OrangeTurtle

Yeah, I'm not a lawyer, so I'll defer to the expert that already posted, but I agree with what Moose laid out. I don't think it's 100% equivocal. The ultimate point is that it is used as a scare tactic and this (to me) doesn't fit with what a non-compete clause constitutes. But, I obviously don't know if that's right.

Dude, not at all; don't fret about it. You were very fair and I agree with your post above. I didn't mean to be aggressive towards you either, if it came off that way. I'd upvote or whatever, but I burned all of them on Moose because I have an irrational irritation with Kevin as a broadcaster, but I admit I'm in the minority and people have different tastes. Thanks for the kind words.

This is very fair. I am speaking with no internal knowledge to that degree. I can't say with certainty on that, I admit that. I was mostly saying that he already does other work for other entities, but you're exactly right. Good post.

Politics free board, eh? Cute inclusion of "vaccine" there.

How many broadcasts came out and spoke in support of him? Trust me, he would have been FINE with his future career prospects and forward-looking people would take him on, ESPECIALLY, for not bowing down and taking it as a slick hire. He's not hurting for work, I can assure you of that. Even if he just quit and didn't say anything at all, I'd have huge respect for him. But..

I'll openly admit I'm in the minority on my opinion of Kevin and I accept that. But, I desperately wanted him to just quit and move on. The Joe Buck style is awful (in my opinion) and he's a Joe wannabe prototype crafted in a lab. I was a huge Gary guy, so I guess I'm still butthurt he was replaced with a guy who is obviously more about himself than calling a game and being normal.

I'd argue that Angelos is a huge winner here if we're operating under the assumption that the reports on this were accurate. Brown, if he had a backbone, could have quit and publicly aired all of his grievances regarding the situation and made Angelos look WORSE, but instead he either was told to post the tweets or he took some kind of hush money incentive to post what he did (speculation). If what Kevin posted is true, why did he sit in radio silence for two weeks while all the other broadcasts were blowing him and attacking his buddy, Angelos? The reports may have been wrong and he was at fault in some way. But Kevin had every opportunity to have a little bit of dignity, but instead folded like a clown. He's not some hostage here; as others have noted, he's in high demand because, for whatever reason, people enjoy his fake, forced excitement and trying to be cute and topical all the time. As Kevin would say - while screaming annoyingly trying to get a soundbite on Quick Pitch - this is THE FIRST time he's had a chance to have integrity, but it was a HUGE SWING AND MISS.

Bro, we could have got him in a separate deal for a turd. Didn't have to trade Lopez for him. It's very easy to make deals

Just got the best reliever in baseball. No big deal. Is Elias a GOD? Discuss.

Yep.. only one person seems to keep bringing it up and trying to drive attention towards it. Wonder why that is. Also, twitter comments are outrageous, says the guy who cites ridiculous theories he read in the Twitter comments.

