Tony-OH

Is Adley hurt, or is he just struggling? I know that talked about the back, and maybe it's been bothering him for some time, but here's his numbers since Jul 1st. He's actually been a little better in August than his awful July (.667 OPS) but not great. I guess the issue is who comes up for him that would be better? If his back is bothering will one IL stint heal him? As for Burnes, the only way he goes on the IL is if he complains about something hurting. He should not "need a break".

I never said the team will not be good next year or even this year, I'm saying the Orioles did not have the depth, particularly the pitching depth, to overcome their injuries. And yes, I'm going to continue to harp on Elias' draft strategy of ignoring pitching with his higher draft picks. The Dodgers are in first place and have a bullpen that looks like this: Atlanta may not win their Division, but they'll make the playoffs and don't count them out when they're in there. The Orioles have not played well for sometime now and seemingly are getting beat up by the better teams. Barring an absolute crash, they're going to still make the playoffs because of the start they had to the season when they looked like one of the best Orioles teams of all-time. And yes, I do think Norby could be helping this team and he was traded away for a pitcher who I would have NP'd if I saw him pitching in AA somewhere. Now maybe Rogers can be "fixed" this offseason, or maybe he'll still be able to help at some point this season, but if you are going to trade away guys who could help, you need to make sure you get back guys who are going to help you now.

Seems like a weird thread to pull back up to continue your message that this team has "given up." First, Hays was not taking any shots. He was doing what any player does when joining a new team, and that's tell everyone how glad he is to be there. Second, Hays was going to get more of an opportunity to play then he was with the Orioles. Why would he not be happy with that? Third, none of this has anything to do with what is currently going on with the Orioles right now. Maybe try and keep a lot of this stuff in the current threads instead of bumping old ones that really don't have anything to do with the current situation.

This. I don't know what is up with Burnes but the man is coming up pretty small when this team needed him to be the ace they thought they had. I don't know if he's just going through a bad spell, there's something wrong, or he's wilting a bit under the pressure of the situation, but it's extremely disappointing how poorly he's pitched of late. Of course maybe this pitiful lineup of late that is full of guys he drafted and developed is not sitting well. It's just a tough time for all involved. Sure, the injuries have mounted, but good teams and organizations have the depth to overcome them. He traded away some of that depth for guys who are not helping very much.

Ouch. The truth in black and white. While Elias certainly could not control the injury to Eflin (which hopefully isn't that bad) he and his professional scouts need to start being held responsible for the players they acquire. I'd really like to know what his "scouts" or "SIGBOT" or whatever saw in Rogers to send off Norby and Stowers for him. His stuff has clearly declined and when I saw him pitch for the first time with the Orioles I thought to myself, "What am I missing here? How could any professional scout see this 'stuff' and think this guy could help this year?" The book is not written on Soto and Dominguez, but there's a reason a 1st place team was willing to trade them off in the middle of a stretch drive. Sometimes I really think the Orioles think they are so smart, that they can turn any team's "castoffs" and turn them into diamonds. The success they've had with Perez, Webb and Cano to a lesser extent have given them a false sense that they have some magic that makes pitchers better. Yet we've seen them trade away or get rid of pitchers like Tanner Scott and Evan Phillips only to see them become the exact kinds of impact bullpen arms this team has needed this year. So while Elias certainly gets credit for turning this franchise around, the injuries showed that his farm system may not be quite the juggernaut that people think now that most of his best pieces have been promoted. His lack of drafting and development of pitching really has shown up this season and it's not getting better any time soon unless a few pitchers in the system really take a big step forward.

I'd have Weston, Young and Reilly as a step above Fruit and Van Loon. Young has the best chance to stick as a starter, Reilly the best chance to be a high impact reliever, and Weston a possibility as a backend rotation or set up guy similar to Tate.

Makes sense then. He clearly signed with us with some kind of promise to be in the big leagues. He didn't leave St Paul (Min-AAA) to pitch in Norfolk long term.

I'm assuming Rivera allows Urias to move to second and gives Holliday a day off against a lefty.

Yeah, I get that reasoning, but seems like he gave them 1.2 innings from the right side and just needs a day or two at most off. I guess Bowman vs Selby is probably not much different and Bowman hasn't pitched since the 18th.

Adding Rivera (which I totally don't get unless Urias is hurt), Vespi, and Bowman (on his what 4th team this year?) doesn't make me feel better about this team. Why demote Selby who has actually pitched well?

I wonder what their ERA is with RISP and two outs. Feels like they give up an inordinate amount of two-out hits in those situations. Heck, seems like a lot of two-out, two-strike hits bit us. But that could just be "fan bias" on me because they are the ones that "hurt".

Who would even track that? Why would you ask for that when you know there is absolutely no way of knowing it one way or the other. It's fine if you don't think a team meeting doesn't work, and honestly, I have no idea whether they work or not, but I don't see what is gained by asking someone for data on something that you know is not track.

I also posted numbers to show that over the last 50 games (when I did the post) they were very unclutch in both the offense and defense. So whether they were unclutch all year is not the issue, as the pressure has built this team so far has wilted. Now whether they can come back and change that narrative remains to be seen, but the numbers definitely show a lack of clutchiness since last June. Yes, part of the high leverage problems are because hitters are facing good relief pitchers, but again, all teams are facing them and the Orioles are still 18th according to the OP and the recent stats I posted were about the same.

Coulombe and Webb say hi! they were two of the Orioles high leverage relievers this season and losing them both have pushed guys up into roles they may not be good fits for.

I agree, but they need to see him do it a bit in AAA before bringing him up to the major leagues in a role he's never done before IMHO.

In other words, they lack "clutchiness" this year. Whether that's just because it's a down year for the hitters, or because they've put too much pressure on themselves to be "they guy" on a team with expectations coming into this season, we don't know. But what we do know is that in every way you can judge the team it's poor in clutch situations.

I'm guessing they feel Young is "starter" depth so they're going to keep on starting him, but if they did think he's going to fill a reliever role, then they need to get him used to warming up quickly and pitching more often on less rest in AAA. You don't know how a pitcher can do those things until they've done them and asking a guy to do things out of his routing, at the major league level, seems to be a recipe for disaster. This is why I preferred McDermott be converted to a reliever this year. Maybe he would have been able to fill a bullpen role this year vice being on the shelf with an injury.

Rivera has never played SS in the major leagues. He appears to be a 3B-1B.

True statement. Sometimes you got to just put those "walls up" when teams or parts of teams let you down.

I think we have his nickname now. Seranthony "giver of home runs" Dominguez. Dude is a thrower.

Phillies GM be giggling when he wants to get rid of an inconsistent pitcher with good velocity. "Mikey likes them! He really likes them!!"

Not sure I feel good about this team playing "lesser" teams. They seem to play to the level of the team they ae facing. And besides, I can't imagine a much worse bullpen than the Orioles right now. Nobody can feel good in a close game with this crew, and the offense on most nights is not exactly lighting up the scoreboard unless they are having a homer game.

Where is Soto? I mean, he hadn't allowed a run in his last four appearances and hasn't been seen since Saturday.

Cano struggles to get out lefties this year too. Not sure I'd feel good about a closer that lefties slash .254/.315/.463/.778 off of. Your guess is as good as mine who they should use. Right now, Hyde has no choice but to use these guys. Maybe give Perez a shot? He pitches well in high leverage.

Elias' acquisitions for the bullpen in the offseason and trading deadline are not exactly good. I think we all know why Dominguez was available for Hays. Kimbrel is who he is, and let's not forget the amazing Fuji last year. But the Orioles pitching coaches will fix them.. lol