Moose Milligan

Well said. They were billed as middle of the rotation starters at best. I just don't see it with guys like Akin and Baumann. Middling stuff. No special fastball, no special secondary offerings. I don't think they're that good.

I don't disagree with the premise, however we've got two guys right now that were in our system (Means and Mullins) who were undervalued by us. While I agree that it's fun to pick up guys from other organizations and have them become stars, it's also nice when guys you were sleeping on from your own system are surpassing expectations, too.

I agree. I've never been high on DJ Stewart but quite frankly his plate discipline is one thing thats appealing, especially in comping him to a guy like Mountcastle. And he hits homers in bunches, as we've seen.

I'm not sure I agree here, at least 100%. I agree that development has been a problem for awhile, but so has been drafting and scouting. Tampa has that down, too.

That's fair, but I don't think he's ever been advertised as a high walk/low strikeout kind of guy. I'm not thrilled about that either but I was pleasantly surprised at his walk rate when he came up last year. It wasn't amazing, but it seems like his walk rate got even better when he got to the majors. I'm not sure if that's accurate, but I'd have to check. As you said, you've gotta accept who a player is at some point and Mountcastle is what he is...a guy that doesn't play a particular position well despite being a seemingly athletic guy and has a lot of swing and miss in his game. Can he come around on that? Guess we'll find out.

He's solid. He's been a good pickup. And I think he's pretty good on the DP pivot, quick hands, strong arm.

I'll agree, he's looked lost at the plate at times. It was a couple games ago or so where he swung and missed on a slider that wasn't even close to the zone. I mean, it was bad...he wasn't in the same zip code. What changed my mind is that there's been some improvement, as you noted. Yeah, he's not lighting it up like he did last year when he came up, but that's okay, IMO. So if he's getting a little better, now's not the time to send him down. He's not nearly in the same class as Vlad Jr, but both franchises regard their respective prospects as important contributors. Vlad Jr. didn't light it up as a rookie and he wasn't impressive last year but he's killing it this year, arguably the best hitter in the majors. The Jays stuck with him, it's paid off. Now again, Mountcastle isn't projected to be the same type of hitter that Vlad Jr. is. And Vlad Jr, even when he wasn't lighting it up, hasn't looked as bad as Mountcastle has. But I think there's something to be said for recognizing when a guy has nothing left to prove in the minors and you let him figure it out in the majors.

As you mentioned in the OP, he's gotten better. He's still not raking, but he's shown improvement. I'd still like to see him try to figure this out at the ML level. I'd thought about sending him down earlier this season but I've changed my mind. He needs to work it out here. He's shown that he can hit minor league pitching, I don't necessarily see how that would help him. He needs to get back on track at this level.

I get that, but if he's gotta sprint out of the box that's not so different than having to cover some ground in the field. Obviously he'd probably see more chances in the field so there's greater risk to aggravate that injury due to the repetition...but with the way he's built, he could very easily tweak something further running around the bases.

You and I got into a spat (shocking, right?) over the offseason, but I'll bring it up again here. Let Hays be someone else's injury problem. I'd be in favor of trading him, even though I like him while he's on the field...but that's the problem, being on the field. Of course, the return would have to make sense but having a team full of guys that are weaker than wet toilet paper is getting old, fast. I'm not saying Hays has gotta go. But I wouldn't hesitate to pick up the phone about him or listen to someone's inquiry.

Quoted for emphasis. And a hell of a post. Well done.

Agreed. And then it's like....you've got 4 starters not named Means who aren't great. And you need to relieve them with guys like Plutko and Armstrong. I dunno, I don't get mad at water for being wet. I

Lol, catching defense. Yes, that's why we're so bad.

Yeah, this is the Hyde managing thread, right? How's anyone going to manage a 6.23 ERA to wins?

Not sure if anyone saw this yesterday. New Era (who I hate for having to have their logo emblazoned on the side of every MLB hat) released these terrible "Local Market" hats. Basically they were standard on-field MLB hats with the team logo but littered with other things that are special local to the area such as area codes, popular food local to the city, buildings, or anything else that the city is known for. For example, the Orioles hat had 410, 443, a crab and Edgar Allen Poe and some other stuff in addition to the regular cartoon bird. The Braves hat apparently had a UFO on it and no one knows why. Some people were saying it was for ATLiens, the Outkast album. Tampa Bay had their area codes but oddly enough not the area code for where their stadium is located. Someone at New Era had to have lost their job over this, they were terrible. They didn't last online for even a day before people roasted them, New Era ended up pulling them down. https://sports.yahoo.com/new-era-mlb-local-market-caps-mlb-twitter-001629228.html

I remember when 120 was the pitch count to take out a starter. Seemed like Mussina would hit 120 practically every time out.

Yeah, I don't think you're correct here.

Got lucky there. That ball was smoked. I think Severino got him.

I see a fastball that's straight as an arrow and sits around 93-94. The breaking/offspeed stuff is decent. I'm not saying he has bad stuff, he doesn't. Arrieta's was just better.

Akin, great, another guy with middling stuff.

Leadoff double, because of course.

Arrieta had better stuff but overall I agree with the premise.

You're being ridiculous. He's young, he has upside and he's under team control for years. If you can't admit to that, then you're just being fussy and intentionally obtuse.

I'm going over.

Winner.