Moose Milligan

I don't disagree here, I'm just curious...what's your definition of working out? I do believe deadline deals are a bit overrated. I get that the deadline is exciting but I think it's rare that a guy you pick up is the one to get you over the top.

I've seen enough for right now. He's got a lot of work to do this offseason, that's for sure. Last night was awful to watch and I'm surprised the Dodgers didn't score way more runs than they did. But last night I was having flashbacks to guys like Tyler Wilson and he reminded of the agony of watching guys like that.

There's no reason he can't be. So many people want to ignore the fact that the playoffs are a crap shoot. And I think when people hear that, they literally think it's a metaphor for literally rolling the dice and seeing what comes up. Winning it all isn't just about the front office moves, the moves made in the offseason and at the deadline and all of that.... yes, those things are a big part of it.... but it's also about how you finish the season, who do you have that's healthy, who isn't healthy, and are you getting hot at the right time. Those things all play a part in who wins it all and people either can't grasp that or don't want to grasp that. And then on TOP of those things is the randomness that is the playoffs itself. It's been pointed out here ad nauseum but it bears repeating...the Rangers got hot at the exact right time last year. They weren't world beaters through the regular season. They're not that good this year. But for a few weeks there they were on absolute fire and they were on fire when it mattered most. I don't think anyone considered them at any point last year to be the best team in baseball but that didn't matter. Same with the Nats in 2019, they caught fire for an extended stretch and then really heated up in the playoffs. Same with that year the Cardinals won like 82 games but then ended up winning it all. There's no reason Elias can't be the guy as long as he's building teams that get to the playoffs.

I was born in '81 so I've got maybe a few more memories than you. To your point, I agree that there's no one that's joined the franchise that's had the impact that he has...on the field or off it. Camden Yards opening was a big, big deal when it happened, but that's about all I've got. Ripken breaking the streak was a big thing, too...but I think that was more of a celebration about baseball and recovering from the '94 strike than it was about the Orioles and doing big things for the franchise. So for me, it's Camden Yards and Elias as far as impacts on the franchise itself. You're correct on all your points...going back to everything post '83 World Series, he probably is the single biggest thing and best thing that's happened to this franchise. Some fans here and fans I've seen in other places are acting like the fat chick in high school that lost 30 pounds and then got smoking hot and thought all her problems would go away. Just cause you got hot doesn't mean you don't have problems, you just have a different set of problems. And I'd trade these problems over the problems from 2017-2018 any day of the week. I find it befuddling that this thread exists, too...but here we are.

This one has been bad...so far. Like, the book isn't written on Stowers and Norby and Rogers. I certainly understand why people would jump to say this is a bad trade, Rogers was terrible and Norby has looked really good in Miami. But that doesn't mean this is who these guys are moving forward. And yes, this is a ridiculous thread.

I get the reaction of wanting to get a stud starting pitcher to help us down the stretch. I really do. IMO, Eflin is that guy, he's been fantastic since we got him. If Rogers could have helped this year, great...if not, well, I'm curious to see what they can do to help him improve the offseason and for the next two seasons. Stowers...whatever. I can see why people liked him and had hopes for him. IMO, he was a K machine and didn't really do much with the opportunities given to him here. I liked Norby, but he and Stowers were always the first two mentioned on here in any hypothetical trade, it was almost like a knee jerk reaction. And now that he's off to a good start in Miami, people are having some sort of buyers remorse. Like I said earlier, sometimes you win trades, sometimes you lose trades. But the book on this one isn't written yet but that doesn't stop people from acting like it has been.

I think Mateo brought more to the table than people realize. I do believe there are advanced metrics and other things Elias and Sig look at to measure impact on a game and Mateo had something they liked. At the very least, he brought the dimension of speed on the basepaths that we still have a little of...but he was a big part of that.

It is bad so far, but I don't believe this deal was made for this season and this season alone. A lot will happen between the end of this season and this time next year. Too much to predict, too much to be able to talk about now. I think Elias and Hyde are safe for this year and probably next year, too. After that, we'll see.

They do seem off. Not having a lot of key guys on the field is absolutely huge. This is a different team with Westburg, even though Urias has filled in admirably. This is a different team with G-Rod, Eflin, Bradish in the rotation and DC in the bullpen.

So what if it is? The idea that we have to have a GM that has to win every trade and constantly being the one to fleece other teams and being so ignorant to think that our GM would never lose a trade or get fleeced is being intentionally obtuse. He's going to have some trades not work out in his favor. That's just part of the game.

I read what Tony wrote, and it's good. I agree with it. I also read the part where he and SG said that Elias is the most important thing to happen to this franchise in the last 25 years. IMO, he's easily the most important thing that's happened to this franchise in the past 30+ years...going back to the opening of Camden Yards. He's not without faults, that's for sure. But after having watched this franchise since the late 80s and perpetually having a barren farm system and hardly any young talent to get excited about and to build around, this is essentially what I and others have been waiting for.

Well when a lot of people are in "win now" mode and seem to think that this is the only season where we'll have a shot at winning a World Series...it's not surprising. I agree, the Rogers move looks bad now...and it might end up being a bad move. But a lot of people don't have the patience to see if Rogers is a guy that can help next year....they're so focused on this year.

I stopped reading at general body language/demeanor. The defense is a factor, but IMO, not overly so. And when you're missing guys like Mateo and Westburg, it's going to be worse than what it was. https://www.bookfrom.net/john-eisenberg/page,10,296741-the_streak.html Sports fans becoming experts on whether or not a manager should be fired because of the "demeanor" of the team is one of the funnier takes, IMO. Someone puts their hands on their hips, looks frustrated...and people think they're Carl Jung all of a sudden.

You can agree to disagree...but the Rogers trade really isn't a hill to die on, either. It's not the trade to judge Elias on. And if you want to judge Elias and hold that trade above anything/everything else like it's some kind of trump card...well, I think you'd be one of a few doing that.

The last couple of years have been troubling to you? Last year was troubling to you? No one's acting like he's the greatest thing since whatever, that's just silly and hyperbole. There's plenty of criticism levied at Elias on this board.

Stowers has 6 RBI this week! Fire Elias!

Does Hyde get up to hit with RISP and fail miserably like the entire team has for the past few weeks? I get it, some fans think they're entitled to their pound of flesh...or need heads to roll to feel good about a crappy situation. And since you can't replace all of the players, it's just easy to target the manager. But you're not making this post if they win last night and take 2/3 from the Dodgers.

Incredibly pathetic with RISP lately. I think McDonald said they're like .170-something over their last 30 at bats with RISP.

I’m calling him Wieters from here on out unless he warrants a change. And like Wieters, I’m expecting a furious finish to the end that’ll leave him with a respectable stat line that masks the awful stretches we’ve had to experience. Doubt any Gold Gloves are on the horizon for Adley though.

What sad sacks those two are.

Dodgers with the Firestone.

This is where I’ll take Hyde to task. Down two, still have a shot. Bowman has been great but he’s laboring and for once in his career Hyde doesn’t prematurely pull the trigger. Now we’ve got Akin coming in with bases loaded. Akin sucks in situations like this. He can be good but he needs to start an inning, not come in to a jam like this.

I think Bowman’s gassed a little here.

Holding Ohtani hitless in what will be a loss is surprising.

That’s true.