Markakis speaks out

[JTrea81]

I noticed that, too - great point. If Crowley really is having zero effect on their approach to at-bats, then I would say that reflects poorly on Crow.

And I wouldn't absolve Crowley either. He shouldn't just sit back and let these guys fail.

And if his message isn't working or the way he relates with players isn't working, then maybe a new hitting coach could try a different way to reach players.

The solution is probably a combination of holding the players more accountable and getting a new hitting coach to send a different message.

[JTrea81]

Frobby asked what Wieters would have to do to get sent down.

My answer is this...If he is refusing to listen to coaches and not doing what he needs to do to succeed, I send him down...and not only do I send him down, but I may send him down to Delmarva or something like that.

Really open his eyes and make it obvious that aren't happy with him.

That being said, i don't think Wieters is that type of player.

I forget where it was mentioned but I think before one of the games it was said that Wieters was doing extra work with Crowley.

I think and I hope he isn't one of the guys that Nick is talking about.

[O-The-Memories]

That's not what he was saying though. He's saying that having a 40 HR guy in the lineup would be great but you also need guys that can get on base and aren't going up to the plate trying to hit a HR every time.

I look at his quote differently. To me it looks like he's saying "look, we need a 40 HR threat as protection in the lineup, BUT we also need guys to have an approach of some sort at the plate".

I like Markakis a lot, and I think some posters think I have it out for him. I just honestly thought that he was going to be a star, and he's turning out just to be a solid player instead.

[turtlebowl]

I think it's interesting that Markakis mentions the need for a 40 HR guy in the lineup, and then also mentions that you don't need guys that can hit a lot of HR's.

Nick has lost so much of his power this season and looks frail to be honest. We don't even have a leader who has an opinion that means anything. When you have three HR's and look like a slap hitter most of the time I don't think you have a lot of room to criticize others. I know Nick is patient, but times like last night show that he's TOO patient sometimes as well.

Markakis is not a home run hitter. At times he has tried to become one and his #'s fall off drastically. I believe he will end up being a 20 HR guy most years. If he had protection behind him he would see better pitches and power numbers would be better this year.

I think his frustration is having guys that do not work the count, and try to get on base. We seem to have a bunch of guys that swing hard at the thrown ball hoping that the pitch is a fastball and they can hit a homer. How frustrating must it be for him to watch Patterson, Izturis, Jones, and many others never work the count. You can't sustain a rally unless guy's are trying to get on base.

I think the whole mentality of how the organization develops hitters needs to change. It's ok to have a Tejada that is a veteran that you aren't going to change but the younger guys in the system should not be promoted until they can get on base with a certain regularity.

Nick is getting tired of losing. He feels he is doing his part and then see's how most others are approaching their at bats and he is frustrated.

I do believe he is calling out Jones because of the lack of pitch recognition, his over swinging. I have a perceived attitude of Jones that he is going to do things his way. I get this because of his positioning in the outfield that he balked at when it was suggested he play deeper, so I wonder if he is the same with his offensive approach.

Good for Nick!

[24fps]

They had one of those back in April I think. It didn't do them much good.

As for the players who won't listen to coaching - bench them, discipline them. Hold them accountable for their performance.

If they have no clue what they are doing up there, don't let them go up there.

Force them to change and if they don't - they don't play.

This team really needs sombody who is going to kick them in the ass and make players miserable if they dog it or want to do their own thing.

The payroll for the players is somewhere in the neighborhood of 25 times higher than that of the coaches for easily understood reasons. In practical terms this means there are easily reached limits to taking the dictatorial route when an investment approaching nine figures is expected to play the role of the serfs.

I'm not saying coaches are or should be powerless, but effective leadership in this era of baseball needs to defined in terms other than the ones you've laid out.

[Sports Guy]

I forget where it was mentioned but I think before one of the games it was said that Wieters was doing extra work with Crowley.

I think and I hope he isn't one of the guys that Nick is talking about.

Well, Wieters certainly goes up there a lot with no clue.

[Bradysburns]

This statement is where I 100% disagree with the line of thinking of some posters.

Yes, the hitting coach is supposed to help you out with an approach at the plate. And most hitting coaches do work with you at this ALL the time if you ask for the help. You guys have to keep in mind, the hitting coach is like Santa Claus at a party and every kid is trying to get a gift from him. He's a busy dude, so as a player you need to be proactive and get with him and try and work out your mechanics, approach, video etc. to go over your approach.

So yes, the hitting coach does help with this aspect of hitting. But it's up to the individual to execute the plan. Guys I know in baseball have nothing but nice things to say about Crowley when you ask them about him. He's a very good hitting coach. But a very good hitting coach can't put perfume on a turd and expect it to smell nice.

Has anyone taken the time out of pissing and moaning and thought that it might not be the hitting coach, it just might be the talent that O's are brining in??????

So TC is in an enviable position. Literally, it doesn't matter how badly your lineup hits. Year after year... day after day... Because in the end, hey, it's not TC's fault, right? (He's not responsible for plate approach, just swing mechanics, yes?)

