That's it... time to send Adam to Norfolk

[OK_Os_Fan]

Fine. Idiot.

Ahh the jewel of self reflection.

Glad to see you are coming around

[wildcard]

Again. I did not say that it is the majority of Hangouters that have a problem. But I am saying that I have never heard ANYONE here suggest that Nolan or Weiters are lazy or have ego problems. Only Jones.

Sometimes if you look for something you find it whether it is there or not. Sounds like you are looking for a particular behavior on this board and finding it because of your perspective. Personnally I have not seen it here.

Over the weekend I posted who the core players were for the O's of the future. The comments I got back were why did I included Reimold? Am I sure he belongs? Nothing about Adam.

Adam has had 3 years of major league experience. He has been a All-Star and GG winner. O's fan expectations are high for such a player. Up until recently Adam has not been living up to some expectations. He has said in the press that he is not living up to his own expectations. He is starting to hit. If he keeps it up fans will be making alot of supportive comments. That is just the way baseball is. Do good things and people support you. Go through bad times and people question you.

Markakis is getting the same kind of comments for his lack of power. Race has zero to do with it.

[JackO]

Ahh the jewel of self reflection.

Glad to see you are coming around

I am supposing here that the joke went over the heads of a few of the slower readers here.

I was called a clown. I said that name calling was against the rules. The poster to whom I was responding said name calling was ok if the shoe fits and proceeded to call me a racist. So. I called him an idiot. It seemed the right sized shoe.

[SilentJames]

Sometimes if you look for something you find it whether it is there or not. Sounds like you are looking for a particular behavior on this board and finding it because of your perspective. Personnally I have not seen it here.

Over the weekend I posted who the core players were for the O's of the future. The comments I got back were why did I included Reimold? Am I sure he belongs? Nothing about Adam.

Adam has had 3 years of major league experience. He has been a All-Star and GG winner. O's fan expectations are high for such a player. Up until recently Adam has not been living up to some expectations. He has said in the press that he is not living up to his own expectations. He is starting to hit. If he keeps it up fans will be making alot of supportive comments. That is just the way baseball is. Do good things and people support you. Go through bad times and people question you.

Markakis is getting the same kind of comments for his lack of power. Race has zero to do with it.

To say Jones expectations were higher than Matt "switch-hitting JESUS" Wieters is a bit much. I mean entire websites have been devoted to Wieters.

The expectations were just as high for all these players.

[ScottieBaseball]

Ahh the jewel of self reflection.

Glad to see you are coming around

I am supposing here that the joke went over the heads of a few of the slower readers here.

I was called a clown. I said that name calling was against the rules. The poster to whom I was responding said name calling was ok if the shoe fits and proceeded to call me a racist. So. I called him an idiot. It seemed the right sized shoe.

Get back to talking baseball or take a hike. Thanks!

[JackO]

Sometimes if you look for something you find it whether it is there or not. Sounds like you are looking for a particular behavior on this board and finding it because of your perspective. Personnally I have not seen it here.

Over the weekend I posted who the core players were for the O's of the future. The comments I got back were why did I included Reimold? Am I sure he belongs? Nothing about Adam.

Adam has had 3 years of major league experience. He has been a All-Star and GG winner. O's fan expectations are high for such a player. Up until recently Adam has not been living up to some expectations. He has said in the press that he is not living up to his own expectations. He is starting to hit. If he keeps it up fans will be making alot of supportive comments. That is just the way baseball is. Do good things and people support you. Go through bad times and people question you.

Markakis is getting the same kind of comments for his lack of power. Race has zero to do with it.

This is the last I will post on this subject. But I will let someone else do the talking.

Here is a column by Mike Preston about Eddie Murray on the eve of Eddie Murray's induction into the Hall of Fame.

If you can make the case that the O's fan base has completely changed in 20 years, and that there is no residue from the fan base that booed Eddie out of town, hurled racial slurs at him and his family and used much of the same criticism of Eddie that some are using of Adam Jones now, then I will stand corrected.

Again. I want to reiterate. I am not calling the Hangout racist and I am not saying that Adam Jones does not have a lot to work on. I am saying that the type of criticism levied at Jones by some portions of a fan base with a historically racist segment smacks of some of the ugliness that we saw with Murray.

But I will let Preston's article speak for itself. I will only excerpt parts of it, but I urge you to read the whole thing. And, yes. Mike Preston is black. But this story was edited and vetted by the Baltimore Sun's staff, which is anything but monolithic.

WHEN Eddie Murray is inducted into the Hall of Fame today, Major League Baseball will show an appreciation of the superstar that he didn't receive as a player, either nationally or in Baltimore.

Even though Murray was one of the sport's best clutch hitters and switch-hitters, and the best hitter to wear an Orioles uniform, his departure from Baltimore in 1988 was one of the lowest moments in this city's sports history, as sad as the Colts leaving for Indianapolis, and as embarrassing as Colts officials allowing quarterback John Unitas to wear a San Diego Chargers uniform.

Murray's critics will say that injuries, mistrust of the media and his moody personality contributed to his leaving Baltimore, but Murray was also run out of town by racism, some blatant, some discreet.

