Angels and Orioles have discussed Tejada

[delaware bird]

Roberts is no SS (There's a reason he was switched to 2B). And Kendrick isn't supposed to be all that defensively at 2B. That would most likely be a lot a worse up the middle defense than we have now. Not pitching friendly.

If memory serves me correctly, Roberts was a shortstop at the University of South Carolina. That's no hack school. He obviously wasn't such a horrible shortstop.

He certainly is athletic enough to play shortstop. It is easier to ask a 2B to move to ss than to ask a 2B to move to OF. As a rookie, Kendrick needs some coddling. 2B would be his spot on my team, if acquired. I'd deal with the "worse up the middle defense".

It might be a judgement call, but I think Howie Kendrick will turn out to be more productive offensively than Brandon Wood. Wood hits more HR, but strikes out about twice as much. Plus Kendick is just further along the way as a player (triple A as opposed to double A).

Play hardball and don't budge. They want Tejada?

Santana, Kendick, Adenhart

I'd throw in Conine (as mentioned before), but no need to expand the trade beyond that.

[Sports Guy]

Every great start by Santana makes it more and more unlikely he gets dealt IMO.

I would love to know what the Angels were/are offering for Tejada.

I think by asking for Shields and Santana we may be taking too much away from their ML team.

We should take out Shields and ask for Aybar.

See if they go for that.

Aybar is more important to us anyway...Although i am sure the Orioles think Fahey is better.

[BritFan]

Every great start by Santana makes it more and more unlikely he gets dealt IMO.

I would love to know what the Angels were/are offering for Tejada.

I think by asking for Shields and Santana we may be taking too much away from their ML team.

We should take out Shields and ask for Aybar.

See if they go for that.

Aybar is more important to us anyway...Although i am sure the Orioles think Fahey is better.

Did you just subtly insult Fahey?

Run and hide SG, run and hide....

[davearm]

Abreu isn't exactly Tejada either.

The level of misinformation/homerism in this thread is truly shocking.

Folks, realize that Bobby Abreu is a much better hitter than Miguel Tejada. He just is, and there's no way to argue otherwise.

Here are Tejada's OPS+ figures since he became a full-time regular in 1999:

91

112

112

122

117

126

133

----

112 career OPS+

Here are Abreu's OPS+ figures, 1999-2005:

149

140

141

155

134

149

123

----

138 career OPS+

Not even close.

Let's look at RC/27 -- a measure of how many runs per 27 outs a team comprised of 9 identical players would score.

Tejada, 1999-2005:

4.54

5.94

5.23

6.46

5.64

6.9

6.46

-----

5.62 career RC/27

Abreu, 1999-2005:

9.3

8.61

7.55

7.81

6.92

8.66

6.87

-----

7.71

9 Abreus score over 2 runs a game more than 9 Tejadas.

And just for good measure, Abreu has stolen 241 bases, to Tejada's 58.

So let's just stop with this "Abreu is a step down from Tejada" nonsense. The exact opposite is true.

[rp0806]

So let's just stop with this "Abreu is a step down from Tejada" nonsense. The exact opposite is true.

There's no question that Abreu is a better hitter than Tejada but (a) you're comparing a RF to a SS, (b) Tejada is 2 years younger, and © Tejada's contract is more reasonable. So their valuable is comparable.

[66-70-83-??]

For the Los Angeles/Anaheim/California Angels- Tejada is a more valuable player because Stoneman would rather acquire a big bat under contract for a few years, rather than give up some young prospects for a rental.

[Mark Carver]

For the Los Angeles/Anaheim/California Angels- Tejada is a more valuable player because Stoneman would rather acquire a big bat under contract for a few years, rather than give up some young prospects for a rental.

Abreu is signed through 2007 @$15m and a club option for 2008 @ $16m

[davearm]

There's no question that Abreu is a better hitter than Tejada but (a) you're comparing a RF to a SS, (b) Tejada is 2 years younger, and © Tejada's contract is more reasonable. So their valuable is comparable.

Define "reasonable".

Abreu's contract is up in either 1.5 or 2.5 years. Tejada's runs the next 3.5 years.

The total $$$ remaining on Tejada's is greater.

It's not difficult to imagine that given the particulars, Abreu's contract is viewed by the Angels as more appealing.

And the Angels already have a SS... two, in fact. So the SS part of Tejada's value is negligible for the Angels.

The bottom line is that the O's are driving a much harder bargain than the Phils seem to be.

[davearm]

For the Los Angeles/Anaheim/California Angels- Tejada is a more valuable player because Stoneman would rather acquire a big bat under contract for a few years, rather than give up some young prospects for a rental.