It ain't AM's fault? It's not DT's fault. And it's not Jim Palmer's fault. No, as we're finding out now... It's Matt Wieters' fault! YES! Matt Wieters is the reason our hitting sucks so badly! Not Terry Crowley, the hitting coach. Not AM, the general manager. And not Juan Samuel, who is only working with what he's been handed (he wasn't handed this lineup by AM, by the way... It was FATE and bad luck... because AM is beyond reproach).

Glad we cleared that up...

[Dipper9]

I look at his quote differently. To me it looks like he's saying "look, we need a 40 HR threat as protection in the lineup, BUT we also need guys to have an approach of some sort at the plate".

I like Markakis a lot, and I think some posters think I have it out for him. I just honestly thought that he was going to be a star, and he's turning out just to be a solid player instead.

My wife and I were discussing the Birds last night. If you take one of Jones, Wieters, Kakes, etc, and put them on the Yankees, they would be playing spectacular ball and would be meeting all expectations. However, like Huff Daddy said, when you have all of these guys on one team and no experienced core around them to lead them, that is when disaster strikes. MacPhail has set these young men up to fail, and in that, he is succeeding!

[Dipper9]

So TC is in an enviable position. Literally, it doesn't matter how badly your lineup hits. Year after year... day after day... Because in the end, hey, it's not TC's fault, right? (He's not responsible for plate approach, just swing mechanics, yes?)

It ain't AM's fault? It's not DT's fault. And it's not Jim Palmer's fault. No, as we're finding out now... It's Matt Wieters' fault! YES! Matt Wieters is the reason our hitting sucks so badly! Not Terry Crowley, the hitting coach. Not AM, the general manager. And not Juan Samuel, who is only working with what he's been handed (he wasn't handed this lineup by AM, by the way... It was FATE and bad luck... because AM is beyond reproach).

Glad we cleared that up...

If you're not gonna give Crowley credit for our hitting over the past two years, then how can he be to blame for the lack of hitting now? :scratchchinhmm:

[tvz1997]

That being said, i don't think Wieters is that type of player.

I didn't think so either, but you never know how people are going to respond to failure. Matt batted around .360 and slugged around .600 EVERY year in college and he had almost the same numbers at Bowie. When he finally hit the skids briefly in AAA, he went on a pretty good run and was promoted without really tearing the cover off the ball. Last year in the bigs, he slumped at the outset and again went on a nice little run without tearing the cover off of the ball. There hasn't even been a nice little run this year.

Pitchers haven't been scared of him for two years and I'm sure he isn't used to that.

[JTrea81]

In the same vein as putting some fire into the clubhouse, this is why I think we really need to get a player like Fielder.

Somebody who is a gamer and won't take crap from anybody. I bet he'd kick a few butts in that clubhouse.

Not to mention he's the 40 HR threat in the lineup that we are missing, so his production should garner him some respect alone.

[Stotle]

I watched the game yesterday man, and Lincecum is indeed one of the best pitchers in baseball.

He didn't look like it yesterday though. He didn't have his best stuff, his velocity was down from what I've seen before, and he still struck out a lot of our hitters. That means our overall approach is terrible, and Markakis isn't immune from criticism. He's not the biggest problem on the team, but he's not having a good season either. I've seen Nick watch too many hittable pitches and then strike out while taking the bat off his shoulders one time.

His change-up was dirty. Seemed like he got a lot of swings-and-misses on that pitch.

[NewMarketSean]

Who could he be talking about?

My guess is Wieters and Jones.

Wieters probably does deserve some of it right now, but Jones is working things out and has improved.

Every other player in the line-up is who he is and isn't going to change or improve much from where they are right now. I am happy Nick spoke up, but I am also kind of puzzled by who is singling out.

[cindyluvsbrady]

Maybe Nick is, you know, going to assume a leadership role on this team. He's one of the longest-tenured guys, has been around a little while, and certainly knows what he's doing and has the game to back it up, even if he's not been recognized as an AS or any such thing yet. Good for him, you know? :clap3:

I agree with you!

I love NICK M:002_sdrool:

[soxhotcorner14]

So TC is in an enviable position. Literally, it doesn't matter how badly your lineup hits. Year after year... day after day... Because in the end, hey, it's not TC's fault, right? (He's not responsible for plate approach, just swing mechanics, yes?)

It ain't AM's fault? It's not DT's fault. And it's not Jim Palmer's fault. No, as we're finding out now... It's Matt Wieters' fault! YES! Matt Wieters is the reason our hitting sucks so badly! Not Terry Crowley, the hitting coach. Not AM, the general manager. And not Juan Samuel, who is only working with what he's been handed (he wasn't handed this lineup by AM, by the way... It was FATE and bad luck... because AM is beyond reproach).

Glad we cleared that up...

Talk about totally missing the point.

I'll give you the cliff notes... The hitting coach can prepare you to hit.. but it's up to the hitter to execute the plan. Period.

Everyone is always looking for a fall guy to blame when things don't go well. Sometimes it's not as simple as just pointing the finger.. but to simply look in the mirror.