.jpg.046ddba8484d9228c24bd68e6322483c.jpg)
foxfield
-
Posts
5430 -
Joined
-
Last visited
-
Days Won
5
Content Type
Profiles
Forums
Events
Posts posted by foxfield
-
-
We have a great situation. But what we are seeing is essentially the pain of asset management. Yes we have new owners with fat checkbooks. We also have a GM who has been running an asset collection run to near perfection (Still need pitching).
All of us were at least a little disappointed when Holliday, Norby, Stowers and Kjerstad and even Mayo all went down. And all of us understand that some combination of these guys are likely better than the last 4 spots on the current 26. And if they are not now, they would likely be in time.
Service time almost demands this action. Almost. And with Holliday there is risk involved of losing his fulll year anyway. I think unless he is up quick enough to earn the pick if he is top two, he stays down the longest. But this is what the CBA leads us to do. It is simple math. Holliday in 7 years is almost assuredly, if we accept anything near his ceiling, more valuable than Holliday today. If I offered you 30 M or 40 M if you would wait until September, I feel pretty sure most would do it without hesitation.
This current situation is painful, but it is fantastic. It's like sneaking into your parents closet at Thanksgiving and finding out that this Christmas all of you dreams are going to come true. You know what you have, but you have to wait...every day is painful.
We also have several good players, who really don't want to go, have said they would like to extend and are probably not really in the long term plans. In a perfect world, we could trade with Miami, or Pittsburgh, or Seattle or the Dodgers or someone. We may yet do that.
We could also see an extension of one or more of these prospects that takes this service time issue away. I know Boras....but it could happen.
In the meantime, we have a very good team, but maybe not the team we will have later in the year. And as we start the '24 season, we have to wait for this transition. The O's have started 4-2 and if you didn't know that, it would seem from reading here that they are 0-6.
No one said, being in the mix for a WS with this group would be easy. We still have pitching questions. I think this roster is going to go through changes. Maybe that is because players play themselves into or off of the roster, maybe that is from trades. Maybe it is from a different direction from ownership.
No matter, we are in a pretty fantastic position and we are going to have to have a bit of patience. But it aint easy when you know what is in that closet...
-
3
-
-
21 minutes ago, pdiddy said:
Are there more people watching this thread than are at the game?! I can hear watches ticking in the stands.
Dude, that’s the clock on the wall. Look behind you!!!
-
1
-
-
2 hours ago, spleen1015 said:
Like the Rangers?
Yeah this is true just reminding that for every Rangers success there is a Met or a Padre that spent and went for it all and sunk their franchise.
But as Frobby pointed pointed out the playoff teams were some of the largest spenders save for a few examples like the orioles.
And look, as our min salary guys get paid more even in arb. Our payroll is going to climb higher. That was going to happen with or without new ownership.
We are incredibly well positioned to be successful for quite while. And John Angelos deserves more credit than he is probably going to get for that.
These are great times and I am gonna try and savor the ride. Not because I feel certain that a World Series title is assured. It’s not.
I want to enjoy this time and notice it all because when we were last one of the best and expected to stay that way. I took it for granted and then 1984 turned into 1999 and then 2018 and I went from being a college sophomore to an old man with grown kids and with very few exceptions the chance to relive 1983 has evaded us.
Imagine the possibilities from here and trying to just hang on for the ride and not take any of it for granted. It’s a great time to be an Oriole fan.
Let’s go O’s.
-
1
-
-
31 minutes ago, Frobby said:
Neither do I. And to be clear, I’ve never been too hung up on payroll. Spend intelligently when you need to, and if you don’t need to, don’t just spend for the sake of showing the fans you’re “trying to win.”
Right. And I think new ownership gives us a commitment to winning but I think it would be a mistake to say expect say …all of he the kids to be extended and an ACE or two signed as FA.
I am not looking to necessarily follow any other teams blueprint. I think the Orioles will cut their own trail. And I think the big difference will continue to be that they look for talent everywhere. But look to be seekers of value.
But we will have to see. I am certainly very pleased with all of the events and have not been as excited to be an Oriole fan since my youth. I am trying to not get too worried about how they do it. Or with who.