Apologies in advance for starting a new topic, but things have been slow for us this off-season and I'm bored and curious to hear some opinions. Since the FA market appears to be completely outrageous, and with Arizona potentially looking to offload Varsho from their OF surplus... https://twitter.com/BNightengale/status/1602400289662935040?s=20&t=2UwMJBAnEJW84L7OvIJi0Q https://www.si.com/mlb/yankees/news/new-york-yankees-showing-trade-interest-arizona-diamondbacks-outfielders-daulton-varsho-alek-thomas-jake-mccarthy I offer an interesting scenario (at least to me) - What would the Orioles have to offer Arizona to get Varsho, IF we agree to take back Bumgarner and his hefty contract (or most of it) they are desperate to unload? Would the Orioles consider this? Would Arizona want to lessen their potential return by attaching Varsho to Bumgarner? Here is my thought-process: 1) Varsho, particularly due to defensive versatility, is a very interesting piece that I believe could interest the Orioles. He's young and controlled through 2026, is a LH bat (which Elias has said he's looking for), and most importantly plays stellar OF defense which would go very nicely in the cavernous LF next to Mullins. Additionally, his aforementioned positional versatility by being able to play backup C (albeit poorly), allows us to almost kill two birds with one stone by improving back-up C value overall, while also adding a LHH power bat to the core. The thinking here is that if you have Adley catch 120-130 games, you can have Varsho cover the rest while Adley rests or plays DH. Varsho is your starting LF on days Adley catches and can also be used as a defensive replacement on days he's sitting. Obviously, you would need an emergency C and I might be a little overzealous with those projected time-shares, but for the sake of it, work with me. Now, Varsho has limitations in that he strikes out a lot and struggles to get on base, but he's still a 4+ fWAR player (even if most of his value comes from CF defense). He does offer offensive upside, however, due to youth. 2) Bumgarner, although terrible, also does offer SLIGHT potential upside here. Yes, he's owed $37MM for the next 2 years ($23MM of it in 2023 according to Cots), BUT he's pretty durable when he's not crashing dune buggies or riding steers, can eat additional innings for the BP, is LH which plays well here, and has that veteran pedigree - if you believe in that. Whether you like him or not, the guy is one of the greatest postseason pitchers of all-time. He would be leaving hitter-friendly Chase field and desperately looks like he needs a change of scenery. His average FB velocity still hovers around 91, so he's not completely cooked. He had a higher than normal BABIP last year, and I do believe in Holt, but I'm not sure that Bumgarner would be receptive to changes this late in his career. Is $37MM owed to Bumgarner a lot? Yes. But, with current market pricing, is it really THAT bad for 2 years? I'm not dumb enough to think that we'd be getting excess value for the price, but right as Adley & Gunnar start to get more expensive, MadBum's contract comes off the books. 3) Why would AZ want to do this? Well, they want Bumgarner gone, and by all accounts have struggled to find a taker for that awful contract. Also, they have a massive OF surplus, and want to clear room. Between Varsho, Carroll, Alek Thomas, McCarthy, and Druw Jones down the line, someone has to go. They aren't trading Carroll. They want pitching and RHH infielders, which we can offer. What would the Orioles have to offer IF we agreed to eat the rest of MadBum's contract? Would it take DL Hall + one of Kremer/Bradish + Ortiz/Westburg? Is that too much? Too little? Would you throw in a Rom or Mayo? How does the deal change if we only agree to eat part of the contract? AZ gets 2 SP to slot in behind Gallen & Kelly, while also improving MIF in the process. Yes, I'm banking on them projecting Hall as a SP, but Kremer or Bradish is still an intriguing ML young arm that should still entice them. Would the Orioles even want Varsho in the first place? I'm not sure if that's too much or too little on the trade hypothetical above, and I'm not even sure Varsho is worth THAT much, anyway. I'm not even sure that Varsho fits the offensive profile that Elias is after, but I do love the idea of getting that extra bench spot he would "conceivably" offer us. Would you want Bumgarner hoping to get a rebound out of him? Bumgarner would fill out another rotation spot, which is why you can free up one of Kremer/Bradish. That's three spots filled including Gibson, and then you also have GrayRod/Wells/Means/Voth/Watkins to fill the other two spots. Even if Bumgarner tanks, could he not fill the David Price role as an effective bullpen piece on a chase for the pennant? Admittedly, I'm not THRILLED with this forecasted rotation, but that defense would be insane. You're potentially looking at plus D across the board with Varsho in LF, Mullins in CF, some combination of Stowers (Cowser?) in RF, Mount at 1B, Ortiz at 2B, Mateo at SS, Gunnar at 3rd, with Adley catching. Ideally, you have Santander DHing on Adley C days, but he can fill out RF with Stowers without being totally abysmal. On days where you have Varsho catching, you hope that his bat + the defense elsewhere still is net-positive overall. This isn't even counting what else you could do if you wanted to trade Mullins or Santander. Would the D Backs be interested in Urias? I personally have no desire to sign Thor or any of these other pitchers left at the current market rates. If the Orioles can't keep up with the rest of the league on prices for pitching (I don't blame them), then why not be the team with all D and carry two inning eater vets in Bumgarner/Gibson? Is this stupid? Is having a defensive stud in Varsho worth THAT much? If you believe that Mullins is on the downswing defensively, having Varsho in our pocket to cover either slot is appealing, IMO.

Multi Inning Relief Pitcher

Agreed - very unlikely. But they have Carroll/Thomas already locked in to OF slots and are desperate to unload Bumgarner. I think their GM was quoted wrt looking to offload some of their OF surplus (albeit, that may not mean Varsho). I don't know of you'd have to move Holliday in such a deal.. maybe a Westburg/Norby + Mayo + Kremer gets that done. Obv depends on how much you want to absorb of MadBum's contract. Not saying this is something the Orioles would even want to entertain either.

Very unlikely to happen, but one name that would be awesome to target would be Daulton Varsho. Dbacks have an OF logjam and maybe, perhaps, you could get Varsho if you take back all of Bumgarner's contract if you include one of our IF prospects as well?