Was some criticism of Murray warranted? Absolutely. But no one deserves to have racial slurs hurled at him, which Murray heard at home games. Could he hold a grudge? Yes, almost as long as the media. Did he have a charming personality? No, but he wasn't a cancer in the locker room. His teammates admired his leadership.

Murray wasn't perfect, but he didn't warrant the abuse that he received in the mid 1980s. Leaders of the African-American community will never forget how Murray was treated.

"How can a ballplayer who consistently produced as a superstar, who hit a record number of home runs and RBIs, who could carry a team on his back when his bat was hot for 17 games, who was the greatest clutch hitter in baseball, get run out of town by predominantly white fans?" asked prominent Baltimore attorney Billy Murphy Jr.

"No black baseball fans wanted him to leave," Murphy said. "No black baseball fans expressed outrage at his demeanor. No black baseball fans expressed outrage at his unwillingness to run out a meaningless ground ball. But they will express gratitude when he goes into the Hall of Fame. This city owes a lot to Eddie Murray.

"How many more pennants did we lose when we lost him? How many more World Series did we lose over such trivial matters as a man's personality? This goes to show that as people, we have to strive to get over the racial barriers, if not for people like Eddie Murray, for the sake of society."

Baltimore wasn't and still may not be ready for an African-American superstar with Murray's personality. Baltimore has always been a blue-collar town. Fans here love the Charlie Hustle, All-American type. They want their heroes to be accessible, and they want them to smile all the time.

Murray wasn't the smiling Negro type. He didn't dance or crack jokes. He didn't wear flashy suits or have an engaging personality like Deion Sanders.

And before you read this next segment. Keep in mind. Edited and vetted by the Baltimore Sun:

That time came for Murray after an August 1986 news conference in which then-owner Edward Bennett Williams said Murray needed to stay in better shape and produce more, which could easily be interpreted as Williams calling Murray lazy.

Then his critics started suggesting Murray needed glasses. He didn't hustle enough. He didn't slide enough. Back then, it was so Baltimore.

It was all kind of ironic because Murray was actually the team's iron man before Cal Ripken, and Ripken used Murray's work ethic as the model. Ripken could have been just as easy a target as Murray because they were the top two players on a team that had gone south after a world championship in 1983.

But Ripken was everything Murray wasn't. He was accessible. He was local. He had the bloodlines. He had the golden smile. He drank milk.

And he was white.

Untouchable.

That's all I'll say, so as not to risk permanent censure. I've already lost half of my rep points.

[GoldGlove21]

This is the last I will post on this subject. But I will let someone else do the talking.

Here is a column by Mike Preston about Eddie Murray on the eve of Eddie Murray's induction into the Hall of Fame.

If you can tell me that the O's fan base has completely changed in 20 year, and that there is no residue from the fan base that booed Eddie out of town, hurled racial slurs at him and his family and used a lot of the same criticism of Eddie that some are using of Adam Jones now, then I will stand corrected.

Again. I want to reiterate. I am not calling the Hangout racist and I am not saying that Adam Jones does not have a lot to work on. I am saying that the type of criticism levied at Jones by some portions of a fan base with a historically racist segment smacks of some of the ugliness that we saw with Murray.

But I will let Preston's article speak for itself. I will only excerpt parts of it, but I urge you to read the whole thing. And, yes. Mike Preston is black. But this story was edited and vetted by the Baltimore Sun's staff, which is anything but monolithic.

And before you read this next segment. Keep in mind. Edited and vetted by the Baltimore Sun:

That's all I'll say, so as not to risk permanent censure. I've already lost half of my rep points.

No offense to Eddie, who recorded 3000 hits, but Frank Robinson was probably the better hitter although I will say that Eddie was the best hitter ever to come from the Orioles organization.

20 years ago the world was a lot more racist than it is today. The role of a woman was also as a cook and homemaker. This ideology was present everywhere, not just in Baltimore. Not everyone was a big fan of Willie Mays or Hank Aaron either. I am sorry Eddie was treated poorly in Baltimore at times, but Eddie loved the fans. He hated the media and how they portrayed him.

There is no comparison between Eddie Murray and Adam Jones, except for maybe in the talent arena. Both had great potential, I hope Adam allows his to be on full display in the future.

[SilentJames]

No offense to Eddie, who recorded 3000 hits, but Frank Robinson was probably the better hitter although I will say that Eddie was the best hitter ever to come from the Orioles organization.

20 years ago the world was a lot more racist than it is today. The role of a woman was also as a cook and homemaker. This ideology was present everywhere, not just in Baltimore. Not everyone was a big fan of Willie Mays or Hank Aaron either. I am sorry Eddie was treated poorly in Baltimore at times, but Eddie loved the fans. He hated the media and how they portrayed him.

There is no comparison between Eddie Murray and Adam Jones, except for maybe in the talent arena. Both had great potential, I hope Adam allows his to be on full display in the future.

If you think the world is less racist today, you don't spend a lot of time on the Baltimore Sun message boards.

[Old#5fan]

I will go on record as saying that Adam Jones is the least of the worries on this team.

[JackO]

If you think the world is less racist today, you don't spend a lot of time on the Baltimore Sun message boards.

Or Youtube comments for that matter... I would say it takes on average 5 messages for any Youtube comment section to devolve into some sort of racism or anti-Semitism. Sorry. Last comment from me.