Tillman/Britton or vet innings eater

[olehippi]

Let Tillman and Britton battle it out for the #5 slot and put the other in the BP or starting in Norfolk. We already have a 200+ innings eater in Guthrie, and a budding one in Matusz.

[backwardsk]

I went with Tillman/Britton too. Only problem is if that backfires, they have to scramble to find a 5th starter...who'd they get to fill in? A Waters type?

IMO, 2011 is going to be about the youth again. Give that spot to someone with a ceiling.

I'm pretty sure they'll have in house options better than Waters. I'd be comfortable with Guthrie, Matusz, Bergesen, Arrieta, and Tillman with Britton coming up when he's ready. Now I don't expect them to go throughout the season with only 6 starters, but I'd turn to Hernandez, Berken, VanderHurk, or even Simon if you need emergency starters. Also, in many cases they'll be options (not ideal) who are unsigned in March and April. I'd rather do that, than go with a Millwood type. And I'm in the camp that rates the Millwood/Ray trade favorably.

[Frobby]

I'm very torn here. If everyone's healthy, I'm very satsified with what we have. But if we lose someone at the top of the rotation, that could be a huge blow without more depth.

[MikeAD]

That's pretty inefficient, isn't it? You want Harden so he will break down and open up a spot? :scratchchinhmm:

Well no, you get him, hope that hes healthy, but at the very least hes eating innings in the beginning (and being effective) while Tillman and/or Britton are getting time in AAA.

[MikeAD]

I voted for a Veteran. If you can't get Lee or one of the few other TOR guys, then bring in the veteran. It never hurts to have depth and if they hang around and do well you can move them at the deadline and get back a prospect (even if its a low-end prospect).

I don't see how it hurts if its a reasonable contract.

[Sports Guy]

I'm very torn here. If everyone's healthy, I'm very satsified with what we have. But if we lose someone at the top of the rotation, that could be a huge blow without more depth.

People keep saying you can't have too much pitching. Ok, that may be true on some levels. But its not always true.

There was a suggestion to sign 2 vets and send down Arrieta? I mean, seriously? What does that accomplish?

What more do guys like Tillman and Arrieta have to prove in AAA?

At what point do you get a big time extended look at Tillman?

I see no reason to bring in some vet starter to eat innings. Unless we have a bunch of injuries, we should have 3 190+ IP guys and Arrieta could go 170+ IP.

Now, we know injuries will occur. But to sign a vet because of that, and thus send down Tillman, makes zero sense to me.

As I said before, go out and sign a few guys like David Pauley for AAA...Guys that can step in for 4-8 starts if needs be. You also have DH, Berken, VDH and of course, Britton.

I think there is enough depth for us to get by.

Plus, I would guess there would be some underachieving starter that could be had in a salary dump during the season if needs be.

[QBsILLEST1]

Tillman/Britton is the route I go. Both Bergy and Matusz will be capable innings eaters IMO next year. If we go for the "innings eater" route, we will still have to find a spot for both Tillman and Britton. Tillman will be ready for the rotation right off bat and Britton will be ready pretty soon after that.

[El Gordo]

Say you go with Tillman, Arrieta, and Britton, and they struggle. Not yet ready for prime time. Do you just leave em out there to twist slowly in the wind like Josh Bell? Too late then to sign that innings eating veteran. Why not be proactive and if the young SP flourishes trade the vet, or one of Tillman, Arrieta, or Britton.

[Can_of_corn]

Say you go with Tillman, Arrieta, and Britton, and they struggle. Not yet ready for prime time. Do you just leave em out there to twist slowly in the wind like Josh Bell? To late then to sign that innings eating veteran. Why not be proactive and if the young SP flourishes trade the vet, or one of Tillman, Arrieta, or Britton.

Because the only way you get a veteran to play in Baltimore is if he is traded there, grossly overpaid, or is a marginal enough talent not to have better offers.

