many of us hated the direction B and F were taking us...For years, many said we were wrong.

For years, many of us hated the direction Duquette and Flanny were taking us...For years, many said we were wrong.

All of those people that said posters like myself were wrong for years, now make fun of those former GMs and realize how terrible they were.

We have the same discussions on this site every single year...Every year, the list of excuses is the exact same, just put in a different context. It simply never changes.

Now, this doesn't mean we aren't on the right path because obviously we are. But just as we are on the verge of something, people want to say we still shouldn't spend money because we are a year away...We should wait to see who flops and who succeeds and then go from there..The problem is, what happens if next year the economy is better and teams are spending like crazy again? or if the FA class isn't good enough? Or if your potential trade chips failed to develop or got hurt?

Then what's the level of excuses?

What is said at that point?

It will just be another round of excuses justifying us waiting and waiting and waiting.

Rep to you.

It becomes a matter of popular perception vs. personal opinion.

On this message board, which captures a very small, but very vocal portion of the Orioles fan base, the general vibe seems to be that we should just keep being patient because things will eventually turn around with the youth core we have.

This may be the overall perception on this board, but message boards tend to attract like-minded people who share the same personal opinion.

The popular perception offline of the Baltimore Orioles is very bad. People out in Baltimore and fans spread across the region and country still generally don't believe the team will ever improve and are avoiding OPACY like H1N1.

Those of us that want to see rapid change, or at the VERY least, a far less conservative front office, are often told that we don't "understand" the game and that we "want to waste money" or that the "time isn't right" when some of our ideas aren't bad at all for the sake of the popular perception (changing the perception leads to ticket sales and also can aid in the attraction of premium free agents) of the team.

I don't advocate tossing money to the wind, but the Orioles are a textbook example of a team that destroys its own public relations image with blunder after blunder, season after season of not living up to Angelos' own claim that he wishes to "improve the team."

For some reason, no matter how ridiculous this administration behaves, there will be a cluster of fans on the OH that will defend the FO as if their lives depended on it. No matter how many opportunities we miss in signing good free agents, no matter how many games we lose, no matter how poorly the guys play, no matter how many Orioles fans abandon OPACY there are always those that preach patience and back away from criticizing the FO at all.

This warehouse has dropped every excuse in the book and yet are still given the benefit of the doubt. Sure, we are aware that AM isn't Flanny, Duquette et al. We KNOW THIS.

However, despite some necessary changes in scouting (that I personally feel needs greater work) and infrastructure, the general reaction to the FA market has not changed in the least. We are still signing non-impact players while the Yanks and Red Sox and whomever else go out and make upgrades and improvements across their entire organization.

We are told that there isn't any money, but I refuse to believe that when Angelos hasn't spent much money and I know MASN generates income as well as the revenue sharing money from MLB. Where does this money go?

I don't understand why so many people on the OH continue to give the FO the benefit of the doubt? Show me where they have earned out faith or trust? I haven't really seen a reason to place faith in these guys when they say the same thing every single year and nothing really changes.

We're still in last place if you haven't noticed. No one takes this team seriously anywhere in the game. A few baseball writers here and there speak up about the farm system but the national media practically ignores us (with the exception of the fine work at the MLB Network).

When next season comes to an end, we shall see what new round of excuses they dream up and how many people here stand up to defend them... yet again.

MSK

[wtravlor]

If the goal was to lose more games than the previous era and to drive away fans and torture those that are left by putting an inferior product on the field, I'd say it's going along great as well...

Garrett Atkins, Kevin Millwood and Mike Gonzalez don't exactly convince me that the suffering is over.

We may still be a losing team next season and we aren't going to be much over .500 if we reach it at all.

Wow, so what should he do? Who should we sign? Holliday? If you sign him than take a run at A Gon? Are you ready to trade Tillman and Wieters or Matusz and Jones? Your not getting A Gon for less. So if you do that, our offense is much better but what about pitching? Also long term what about our youngsters? Will we have the money to pay them when its thier turn? These players your signing and trading for will be on the back end of thier careers. Some still under these large contracts, we are not one or two players away. Lets continue to add to our core and than sign a huge free agent when we only need one or two. Or we can do it this way and be the New York Mets of the American League.

[olehippi]

While the premise of this thread is pretty much bullcrap IMO, there is a whiff of an unpleasant aroma that does remain inside the Warehouse. However, since the arrival of MacPhail it's growing fainter and fainter by the day.

