I don't blame MGon, I do blame Trembley

[JTrea81]

And can we please stop with the 30 pitches the night before argument? Really, come on. 30 pitches isn't a lot and it shouldn't render a pitcher useless for the next game. But thats another rant for another time...

What about all the pitches he throws in the pen to warm up and then the ones that he throws on the mound before the first batter?

You have to factor those in too.

30 pitches is a ton of pitches for a guy that only pitches one inning and that is coming off of injury and has been shaky at best.

[Leitch]

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/gl.cgi?n1=sherrge01&t=p&year=2009&share=2.67#253-263-sum:pitching_gamelogs

Perspective?

[Miller192]

I'd rather see this team win games. I don't care if MacPhail is above him pulling the strings. If Trembley's style is not conducive to winning games, he needs to change or he needs to be shown the door.

The Baltimore Orioles should not be a training ground for a major league manager.

The Baltimore Orioles have been a training ground for major league managers for the last 5 years.

What makes you think MacPhail knows how to manage a major league baseball team? You don't seem to have much confidence in Andy MacPhail but you have no problem with him "pulling strings"?

[El Gordo]

My conversation with Dave Trembley today was mostly on this subject. It was a private conversation. He had an intelligent debate to my off the cuff remarks about reading his face on the wonderfull High Def MASN broadcast LAST eve. I assure you, Dave is not managing scared when it come to this issue. He is a forthright man. I think his after game comments on the record should speak for themselves on this matter.

I have two questions for you, Donald, you old tease. Is it that DT knows what's with Gonzo, or is it that he doesn't know, or is it that he doesn't know, that he doesn't know? Whoops that's three.:laughlol:

[JTrea81]

The Baltimore Orioles have been a training ground for major league managers for the last 5 years.

And how have we done in that regard? Have we had a winning season?

What makes you think MacPhail knows how to manage a major league baseball team? You don't seem to have much confidence in Andy MacPhail but you have no problem with him "pulling strings"?

My point is I don't care if Trembley has to be forced to change his managing style by Andy MacPhail, Matt Klentak, Peter Angelos, Tom Clancy, whoever...

I want this team to win. Period.

I don't care if it takes getting Earl Weaver out of retirement to manage. They just need to win some freaking games...

[eddie83]

And how have we done in that regard? Have we had a winning season?

My point is I don't care if Trembley has to be forced to change his managing style.

I want this team to win. Period.

I don't care if it takes getting Earl Weaver out of retirement to manage. They just need to win some freaking games...

Can Earl bring back Palmer, McGregor, Flanny, Brooks, Frank, Boog, Eddie and Cal too? No manager would of won with what we have had recently.

[GoldGlove21]

For somebody that threw 30 pitches the night before, that's pretty debatable.

As it was pointed out, Cito didn't use Frasor.

Rivera never threw 30 pitches one night a game the next night right? The closer is supposed to be your best and most reliable reliever because that is what you need them to be. I see mechanics issues when I watch our closer pitch, that has little to do with pitch counts.

But I am all in, lets fire Trembley and not allow our closer to back to back days.

[Hank Scorpio]

95% of the time, virtually nothing can be placed on the manager (in spite of people's demand for satisfaction.)

Today was the exception, IMO.

[El Gordo]

I totally agree with the opening post.

As a manager/coach its their job to put players in positions where they have the best chance to succeed. It's why we armchair quarterback lineup decisions and bullpen moves every day here on ad nauseum. Everyone here thinks they know what it'd take for our players to be successful.

An example is that I think Nick should be hitting 2nd. Why? His stats bear it out. Look at his career splits and Nick has performed better hitting in the two hole. Therefore, I believe Nick's best chance to succeed as a hitter would come batting 2nd.

Right now, Mike Gonzalez is not a good pitcher. I think we can all agree to that. He has not been successful in two of the opportunities he's had to convert a save and he damn near blew the third. He can't locate anything. His mechanics were funky to begin with and IMO that makes it easier for things to get out of wack.

It's Dave Trembley's job as a manager to be able to put Gonzalez in positions to where he can be successful and right now that is clearly not closing games. Some of you in here are saying "Well he's using him in the role that they acquired him for!!!" And that's true. But he's failing miserably in that role.

What would happen if you failed miserably at your job? You'd might get fired. Or you might have to go take some training courses...or shadow someone who has been on the job a bit longer than you have.

Right now, Gonzalez isn't blowing games due to bad luck...he's blowing games due to extremely poor pitching and that's not a point anyone could really deny.

Trembley needs to put him in a position where he can be successful. As pointed out above, he was hurt in the spring and he struggled in the spring, too. That has carried over into the season so these developments shouldn't be a surprise to anyone.

So what's this mean? Not sure, but I don't see why anyone should be a fan of "Hey, he's using him in the role they signed him for! Let's keep giving him opportunities!" when he's clearly not getting the job done.

Smashing your head against a wall in hopes of breaking through just isn't a smart idea. Either he tries setting up games or goes to the minors. IMO, Gonzalez's problem is so screwed that the remedy isn't just trotting him out there time and time again in hopes that something clicks.

Basically Gonzo needs to be able to close three games in a row. The next game, DT has the opportunity to sit him without there being a broohaha about Gonzo no longer being the closer. If he wants to avoid using him in save situations where he is available, then he has to discuss it with AM first IMO. I just don't think he has the leeway to do that on his own.

[Miller192]

And how have we done in that regard? Have we had a winning season?

I'm not defending that approach, I'm just stating it's been that way for a while. Didn't you start a "Getting to know Dave Jauss" thread once? What team was he the manager for?

My point is I don't care if Trembley has to be forced to change his managing style by Andy MacPhail, Matt Klentak, Peter Angelos, Tom Clancy, whoever...

I want this team to win. Period.

I don't care if it takes getting Earl Weaver out of retirement to manage. They just need to win some freaking games...

We all want the team to win. I'd rather have Trembley replaced before I would have him become something he isn't.

[weams]

I have two questions for you, Donald, you old tease. Is it that DT knows what's with Gonzo, or is it that he doesn't know, or is it that he doesn't know, that he doesn't know? Whoops that's three.:laughlol:

He knows what he knows.

He knows that MGon is a major league reliever, with no apparent injury, with an excellent record: And a contract to close for this team to boot.

He also knows that it is his job to figure out how to win, given that Gonzalez is an ineffective closer at this point.

[El Gordo]

He knows what he knows.

He knows that MGon is a major league reliever, with no apparent injury, with an excellent record: And a contract to close for this team to boot.

He also knows that it is his job to figure out how to win, given that Gonzalez is an ineffective closer at this point.

Sounds like he has him self in a quandary. Does he know that?

[weams]

Sounds like he has him self in a quandary. Does he know that?

He knows...

[Glenn Gulliver Fan]

When will we all agree Trembley is a below average manager?

He is either below average or people above him are constantly telling him what he can and can't do and THEY are making poor decisions from lineups to fielding positions to pitching changes.

I want a manager with balls. I want an Earl Weaver. Trembley makes me wish Ozzie Guillen was our manager.

I would love a list of how Trembley is impressive.

[El Gordo]

He knows...

Hopefully. the offense will score some runs and the SP will be dominant the next few games and that will give Gonzo some time to get his head straight. That's where I think the problem lies.