Or perhaps people understand there are still a lot of holes on this team and it's an uphill climb in the ALE. I'm personally fine with trading both Hays AND Mullins (if we get value back) and letting McKenna play CF until Cowser or Mystery Draft Pick is ready for CF. We need as much depth as possible to deal with prospect volatility and injuries. The system is deep, but not quite there yet, IMO.

Or, perhaps people want to see fresh faces or have opportunities to visit opposing stadiums they have never seen before where the Orioles are actually playing? Very weird thing to complain about or to have issues with, IMO.

This could be true, but with Dombrowski's comments today following the firing, it's clear they are in panic/salvage mode.

I don't disagree, but I'm not sure it makes sense to start trading our "surplus" until we get another Vet SP or SS/3B first. Free agency helps with this. Signing and then trading could artificially decrease the value of our prospects in any trade thereafter potentially, however.

Not to derail the premise of the thread, but the Orioles should SELL this season and BUY in the offseason. For instance: With Girardi's firing and PHI eager to salvage the season, I think you try to move Mullins/Hays + Jorge/Akin to PHI for Abel + Painter. Obviously, you try to trade Mancini/Santander this deadline as well. Then, come offseason, you try to sign ONE of: Correa/Turner/Verlander/DeGrom Any 2024 rotation plan featuring GrayRod + Abel + Hall + Bradish/Wells/Zimmermann/Means/Painter is pretty solid. Then, if you sign either Verlander or deGrom, you can package 2 of those guys + a combo of Cowser/Mayo/Westburg/Norby/Prieto/etc. For your SS with Henderson taking 3B in this scenario. If you sign either Correa or Turner, then you do the same thing for your TOR SP with Henderson assuming 3B again. Definitely should try to take advantage of Phillies closing window NOW IMO. They have 4 DHs and need a fleetfooted CF that adds to their overrated lineup immediately.

There's no way to prove the following line of thinking unless Hyde or the FO came out and explicitly said so, but I often wonder if Hyde's decision-making is more geared towards future years, than the current season. Not defending the move, but if I'm Hyde and I knew this year didn't matter, I could justify putting potential future players on a contending club (even if McKenna is a 4th OF at best) in precarious or high-pressure situations to see how they react/grow... even if there was a better "match-up" available at the time. Chirinos and Bemboom don't actually matter with respect to potential on a contending club. I obviously don't know what Hyde is told via the FO or what kind of leash he has, but I'd definitely want to hold "contending club players" to the fire as much as possible to really see what they have before the games actually matter. I might be leveling myself too much here and perhaps the thought-process isn't that detailed.

Our "Hader" is probably going to be DL Hall. Obviously rooting for him to become a long-term rotation staple, but I'm pretty confident that, at his floor, he should be a dominant Andrew Miller type.

Mets Receive: Paddack, Hosmer, Means Mets Lose: Smith, Allan Padres Receive: Smith, Mullins Padres Lose: Paddack, Hosmer, Abrams, Gore Orioles Receive: Abrams, Gore, Allan Orioles Lose: Mullins, Means Mets bolster rotation behind DeGrom and Scherzer with Paddack/Means. Padres unload Hosmer's contract and add another great OF for cheap. Rotation still strong behind Yu/Snell/Clevinger. Orioles receive a top 10 overall prospect and future Leadoff CF, a change of scenery, risky potential TOR piece to plug in with GrayRod/Hall, and another high upside arm years away coming off Tommy John.

Not in the sense that they'd even come close to having the required pieces it would take to acquire Mullins. Their system is horrific.

I do think that both Mullins and Mancini should be traded, although for different reasons. I'm in the camp to hold Santander in the hopes that his value rebounds slightly. Ideally, I'd be all in on signing Correa, despite the very low chances of that happening. If you can snag a couple top 100 types for Mullins, I think you move him, but it has to be a good haul, as reports have said Elias is looking for. Mancini won't return much, but out of respect for him, I'd like to see him traded to a potential NL contender because I don't think he fits our path forward as a RH DH type. Obviously, Hays is injury plagued, but if you can somehow keep him healthy for 140 games and play him in CF, then you potentially have another valuable piece while you wait for Cowser/(Jones or Green potentially). The system is flush with OFs and not all of them will pan out so it's good to have depth, but Mullins' D is overrated and his timing doesn't mesh well with the rest of our future core from an age + salary standpoint, at least in my opinion.

Oh my God another MM post complaining about what others want to post about. Start a thread and see what happens - he'll be sure to stop by, add nothing, and complain about how annoyed he is. Can't wait for the next thread that spurs discussion and interest and then the inevitable MM post complaining about it in a few weeks.