Personally, I'm of the opinion that we are now doing things the right way through good drafting, selective trades to build the MiL system, and signing viable FA's to temporarily fill in at various positions until someone long-term replaces them. It takes time to build that MiL system to the point where it will produce solid ML players, and hopefully the rare superstar or two, that can put a team in the position to be a legitimate year-to-year contender.

I have no doubt that when ownership and management believes that signing or trading for those "Tex" or "Frank Robinson" type players will put the team over the top, that they will pay whatever it takes to do it.

While understanding that patience is no longer a virtue for Orioles fans, the simple fact is -- we are not quite there yet, and it might be another year or two before we are. In the meantime, I'm certain MacPhail will continue to do the right thing by strengthening the foundation of the team.

[RShack]

Those of us that want to see rapid change, or at the VERY least, a far less conservative front office, are often told that we don't "understand" the game and that we "want to waste money" or that the "time isn't right" when some of our ideas aren't bad at all for the sake of the popular perception (changing the perception leads to ticket sales and also can aid in the attraction of premium free agents) of the team.

If you want to see rapid change, all you have to do is open your eyes. Of the key roster spots that matter, two thirds of them are, or will soon be, filled by guys who weren't wearing an Orioles uniform just 10 months ago. And, with only a couple exceptions, they're all talented young guys. Anybody who says that we are not in the midst of very rapid change is simply not paying attention to reality...

[JTrea81]

If you want to see rapid change, all you have to do is open your eyes. Of the key roster spots that matter, two thirds of them are, or will soon be, filled by guys who weren't wearing an Orioles uniform just 10 months ago. And, with only a couple exceptions, they're all talented young guys. Anybody who says that we are not in the midst of very rapid change is simply not paying attention to reality...

I don't care about change. I want to see wins, a winning ML product.

I understand that a change in the infrastructure has been made and that's great, but now it's time for a change of philosophy at the ML level.

It's time for this franchise to make winning more of a priority than development in Baltimore. Development is still important, but 12 losing seasons is long enough.

MacPhail has said he's going to make winning more of a priority, but he's yet to prove it thus far with the moves or non-moves he's made.

[El Gordo]

There are times I find Schmuck to be very aptly named. This is one of those times.

He's just catering to the ignorance of his audience. That's how you make the big bucks now a days, as always.:mwahaha:

[DrungoHazewood]

I don't care about change. I want to see wins, a winning ML product.

I understand that a change in the infrastructure has been made and that's great, but now it's time for a change of philosophy at the ML level.

It's time for this franchise to make winning more of a priority than development in Baltimore. Development is still important, but 12 losing seasons is long enough.

MacPhail has said he's going to make winning more of a priority, but he's yet to prove it thus far with the moves or non-moves he's made.

Rebuilding takes what it takes. Fan impatience or not.

[RShack]

I don't care about change. I want to see wins, a winning ML product.

I understand that a change in the infrastructure has been made and that's great, but now it's time for a change of philosophy at the ML level.

It's time for this franchise to make winning more of a priority than development in Baltimore. Development is still important, but 12 losing seasons is long enough.

MacPhail has said he's going to make winning more of a priority, but he's yet to prove it thus far with the moves or non-moves he's made.

Well, then quit whining and give the man a chance. He's going about giving you what you want. The problem is that you think he can do it by going through the drive-thru window at a fast-food place. Well, he can't, nobody can. Nobody ever has. If you knew anything about baseball, you would realize that fixing a franchise properly takes more than just a measly couple years.

[Old#5fan]

Rep to you.

It becomes a matter of popular perception vs. personal opinion.

On this message board, which captures a very small, but very vocal portion of the Orioles fan base, the general vibe seems to be that we should just keep being patient because things will eventually turn around with the youth core we have.

This may be the overall perception on this board, but message boards tend to attract like-minded people who share the same personal opinion.

The popular perception offline of the Baltimore Orioles is very bad. People out in Baltimore and fans spread across the region and country still generally don't believe the team will ever improve and are avoiding OPACY like H1N1.

Those of us that want to see rapid change, or at the VERY least, a far less conservative front office, are often told that we don't "understand" the game and that we "want to waste money" or that the "time isn't right" when some of our ideas aren't bad at all for the sake of the popular perception (changing the perception leads to ticket sales and also can aid in the attraction of premium free agents) of the team.

I don't advocate tossing money to the wind, but the Orioles are a textbook example of a team that destroys its own public relations image with blunder after blunder, season after season of not living up to Angelos' own claim that he wishes to "improve the team."