Well on one end of the spectrum, Stoneman can get a guy like Lee or Soriano for half a year.

On the other end, he can get Tejada for 3.5 years.

And in the middle is Abreu, at 1.5 years with an option for an additional year.

[Moose Milligan]

If you had a nickel for every major college SS who was switched to 2B because they weren't deemed ML quality SS's, you'd be pretty rich. Having a sub-par LF is going to hurt you a lot less than a subpar SS. I think you have a good chance of being right on Kendrick over Wood. I will be shocked if Santana is dealt. One full year of ML service after this year. His stuff is top of the charts. He's now 11-3/ 3.88 ERA. He's 23 yo. The Angels would be nuts to deal him and I don't think they're nuts. They can get Soriano for cheaper and then either re-sign him or go after someone like Carlos Lee next year. Unfortunately for the O's, the Angels seem like the best trade partner for a Tejada trade but the Angels don't have pay the O's prices if they don't want to. You can give the Angels a take it or leave it deal. Unfortunately, we aren't the only game in town. People talk as if we have the Angels over a barrel. It ain't so.

Bingo. Many people on here seem to act like we don't realize this.

[thriftyorioles]

I'll get ROASTED for this, but I'm not sure I'd be able to turn down a Tejada for Santana deal straight up. And I say this not to knock Tejada...

I'm totally sold on Santana. His numbers and year have gone eerily similar to Bedard's; both with fantastic splits, but a few bad 5+ run outings (4 each, skewing some stats). Plus, he's 23 with a playoff resume.

I, honestly, believe that we could have the best 1-2 punch in the AL East by this time next year. AND, I think we'd win more games right now if we swapped him for Tejada.

I won't roast you at all. I have an eery felling that Tejada will have ZERO trade value by end of year.

[TyCobb]

I would most definately do a Santana and Wood for Tejada deal. No need for shields. I think it is a fair deal for all parties. Angels get a big bat to play 3rd base and the O's get a potential great SS in a couple of years and an great pitcher.

[rp0806]

Define "reasonable".

Abreu's contract is up in either 1.5 or 2.5 years. Tejada's runs the next 3.5 years.

The total $$$ remaining on Tejada's is greater.

It's not difficult to imagine that given the particulars, Abreu's contract is viewed by the Angels as more appealing.

And the Angels already have a SS... two, in fact. So the SS part of Tejada's value is negligible for the Angels.

The bottom line is that the O's are driving a much harder bargain than the Phils seem to be.

Re the SS/RF comparison, I was referring more to their overall value as players, not their specific value to the Angels -- i.e., their offensive #s should be adjusted for position. In any event, it's not clear to me that Abreu has much more value than Tejada to the Angels. The Angels are already getting good offense from LF (Rivera) and RF (Guerrero), but almost nothing from 3B. If Tejada or Cabrera moves there they've improved the team significantly.

[davearm]

Dave not sure if you read a lot of what I post here but I really don't think that classifying me as a "homer" is accurate.

As far as Tejada and Abreu are concerned, let me explain my stance. I said that Tejada would be a better fit for the Angels than Abreu and I stand by that.

Tejada is 2 years younger than Abreu, is signed for 1 more year than Abreu at a cheaper price than Abreu. Tejada is more of an impact player than Abreu. Abreu obviously has an incredible OBP but his power numbers are declining big time. Also look at the lineup that Abreu has been hitting in and the lineup that Tejada has been in.

If you polled 30 GM's and asked them if they were going to start a team, what player would you start it with, Abreu or Tejada, I guarantee you at least 28 of them would pick Tejada. Plain and simple.

Now, obviously, if the Angels had 2 deals on the table...Mathis and McPherson for Abreu or Santana, Kendrick, and Shields for Tejada, they would choose McPherson and Mathis for Abreu as Santana and Shields are helping out the ML team now.

But if we are all homers for thinking that Tejada is better than Abreu than there must be a heck of a lot of O's fans.

The assertions I have bolded above, you have not offered much support for.

2 years age difference... contract particulars... declining power numbers (Tejada's SLG is down for the third straight year too)... surrounding lineup... that's all weak.

Are we just supposed to take your word for it when you make these guarantees? Because in the absence of any compelling evidence, it seems like you're either misinformed, or biased.

[rp0806]

Also, I can't imagine the Phillies would accept McPherson and Mathis for Abreu unless they're desperate to dump Abreu's contract. McPherson has almost no value at this point, and Mathis is an ok but not great prospect.