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Tillman/Britton or vet innings eater

Sports Guy

By Sports Guy
in Orioles Talk

Who would you rather see the starts go to?  

127 members have voted

  1. 1. Who would you rather see the starts go to?

    • (insert name) Vet innings eater acquired on a 1 year deal
      27
    • Tillman or Britton
      100

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waroriole Hangout Grand Counsel

waroriole

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If you want to bring in a true 1/2 starter and that means Tillman goes to AAA for the mean time(if you don't trade him), then so be it.

There is no reason that Tillman can't go the bullpen to learn how to get ML players out. His inconsistencies need to be worked out before he is just given a rotation spot. If he shows he can do it, then you can trade the vet SP, but I'm sick of just giving our young guys endless opportunities. It's time they were earned.

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Sports Guy Hangout Grand Counsel

Sports Guy

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There is no reason that Tillman can't go the bullpen to learn how to get ML players out. His inconsistencies need to be worked out before he is just given a rotation spot. If he shows he can do it, then you can trade the vet SP, but I'm sick of just giving our young guys endless opportunities. It's time they were earned.

Its the 5TH STARTERS spot!

Do you know what the league average 5th starter gives you? Its something like a 5.3 ERA and 125 IP.

As Stotle asked before...if you can't hand the 5th starters spot to a guy with the talent of Tillman in a year when you don't realistically expect to contend, when exactly do you expect to give him time?

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waroriole Hangout Grand Counsel

waroriole

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Its the 5TH STARTERS spot!

Do you know what the league average 5th starter gives you? Its something like a 5.3 ERA and 125 IP.

As Stotle asked before...if you can't hand the 5th starters spot to a guy with the talent of Tillman in a year when you don't realistically expect to contend, when exactly do you expect to give him time?

I don't care what the spot is. He's still taking the ball almost as often as any other SP. And, we've given him the 5th starter's spot a good bit over the last two years and he has show that he is not ready to be a ML SP. You can give him time when he has shown, in the bullpen, that he can get ML hiters out.

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Sports Guy Hangout Grand Counsel

Sports Guy

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I don't care what the spot is. He's still taking the ball almost as often as any other SP. And, we've given him the 5th starter's spot a good bit over the last two years and he has show that he is not ready to be a ML SP. You can give him time when he has shown, in the bullpen, that he can get ML hiters out.
Showing that in the pen will prove nothing.

His stuff is going to be better...He won't have to go through a lineup 2-4 times. He won't prove that he can constantly repeat his delivery over several innings.

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waroriole Hangout Grand Counsel

waroriole

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Showing that in the pen will prove nothing.

His stuff is going to be better...He won't have to go through a lineup 2-4 times. He won't prove that he can constantly repeat his delivery over several innings.

Well, I don't think we're going to agree here. IMO, the first thing he needs to show is that he can get these guys out, build some confidence. Once he has done that, he should be given the shot in the rotation again and repeat his delivery.

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Sports Guy Hangout Grand Counsel

Sports Guy

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Well, I don't think we're going to agree here. IMO, the first thing he needs to show is that he can get these guys out, build some confidence. Once he has done that, he should be given the shot in the rotation again and repeat his delivery.

So, he goes out and throws 25 bullpen innings and dominates...that is enough for you? The sample size is so small, I don't see how it makes a difference.

And while he has had a chance, it hasn't been a great chance and he has obviously shown a lot of flashes of being very good...It just hasn't been consistent.

He isn't going to gain consistency pitching once or twice a week out of the pen.

You are also potentially risking injury because of the differences in pitching out of the pen and in the rotation.

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QBsILLEST1 All-Star

QBsILLEST1

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Well, I don't think we're going to agree here. IMO, the first thing he needs to show is that he can get these guys out, build some confidence. Once he has done that, he should be given the shot in the rotation again and repeat his delivery.

Repeat his delivery? Tillman's delivery is fine and simplistic and he repeats it very well. Tillman has proven that he can get ML hitters out and even dominate, he is just ridiculously inconsistent, but there is reason for this. His command IMO has come a long way and is still improving, he has learned to hit his spots better. Also, he just began working on a 2 seamer and a cutter last year and in that season's time, his cutter went from a work in progress to being good enough to be used as his "out pitch", rather than his curveball which is a true "plus" offering.

