Tony-OH

Rhodes was pretty close to making my team, but I felt Williamson and Mills edged them out.

Storm Davis was just beaten out by Erick Bedard.

JJ retire after 2018 which makes him ineligible.

For this endeavor, the player had to play for the Orioles for at least three years, have been retired for at least five years, can not be in the Orioles Hall of Fame. Did I miss anyone? Would you have someone different? No Browns qualify for this list, just Orioles. Palmeiro and Tejada are not eligible due to PEDs (Feel free to add them on you list though as I don't want to drag up that conversation). 1B: Randy Milligan 2B: Jerry Adair SS: Ron Hansen 3B: Leo Gomez OF: Don Baylor CF: Jackie Brandt OF: Merv Rettenmund C- Andy Etchebarren DH: Terry Crowley UTL: Mark McLemore SP: Ben McDonald SP: Erik Bedard RP: Mark Williamson RP: Alan Mills BTW: Markakis, Jones, Jim Johnson, Machado will all end up in the Orioles HoF when eligible.

Here's my Disco Dan Ford story. Ford had a very closed stance and pull approach at the plate. I was 12-years old in my last year of 10-12 Little league ball when Ford was acquired and for some reason, I was excited about him. Before the 1982 season I was actually traded. Yes, in the Pasadena Riviera Beach little league apparently coaches could trade, but it was rare. Either way, I was traded from the Yankees (I hated playing for them for obvious reasons) to the Red Sox because the Red Sox needed a catcher (I was a catcher) and the Yankees needed a pitcher. I was actually happy because more of my closer friends were on the Red Sox so off I happily went, though I was a little offended that my manager traded me, a perennial All-Star, for a kid who I didn't feel was very good. Now, the funniest thing here is I was traded because I wasn't a pitcher really. I had a good arm but as a short kid, no one ever really wanted to teach me how to pitch so I was pretty wild in the chances I did get. So we finally face the Yankees for the first time and my manager decides to let me start against them even though I had only pitched occasionally. I was so pumped because not only was I going to start against the team who traded me, but my Father was at the game (he was late to many mid-week games because of work) since it was a Saturday morning. So I ended up giving up two runs to put us behind 2-0 going into the bottom of the 5th inning. With two outs and two runners on, I came up to plate. I walked into the batters bat and closed my stance like Dan Ford for some reason. I wasn't hitting like him all season, but for some reason I felt the need to bat like Ford. Did I mention I was actually facing the kid I was traded for as well? Down 2-0, against the team that traded me and the kid I was trade for, I took a fastball and just like Ford, pulled it deep down the left field line. It was probably longest ball that I hit in 10-12 ball and it landed well past the left field fence for a three-run homer. As I shook my 3rd base coaches hand, I made eye contact with the manager who had traded me (I really didn't like him before the trade so I really didn't like him after he traded me). So there was 12-year old me locking eyes with the man who traded me the entire way to the plate down the 3rd base line. He was the kind of guy who never smiled, but even he had a little smirk on his face like, "You got me kid!" It was the greatest moment of my 12 year old life. I held them in the 6th and we won 3-2, making me the winning pitcher with the game winning homer. All thanks to my Dan Ford batting stance.

If you ever look at the drafting by the Orioles from really the mid to early 70s on it was quite terrible. Add in no international presence and a limited budget, and it was clear that free agency and poor drafting really destroyed a once great franchise.

Those are some amazing quotes by Peters, especially openly talking about trying to trade for Gary Templeton. That would never go over now. Imagine had he actually traded for Templeton, Ripken may never have been converted.

I do think the VR training will be used and should be used. I think it's probably a much better alternative to some BP pitcher trying to throw like a major league starter. I'm not even sure how they are going to create the break of curveball or slider from a shorter distance. I've seen those VR things but I haven't hear of major leaguers using them to see the starter's repertoire. It would make sense though that they could put the stuff into a VR and allow a batter to see and react to 20-30 pitches. that to me makes more sense then some coach trying to throw the shape of the breaking ball of that night's starter.

I do think Ortiz is among the best defensive SS in the system, but I don't feel he's a plus shortstop though the hands might be plus. He brings average SS tools across the board for me. I do think they bump up to plus range and arm at 2B though. Grenier is the best defensive SS in the system, but he's got a ways to go with the bat, especially hitting offpseed pitches. I like what I saw from Ortiz last year in his limited play, but just need to see it over an entire season at AA and higher. I think next year will be a big year for him to show he's an everyday guy or more of a utility. His bat and health will determine that.

Well the injury didn't help him cement his prospect status so really what we have is 156 of decent offensive output at A+ and AA as a 22 year old. Now there's nothing wrong with that, but while I too hard about his improvements strength wise, I need to see a year of production at higher levels to really cement his prospect status because he really doesn't bring any plus tools to the field. So basically he's where he's at because it's unclear to me whether he's a potential everyday guy or utility guy.

Wow, need a scorecard to keep up.

D\Jj's sprint speed percentile has gone like this since his debut: 2018: 63 percentile 2019: 53 percentile 2020: 34 percentile 2021: 43 percentile He's not a clog by any definition, but not surprisingly with his body shape, he's gotten much slower as he's aged.

It's funny you mentioned Dwyer because to me, Dwyer is Stewart's upside and unfortunately, the Jim Dwyer-type role has really gone away due to the large pitching staffs now carried by ball clubs.