For me it’s just about winning. There really isn’t much we lack. So measuring success from here should be and for me will be about winning. Games, series, playoffs, titles.
-
2 hours ago, Frobby said:
Obviously teams can spend money and not win. But 6 of the top 10 payrolls made the playoffs, including the WS Champion Rangers, who had the 2nd highest payroll. So what’s your point?
My point is that I hope we don’t put the cart before the horse and expect the new ownership to spend simply because they can.
I fully expect the teams expenses to go up from here. But I do not really see the Orioles being tremendously active in FA market.
-
22 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:
Huh?
You can both spend money and win.
Like the Mets?
-
18 minutes ago, Frobby said:
B-b-but, he didn’t sign [Free Agent X]! He obviously doesn’t care about winning! (Coming next winter.)
With exclusive preview this summer!!!
-
1
-
-
Today certainly is one of the most important and it compares quite well with ‘92. It certainly is a great start to what we all hope is a tremendous era.
-
4 hours ago, Ohfan67 said:
Less than 50 for the two of them combined?
4 hours ago, Ohfan67 said:Combined I think 150+. I think Means is fine and they are slow rolling Means to control his innings. I think the orioles will get some starts from Bradish.
I hope you are correct. But yeah. I am not counting on more than 50 from them combined. And I hope I’m off by a couple hundred innings.
-
2 hours ago, Frobby said:
Just curious how many combined innings folks think we’ll get from Bradish and Means combined this year. Looks like Means could be back in late April. I’m guessing Bradish is late May at the soonest, if all all.
My answer is less than 50. I think the result could certainly be more than that, but I think until it looks like that is probable, it would simply be a mistake to think you have that. This is certainly a vote where I hope to be wrong.
-
Congratulations to David on completing what can only be considered an historically great day for the Baltimore Orioles.
Our hopes have not been this high in decades. May you fulfill your pledges and exceed our your goals and our dreams.
And thank you to John Angelo’s for his part in putting the Orioles in its current state.
-
This entire thread is an exercise in fatally looking for stuff to complain.
About the O’s, about Matt Holliday and even Boras.
The article in the OP took a perfectly reasonable statement and bastardized it into being unhappy when no such sentiment was expressed. And the Op leveraged that to make a bs argument about Matt Holliday.
At least that’s my opinion.
-
1
-
-
1 hour ago, interloper said:
We haven't had a steady 2B since the rebuild years. Those rebuild years resulted in us having more highly touted 2B prospects than we know what to do with. And yet we STILL haven't given any of them a steady 2B gig.
We’re saving someone base for someone special. And we’re a long ways off from being willing to go all the way.
-
23 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:
He might want to cut spending!
He might want to move the team to Peoria.
-
1 minute ago, webbrick2010 said:
We subtracted our innings pitched and wins leader (Gibson) and added nothing
Can't believe we didn't get another starting pitcher, this could blow up
I can only imagine your confidence with the ‘27 Yankees. I gonna go out on a limb and say it would have been something like this:
We could have been pretty good but…
-
It is not out of the question that the ownership deal closes and an extension is offered. I am not expecting it, but it’s clear that we were not really offering that with Angelos and we have no idea what new ownership thinks.
It’s worth noting that John Angelos has his organization in as strong a position as any team being sold ever has had before.
Low payroll, deep talent on both major and minor league rosters. Talent bubbling up from international signings.
There is so much available right now and so much uncertainty about the future…bright as it appears to be. I have no problem with Elias keeping all options open. But I expect him to be an AL East contender. Now and in the future.
-
2 hours ago, Bemorewins said:
I respect that we have different expectations.
I believed that the extreme tanking that we did was done in order to amass a trove of assets designed to make multiple WS runs similar to the Astros. (The place Elias/Sig came from.)
Maybe I was right? Maybe I was wrong? Time will tell.
I think you are right. I think most of us expect multiple runs at the WS. Time will tell if this stage is successful.
-
45 minutes ago, Bemorewins said:
I agree about the spending being an ownership decision. My hope is that our new owner will get us close to an average MLB payroll which will allow us to extend young players and not play these silly games of service time manipulation.