For some reason, no matter how ridiculous this administration behaves, there will be a cluster of fans on the OH that will defend the FO as if their lives depended on it. No matter how many opportunities we miss in signing good free agents, no matter how many games we lose, no matter how poorly the guys play, no matter how many Orioles fans abandon OPACY there are always those that preach patience and back away from criticizing the FO at all.

This warehouse has dropped every excuse in the book and yet are still given the benefit of the doubt. Sure, we are aware that AM isn't Flanny, Duquette et al. We KNOW THIS.

However, despite some necessary changes in scouting (that I personally feel needs greater work) and infrastructure, the general reaction to the FA market has not changed in the least. We are still signing non-impact players while the Yanks and Red Sox and whomever else go out and make upgrades and improvements across their entire organization.

We are told that there isn't any money, but I refuse to believe that when Angelos hasn't spent much money and I know MASN generates income as well as the revenue sharing money from MLB. Where does this money go?

I don't understand why so many people on the OH continue to give the FO the benefit of the doubt? Show me where they have earned out faith or trust? I haven't really seen a reason to place faith in these guys when they say the same thing every single year and nothing really changes.

We're still in last place if you haven't noticed. No one takes this team seriously anywhere in the game. A few baseball writers here and there speak up about the farm system but the national media practically ignores us (with the exception of the fine work at the MLB Network).

When next season comes to an end, we shall see what new round of excuses they dream up and how many people here stand up to defend them... yet again.

MSK

One of the best and most true posts I have read on this board in my 5 years of posting here.:clap3:

[Old#5fan]

While the premise of this thread is pretty much bullcrap IMO, there is a whiff of an unpleasant aroma that does remain inside the Warehouse. However, since the arrival of MacPhail it's growing fainter and fainter by the day.

Personally, I'm of the opinion that we are now doing things the right way through good drafting, selective trades to build the MiL system, and signing viable FA's to temporarily fill in at various positions until someone long-term replaces them. It takes time to build that MiL system to the point where it will produce solid ML players, and hopefully the rare superstar or two, that can put a team in the position to be a legitimate year-to-year contender.

I have no doubt that when ownership and management believes that signing or trading for those "Tex" or "Frank Robinson" type players will put the team over the top, that they will pay whatever it takes to do it.

While understanding that patience is no longer a virtue for Orioles fans, the simple fact is -- we are not quite there yet, and it might be another year or two before we are. In the meantime, I'm certain MacPhail will continue to do the right thing by strengthening the foundation of the team.

And you know what, your "whiff of bullcrap" that I detect in your post is slightly stronger as I am willing to bet that you thought the previous gm's were doing just fine as well (at least during their first year or two.)

[Old#5fan]

If you want to see rapid change, all you have to do is open your eyes. Of the key roster spots that matter, two thirds of them are, or will soon be, filled by guys who weren't wearing an Orioles uniform just 10 months ago. And, with only a couple exceptions, they're all talented young guys. Anybody who says that we are not in the midst of very rapid change is simply not paying attention to reality...

As JTreas said in his response to you, change isn't what is important unless there is something to show for it and that is WINS. When in heaven's name are we ever going to see more of them? And by more, I mean enough to matter! This wait for the future year after year crap grows older by the minute.

[Old#5fan]

Well, then quit whining and give the man a chance. He's going about giving you what you want. The problem is that you think he can do it by going through the drive-thru window at a fast-food place. Well, he can't, nobody can. Nobody ever has. If you knew anything about baseball, you would realize that fixing a franchise properly takes more than just a measly couple years.

Well who are you to say he can't be doing it faster either? I think this is what some of us see as the problem. He's moving at a snails pace instead of a hare.

[Hank Scorpio]

For years, many of us hated the direction Thrift was taking us and for years, many said we were wrong.

For years, many of us hated the direction B and F were taking us...For years, many said we were wrong.

For years, many of us hated the direction Duquette and Flanny were taking us...For years, many said we were wrong.

All of those people that said posters like myself were wrong for years, now make fun of those former GMs and realize how terrible they were.

We have the same discussions on this site every single year...Every year, the list of excuses is the exact same, just put in a different context. It simply never changes.

Now, this doesn't mean we aren't on the right path because obviously we are. But just as we are on the verge of something, people want to say we still shouldn't spend money because we are a year away...We should wait to see who flops and who succeeds and then go from there..The problem is, what happens if next year the economy is better and teams are spending like crazy again? or if the FA class isn't good enough? Or if your potential trade chips failed to develop or got hurt?

Then what's the level of excuses?

What is said at that point?

It will just be another round of excuses justifying us waiting and waiting and waiting.

Sounds like the only thing that hasn't changed is that you've never been wrong about anything.