This won't be hard in a few years as De Los Santos is the much better prospect.

Let's not gloss over those first 1000 PAs that Brooks got in the majors instead of the minors were pretty bad. so an argument could be made he would have better served developing his bat more in the minors leagues if those Orioles teams were actually competitive. If those late 50s Orioles teams were better, I imagine Brooks would have spent more of that time in the minors vs slashing .249/.296/.336/.631 (77 OPS+) at the major league level through his first 1033 PAs. Honestly, I don't think this issue is black and white. It's really heavily player and team dependent even if the six years of control was not a thing. I do think most players would get "cups of coffee" or maybe even earlier chances if injuries occurred at the major league level and they were the next best player available, but I do still think players would be developed in the minors based on their particular readiness. We all know Rutschman spent all of last year in the minors because of the six years of control. It makes total sense to keep a guy in the minors and not start his clock while the team is in dead last vs hopefully getting a 29-year old season when the team could potentially be good. It would be silly and gross mismanagement of resources if Rutschman would have been promoted last year under the current system. Now, if FA was aged based (say 28), then it would have been 100% silly to KEEP Rutschman in the minors last year as he obviously would have been better than anyone the Orioles had at catcher last season.

Well now we know how Scott Boras feels.

I mean, in theory he can run around out there and catch the ball, but he would be a well below average defensive center fielder. Hays footspeed: Age Ft/S %rank 2017 22 28.9 91.7 2019 24 28.6 85.8 2020 25 27.9 75.8 2021 26 27.4 58.4 Defense reaction burst route ft/avg ft covered 2017 -0.3 0 -0.4 -0.8 31.6 2019 -1.1 0.9 0.6 0.4 34.6 2020 -0.8 1.4 0.5 1.5 34.1 2021 -0.6 -0.3 0.2 -0.8 31.7 So in 2021 his foot speed dropped to 58.4 percentile and he covered 2.4 ft/sec less than in 2020 in the outfield. I doubt he's going to suddenly get faster and better at covering ground at 27. Hays is a fine corner outfielder, but if he played every day in CF he'd be well below average. The average CF foot speed is about 28.4 ft/sec. His 27.4 ft/sec would be the 5th slowest among CFer with 50 or more chances last season.

I guess the fact that they are meeting and conceding some issues is good for the possibility of a compromise being reached, but I hate the fact that the players are solely focused on making more money for their constituents. that don't care about fairness or competitiveness, just making more money for themselves. No one is looking out for what's good for baseball or the fans.

Me too. It's frustrating to see how neither side really cares about fairness or getting rid of a system that can be so easily gamed at the young players and fans expense.

Athleticism is not the problem for Henderson. He's plenty athletic and can make some great plays at SS. The questions are whether he's going to outgrow that quickness he has now and also the consistency of his hands and throws. I still think he's going to end up at 3B or maybe 2B if the hands don't come around, similar to Schoop.

Pretty clear from reading this that the players don't care about competition and fairness but making sure they make the most money they can for their constituents. They want big market teams to be able to spend whatever they want with as little competitive balance money because they know when big markets can spend, they will spend ludicrous money on players. Basically neither side cares about the fans.

I agree with this 100%. Age and experience would come into the equation as well. Is a player ready for the bright lights and pressure of the big leagues? I agree that it would be a case by case basis as it should be for almost every decision in development of players. Personally I'm a big fan of age based free agency vs the six year mark.

That's not the question though. The only question is would you prefer to see two less weeks of Adley during that 24 year old season so you can have an entire 31 year old season. It would be silly to do anything otherwise under the current rules. I just hope they change the rules so it's more like half a season until it counts for a year.

I don't believe that's totally true. Sure, could Grayson Rodriguez have been a successful reliever last year at the major league level, sure. But do you want a guy getting 50 some innings pitching and inning or two when he needs to be developed as a starter? Same thing with your back up catcher example. Do you want a guy getting 175 PAs a year as as a back up catcher when he's could get 500 PAs in AA or AAA? No, you don't because that slows their development. Now I agree with you when it comes to changing the Free agency rules to something like an age based system, but that really only will affect the players who are truly able to play a role in the major leagues in the role expected. What does that mean? That means AR would have been the starting catcher last year with the Orioles if it wasn't going to count against his six years. It means Grayson Rodriguez would have been pitching in the major leagues as a starter last year. But it would have been dumb to bring either of them up in some reliever or backup role. So there is "more seasoning" aspect to players that would not be affected by a lack of six years of control in my opinion, but it would find guys up in the major leagues earlier once they are a better option than current options as long as the role is the one they are supposed to be in at the major league level.

With the bonus pool money, it's stopped the big market teams from having a huge advantage. Now the Yankees cant come in and sign every player they vaguely want because they can just outspend everyone. Personally, I think a draft would be best because then each team would be able to wait until players had reached their 16th birthday and not have to make agreements with the bigger names at 14, like they do now. Saying that, the Orioles, thanks mostly to Koby Perez, have made huge strides in understanding the market, and knowing when some players' price tags come down because their market dried up since teams only have so much to spend. The Orioles are positioned pretty well right now either way, especially with their new academy that will draw in some good players, but if we judge Perez and his scouts ability to identify talent well, then a draft of 16 year olds would be a good thing.