bluedog

Maybe he feels that the price will be lower if he waits until the last minute.

Maybe its the Yankees depending on how badly we beat them over the weekend.

Serious question - why would a sale after Angelos dies be any different in terms of tax implications?

That trade tool REALLY likes Coby Mayo and thinks Holliday is 1.6 times more valuable than Cease (which I think still undervalues him).

Agreed. Except for the guy that suggested Holliday for Cease last week, that's the worst O's trade idea I've seen floated anywhere this year.

I suggested the O's could send Urias and / or Hays (before Mullins got hurt again) to the Fish for pitching a couple of weeks back and got trashed for it. People really dislike the idea of trading vets from the team during a playoff run. We know Elias has no problem with doing that given what he did last year, but it's not a popular idea on OH for sure. I would have no problem moving Urias for P prospects if it cleared space for Ortiz at the major league level. Also, Elias is the guy that traded away our All-Star closer and our most popular hometown "feel good" player in the midst of a playoff run for a bunch of prospects. I seriously doubt he takes optics into consideration when making these kinds of decisions.

I'd be pretty excited about Julio Urias in an O's uni.

My buddy made a good point that the O's may never be more valuable than right after Holliday debuts next year. The hype over having 3 back to back to back #1 prospects all under team control for half a decade might drive team value over $2B. Perfect time to sell.

One of my favorite moments as an O's fan. He was such an exceptional talent.

I have a buddy whos front office finance for a non-MLB pro franchise and he's told me that he's hearing rumors that there is a strong push being made by an extremely well financed group to buy the Orioles from the Angelos family. The same excitement we have for the O's may be attracting deep pockets who want to own the team during this championship window.

Fair point. I assume a trade for one or more SPs would have to precede a trade of ECab. Again - I didn't propose Westburg for ECab and I wouldn't like it if we traded for him. By the way - Chris Sale was 21 and had 3 more years of control (very similar to ECab) and generated a 4 for one trade. Sale was without question far superior to ECab and required a huge haul to get, but the argument that young high-upside SPs with multiple years of team control don't get traded in 4 for 1 trades isn't true. And before you point out some other reason ECab for 4 O's is different than the Sale trade - of course all trades are different and you can find something unprecedented about almost any proposed trade. The bottom line is a 4 for 1 trade for ECab is plausible, regardless of whether it's likely or not. White Sox get: Yoán Moncada, Michael Kopech, Luis Alexander Basabe, Victor DiazRed Sox get: Chris Sale

He's not a Top 10 prospect this year. They don't do that trade last year, but this year they might.

Okay I can agree with that. In fact I'll go one better - SP prospects tend to be overvalued relative to positional players I think. I bet it would be harder to get the fish to do a 1 for 1 swap if they were still both prospects. But I think some of the shine is off ECab based on how he's pitched this year. If the fish were to pick up a better option (Verlander with the Mets eating all the salary?) they might move on from ECab for the right package - especially if it included a major league starter who filled a position of need. The fish are dead last in WAR from 3b (-2.3) and could use an upgrade there.

You mean like this one?? https://www.mlb.com/news/jorge-lopez-traded-by-orioles-to-twins Contending team - check Contender trades all star for 4 prospects - check I guess Elias isn't smart enough to know your quality over quantity rule.

Go back to the original post. I didn't propose Westburg for ECab. I just said I wouldn't make that trade and asked whether the O's have the depth to swing a trade headlined with Urias instead. I actually am not a big fan of ECab. Just throwing it out for discussion which was apparently a mistake given how passionately you feel about it.

Granted. I just think the O's have the depth beyond their Top 100 guy to swing a trade like this. If not those 3 guys, then Pham, Beavers, Wagner, McFarland, etc.

Is there a way to realistically get all the AAA talent into productive roles at the big league level? I'm seriously asking. C Adley 1b Mayo 2b Westy ss Ortiz (Holliday) 3b Gunnar RF Hjerstad CF Mullins (Fabian) LF Hayes (Cowser) DH / backup C Basallo Util Norby Util Ohearn With injuries and the likelihood that some of our prospects will struggle in the majors, isn't it good to have that kind of depth?

That's actually a good question. By stats alone, he's been inferior so far in his career to Bradish. He's got tons of upside, but who knows if he's the 2022 guy that pitched to a 3.01 ERA / 1.07 WHIP (albeit in only 71.2 IP) or the 2023 guy that's rocking a 4.74 ERA / 1.42 WHIP. I was just answering the questions about Westburg for ECab which is a trade I wouldn't do. I believe that 6 years of Westy is more valuable than 3+ years of an ECab that might end up being 4.00 ERA / 1.3 WHIP guy over his career.

You have no idea if my counter is laughable until you know who the XXs are.

Let me put it another way. Would you trade Kjerstad + Westburg + Hall for the guys the Nats got from the Padres?

I wouldn't do Westburg for ECab, but the fish do need infield help. Would we do Edward Cabrera for Ramon Urias + X non-top 100 prospects?

Agreed, but maybe they do care about salary to the extend that it will open up room to attempt to get Ohtani?

Kendall Graveman to the Astros: https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2023/07/white-sox-trade-kendall-graveman-astros.html

You have to think that the Mets would ship both of them out for next to nothing in return for any team willing to eat a big chunk of their salary. If the O's really want to upgrade their staff for a WS run this year without giving up the farm (literally) then this is an option. And short of a (now impossible) Ohtani trade, its hard to imagine any move(s) that would excite O's fans (and the baseball world in general) more than acquiring one or both of the Mets $43M starters. Of course - given the O's history this is just a fantasy (until it isn't).

I think Elias will make some deals, but I think he's not going to move more than 1 of our Top 100 prospects. You have to believe that the O's could have gotten Giolito for Norby+ given what the Angels gave up. That tells me Elias isn't shipping out a Top 100 prospect for a rental.