Pickles

Earlier than it was created?

Pretty sure he was initially diagnosed last summer and the vaccine wasn't ready until- just totally coincidentally of course- a week after the election. Time frame doesn't seem to add up.

I remeber the circumstances surrounding Wieters call up pretty well. And I do remember personally having a lot of concerns about his potential as a middle of the order bat as early as the next spring, and I'm largely just busting your balls here, but I think if a guy comes up with a 1000 career OPS in the minors, you probably shouldn't write off his ability to be a middle of the order bat based on 3 abs against the reigning Cy Young winner. You may indeed be correct. But it isn't a good process.

I love Hays too, but would him playing 80 consecutive games without getting hurt really change your mind and make you feel like you better hurry up and guarantee this guy a bunch of money?

It's not the kind of slump that is scary- as others pointed out. But good. Let him slump a bit. Adversity is the greatest teacher.

I think you kind of answered your own question.

I know many will disagree, at least in terms of importance, but I am heartened when the MiL clubs are winning.

So, you're claiming in his debut game, which was against Verlander if I remember, you predicted his lack of athleticism would keep him from being the guy people thought he was in the minors?

Lol. Gotta time stamp on that?

Hays just made a great throw from LF to home on a single. The runner scored, but the LA announcers raved about the throw- apparently it came in at 94 mph and accurate; and Hays' arm in general- 4 OF assists this year. The announcer commented something I was thinking while watching the replays: "That is not an arm you see in left field very often."

Well doesn't that beg the question: Superior to Gausman in Baltimore or superior to Gausman in San Francisco?

That's a pretty common thing.

I recall the logic behind Fio was they needed someone who could play CF.

If memory serves, he came up straight from Frederick.

First of all, BS. Plenty of people are making the argument, including you, that the O's should have been more aggressive in looking to win this year. And when shown how signing FAs, or making trades, would have been pretty futile, the conversation then shifts into being more aggressive with promotions. Namely, Adley's. Would he lead to a better product to watch? Undoubtedly. Would it lead to better player development? We don't know that. And claiming you do is false. Is it ethical employment practice? Who are you? Cesar Chavez? The multi-millionaire Adley Rutschman is getting along ok. Framing it as some moral crusade is laughable. The reasons for not promoting Adley have been laid out dozens of times. They are imminently reasonable. The O's handling of Adley is pretty much the norm across the industry. You don't like it? Great. We heard you the first two dozen times.

But By God Man!, if we get him up here this summer we could win 59 games!

I checked the box score in the third. It was 9-0 already. LOL. I honestly think it's easier for me to deal with the rebuild, and accept that you have to play the long game, because I don't watch.

They'll never be what they were in the mid 90s. That's a cold, hard truth. The more they lose, the more prestige they will lose. I agree with that as well. It has a ripple effect. I agree. The only solution is to win consistently for a long time. Our model should be the St. Louis Cardinals. And I believe it largely is.

I was thinking the exact same thing. By the time you check the box score, they're almost always losing already. The starting rotation is horrendous. Particularly without Means. Those who thought this team had a baseline of 68 wins, and should "go for it", are being shown to be more wrong by the day.

Eh. Did they lose them in 2008?

That's poorly worded. Frankly, hit for average is probably the best way to describe it.

I've almost been tempted to start a thread on Wieters' unfortunate injury. It really seems to have colored his legacy- unfairly imo. One intelligent poster suggested that Adley should probably put up a 930 ops; that would be acceptable. Thankfully, somebody pointed out that would be 70 points higher than Posey's unbelievable, HOF-run. When Adley's up here being Wieters with better on-base skills (there it is; it's just not one of the five) we should all be thrilled.

Yes, and notice that none of them are "walk" or even "plate discipline." It simply wasn't considered one of those five skills. Again, you seem to understand they're arbitrary, but you think that supports something it doesn't. That isn't to sayd people didn't understand the concept. I hate this misconception that Billy Beane or even Bill James was somehow revolutionary. Branch Rickey: "The single greates difference between an amateur hitter and a professional hitter is understanding the strike zone." That's in the 1930s. It's importance has always been self evident, but it simply hasn't been conflated with "bat to ball skills"- meaning the ability to make contact, specifically meaningful contact.

Fair enough. And he'll probably be back to 300 in 3 days. I'm just seeing a lot of unrealistic expectations for this guy. He's not a better prospect than Wieters. And everyone acts as if they'll be disappointed if he's only a little better than Wieters. The only problem with Wieters' career here was the got injured at a very untimely point, and basically cost us two years of team control, and he missed his prime.

Is that the claim? His plate discipline is obviously as good as it gets at that level. But, imo, that's very distinct from hit tool, and that's always been understood. Of course, they're interrelated in performance, but so is power and hit tool, and yet people are very comfortable in being able to distinguish the two. Bat to ball skills- i.e. hit tool- have shown to be among the most predictive skills in the MiLs for ML success.