I don't understand people's line of thinking here. Do you think, realistically we are gonna compete next year? IMO its a possibility, but its still a transitional year, transitioning from rebuilding to competing. If we don't break these guys in now, when are we going to? The window only gets smaller from here. So, why get a #4 arm or whatever was mentioned above to take the place of a guy like Tillman or Britton who both have the ability to pitch better than a #4 now, and only will get better in the future? So, if for whatever reason, both bomb it and suck. What did we lose? Now, we know what we have to improve upon heading into 2012 when we will be able to realistically EXPECT to compete. Getting a innings eater does nothing but delay the inevitable. Tillman is ML ready, Britton technically is too, it'd just be best for the O's and him to get a few more reps in AAA.

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waroriole Hangout Grand Counsel

waroriole

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So, he goes out and throws 25 bullpen innings and dominates...that is enough for you? The sample size is so small, I don't see how it makes a difference.

And while he has had a chance, it hasn't been a great chance and he has obviously shown a lot of flashes of being very good...It just hasn't been consistent.

He isn't going to gain consistency pitching once or twice a week out of the pen.

You are also potentially risking injury because of the differences in pitching out of the pen and in the rotation.

The 25 bullpen innings are enough to build confidence and attack hitters, which is what his biggest problem is. If you are so worried about him breaking down in the bullpen then make him the longman, but I think it's a bit silly to use that as your argument for keeping him in the rotation.

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Sports Guy Hangout Grand Counsel

Sports Guy

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The 25 bullpen innings are enough to build confidence and attack hitters, which is what his biggest problem is. If you are so worried about him breaking down in the bullpen then make him the longman, but I think it's a bit silly to use that as your argument for keeping him in the rotation.

His problem is command..Not confidence, not a lack of attacking hitters.

His command has to be better.

He can go to the pen and have better command because he will be pitching in short stints and not have to throw all of his pitches.

That doesn't help him.

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QBsILLEST1 All-Star

QBsILLEST1

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The 25 bullpen innings are enough to build confidence and attack hitters, which is what his biggest problem is. If you are so worried about him breaking down in the bullpen then make him the longman, but I think it's a bit silly to use that as your argument for keeping him in the rotation.

He has shwon enough IMO to give him another shot in the rotation, once we make the move to try him in the pen, Britton will be next in pecking order and Tillman's chance may be gone.....Tillman is a quick learner, he deserves another shot in the rotation before we "give up on him" and stick him in the pen to gain confidence. That should be the last resort. Also, do you think a move to the pen will build confidence? It actually may hurt it more than anything, he is a starter and should remain so until he proves that he is just uncapable at this time.....

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waroriole Hangout Grand Counsel

waroriole

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His problem is command..Not confidence, not a lack of attacking hitters.

His command has to be better.

He can go to the pen and have better command because he will be pitching in short stints and not have to throw all of his pitches.

That doesn't help him.

I'm going to disagree here. I think the lack of command comes from him not trusting his stuff and nibbling with ML hitters. Then he puts himself in situations where he has to throw strikes and he gets lit up.

He has shwon enough IMO to give him another shot in the rotation, once we make the move to try him in the pen, Britton will be next in pecking order and Tillman's chance may be gone.....Tillman is a quick learner, he deserves another shot in the rotation before we "give up on him" and stick him in the pen to gain confidence. That should be the last resort. Also, do you think a move to the pen will build confidence? It actually may hurt it more than anything, he is a starter and should remain so until he proves that he is just uncapable at this time.....

I disagree. He has had a few good starts sandwiched by some awful and mediocre ones. The potential is definitely there, but I don't see a guy who believes he can get ML hitters out consistently.

I wouldn't worry about him getting squeezed out. I imagine that injuries will occur at some point this season to give him another opportunity. Also, I've not seen Britton impress enough at AAA to warrant a spot in the O's rotation. So, I wouldn't count on him to be ready in a month or so to come up. If that happens, great, but let's not plan our season around Britton being ready to be a big leaguer. What do we do if someone is injured, and another guy is ineffective, and Britton isn't ready? Do we want 2 of Vandy, DH and Berken making up 40% of our rotation?

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mikezpen Major Leaguer

mikezpen

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I think a Pie/Tillman trade package, with a couple of additions, would net something pretty decent to fill either first or third. Sign a vet fourth/fifth stater to eat innings with the intent of having Britton ready round mid season. Then trade the vet.

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