[El Gordo]

Because the only way you get a veteran to play in Baltimore is if he is traded there, grossly overpaid, or is a marginal enough talent not to have better offers.

This reasoning would preclude ever signing any FA. If you offered arbitration to Millwood and he accepted, you could probably sign him to a $6M deal or thereabouts. I bet you could get a 200 innings guy for around that. That's not breaking the bank and it's giving you some insurance.

[Sports Guy]

Say you go with Tillman, Arrieta, and Britton, and they struggle. Not yet ready for prime time. Do you just leave em out there to twist slowly in the wind like Josh Bell? To late then to sign that innings eating veteran. Why not be proactive and if the young SP flourishes trade the vet, or one of Tillman, Arrieta, or Britton.

Pretty much yes.

You have to find out what these guys can do.

We already have an idea about Arrieta although he obviously had some signs that he may not be able to be a starter.

However, unless you are going to trade these guys, you can't just continue to leave them in the minors or send them down when they have had 3-5 straight bad starts. You have to give them a real oppurtunity. Next year is still very unlikely to be a contending season, so you continue to get a look at these players.

You can always move them to the pen and put a guy like DH back in the rotation as well.

Let's say you bring back Millwood and he is pitching reasonably well..eating innings, 4.5-5 ERA. And let's say the other 4 guys are healthy and throwing like you would expect.

Now, let's also say tillman is dominating AAA.

Great scenario, right? Sure...sorta.

Its easy to say, just trade Millwood(or Guthrie)...But trades take time. Someone has to want them, etc....

So, you just keep Tillman down in AAA, learning very little and just waiting his turn. I don't see that as a good scenario.

[mweb]

I'm very torn here. If everyone's healthy, I'm very satsified with what we have. But if we lose someone at the top of the rotation, that could be a huge blow without more depth.

Well is having a guy that's likely to put up a 5 or higher ERA really helping much?

In the scenario laid out here, if someone gets hurt, than Tillman or Britton comes up, which I'd rather have either pitching than most, if not all of the vet pitchers that are available when factoring in price. The problem would be if two starters go down, but that's generally a substantial problem anyway.

[Sports Guy]

The veteran, one year, inning eater is a good bet to eat innings and stink. I'll take my chances with Tillman backed up by Britton. We do need to sign a couple of AAAA pitchers for Nofolk because we don't have much depth in the upper minors as far as starting pitching goes, just in case a couple of pitchers go down with injuries.

Exactly.

If you want to bring in a true 1/2 starter and that means Tillman goes to AAA for the mean time(if you don't trade him), then so be it.

But to do it for a guy that eats innings for a 4.75-5 ERA? What are you gaining? Is insurance enough to block one of these young guys that you have such high hopes for?

[Beach Bum]

I would like to see the Orioles add a veteran #4 or better pitcher. I think there's a new sheriff in town and the Orioles are going to transition from a rebuilding team to a competitive team. I haven't seen any evidence that Tillman is ready to be the man and there isn't much of a downside to allowing Tillman and Britton to spend time either in Norfork or the bullpen.

[Can_of_corn]

This reasoning would preclude ever signing any FA. If you offered arbitration to Millwood and he accepted, you could probably sign him to a $6M deal or thereabouts. I bet you could get a 200 innings guy for around that. That's not breaking the bank and it's giving you some insurance.

FA starting pitcher yes, FA in general no. Why would a starting pitcher want to pitch in a hitter park with a ton of games against the Yankees, Rays and Sox? Hitters and relief pitchers can still put numbers up if they sign with Baltimore, I will say that I think the O's overpaid for Gonzo last season.

As for Milwood, I am in favor of offering Arbitration but the only way he accepts is if the market for his services is very weak. I fully expect him to sign with a National league club and have a decent bounce back season next year.

What 6 million dollar work horse do you have in mind?

Other then Sir Sidney what starting pitching free agents of note have Baltimore signed in the last say 10 years?