What Elias has proven thus far is that he is tremendous at rebuilding, drafting and developing position player prospects, and building the foundation of a healthy org. What Elias has yet to show is if he can build a championship org through meaningful signings and effective impact trades. In the later regard, he is not above reproach. All we have to look to is last season’s trade deadline to see some missteps. IMO, he has not earned the benefit of the doubt in that regard and there are some legit questions that hopefully he will answer as time goes on.
I don’t want to argue because I really do not think we disagree. I think you are pretty consistently hyperbolic. Elias has actually done each of the things that you list above. There are two things he has not done. Drive a team to a playoff win and completing that drive with a World Series Title.
The fact that that is even remotely possible today is due to his excellent work. If we have neither of those things over the next three years, he will be worthy of much consternation. And I will be happy to lead it.
But…As he has consistently beaten my expectations I am going to give a fair amount of leeway before I join a chorus of “yeah but he hasn’t done….”
-
6 hours ago, Bemorewins said:
I agree with go O’s. I don’t agree that Elias and the org are above criticism or that I think that it is best for them to be tone death to the fans.
I agree that I want them to win like you, but always making the cheapest decision possible is not the way to get there. If we want to sustain excellence, we are going to have to spend.
Spending is determined by owners and until we know the new edict of the new ownership there is no doubt we are operating on the cheap.
And I am fine with criticism of Elias. But his results so far are damn near beyond reproach. All I am saying is he has earned the benefit of the doubt. He is trying to win within the confines he has been given. It’s a long time until October. Let’s let the season progress and the answers may unfold.
-
1
-
-
1 hour ago, Bemorewins said:
All I can hope for is that under the new ownership regime, the organization won’t be so tone deaf.
Under new ownership, the last thing I wasn't is for them to be driven by fans. I want them to win, and to do whatever they believe is necessary to accomplish that.
I don't like sending all these young players down any more than you do, but these guys have exceeded expectations for for 2 years and have frankly earned the benefit of the doubt in regards to these moves.
The Orioles are going to be pretty good and they are going to be in a league that is pretty stacked. The roster is going to change during the course of the year and it will change more next year.
I have personal opinions as does everyone on what they "should" do and what I "want" ownership to do. But my judgements will be based upon one thing. Winning. If they keep doing that, I am going to be supportive. But these guys are supposed to be smarter than us and even if they are not, looking at you SG, they have access to a whole lot more info than we have.
Let's be excited for the coming season and be comfortable that a team that 5 years ago seemed to be an entire roster of placeholders are now filled with talent to where we have the need to argue incessantly about which of our talented future stars should replace players who helped us win 101 last year. It's quite the First World problem to have.
Let's Go Orioles!!!
-
2 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:
No he can't.
He can't adjust to left handed ML pitching in the minors.
Maybe he will get work against John Means
-
Rest In Peace Peter Angelos. I am thankful that your love of Baltimore made sure the Orioles stayed here. My condolences to the entire Angelos family. And on this day, I will fondly remember the best of you.
-
2
-
1
-
-
4 hours ago, Gurgi said:
If feel like Mike Elias promised us a puppy if we were good and did our homework. Well we did all our homework and did chores around the house and everything.....but instead of getting us that beautiful German Shepard puppy he went and got a damn chihahua mutt mix instead. And to top it off Elias punched the German Shepard puppy right in the face.
You can’t have any Jackson Holliday if you don’t eat your meat! How can any Jackson Holliday if you don’t eat your meat????
-
1
-
-
I am surprised and slightly disappointed. But not understanding the decision does not mean that it is wrong. That is an awful lot of talent to send back.
Maybe the new owner wants to be there on their first day to sign all the big contracts.
Ramon Urias 2024
in Orioles Talk
Posted
Of course, I think many here simply assume the checkbook will be wide open. I think the GM will be given more latitude than he was with Angelos, but I also do not assume that ME is going to embrace signing every prospect to a long term deal or jumping on say a 7 year contract for an ACE.
We simply don't know yet how they are going to decide to work together.
But that doesn't change the fact that there is much more flexibility today than there was before the ownership change.