Jammer7
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Posts posted by Jammer7
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I was not, and am not, “pro-Frazier signing.” I simply am not ready to throw bricks at Elias for it. I assume there is a big reason they believe in him and his ability to turn things around. Frazier has looked very good defensively, and weak offensively. I was shocked at how much he signed for. We’ll see if he can work through some things and come out the better end of things. How long am I willing to wait and see? It depends on how everything else is going. If others are hitting well, and our record is good, I can see him getting until mid-June to figure it out. A hitter needs time to make changes and have them become a reaction without thought during their process.
I would love to see Westburg start on Opening Day. I do not think he is even an average 2B with the new rules, though. I like him much better at 3B.
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My first thought was Hays. If it's Frazier or Mateo, the silence here will be deafening.
As far as pitchers, Gibson is my pick. It would not surprise me if Kremer and Bradish take big leaps forward this year.
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1 hour ago, Frobby said:
Especially in spring training, I kind of separate the walks and the K’s. A lot of guys walk less frequently in the spring because their main goal is to get their swing and timing down, so they may swing at stuff they’d take during the season. In Westburg’s case, he walked a healthy 70 times last year (11.3% compared to 6.7% this spring). He struck out 23.6% of the time last year, 26.7% this spring. Not the spring ratios you’d want to see, but they’re not horrible when you consider that when he hits it, he’s scalding the ball.
Agreed. In addition, he is seeing some pitchers for the first time. Early, you want to see the ball deep, and see as many pitches as you can.
I have no doubt he will make adjustments at the ML level and be an excellent player at some point this season. Watching him work his at bats, he’s patient and has a great approach. I’d love to see him break camp and go North with the club. I think he’s just about ready. I just want to know what Elias has in mind with all of this.
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11 minutes ago, Ripken said:
I am as excited to see the walk as I am the 109 mph single. That means he has 12 K’s to 3 walks in 41 plate appearances. SSS and all, but that is a bit of an issue to me.
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3 hours ago, Frobby said:
I completely believe in veteranosity. But ideally, you’d get from (1) a well above-average player at a position of need, or (2) a dirt cheap player. Frazier is neither. $8 mm seems like a big overpay for veteranosity given the alternatives we had. That said, I’m still looking forward to having a better player than Odor at 2B, and will enjoy Frazier’s low K rate.
I really do hate the fact that this thread isn’t more focused on the good spring Westburg is having, especially lately.
That was why I mentioned Frank Robinson and Dustin Pedroia. I agree that Frazier was a curious move for the money. And like you, I am waiting to see what happens before making any judgement. Somehow, that makes me an Elias apologist. Whatever.
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33 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:
More veteranosity BS to me. You don't spend $8 million on veteranosity.
Well, its a real thing, Tony. Call it what you want. I'm not saying Frazier is a great expenditure, as that remains to be seen. But, very successful and smart baseball executives and managers believe this to be a valuable commodity.
@Can_of_cornFrazier's clubhouse presence/stature has been widely reported. I do not see the need to provide any links to anything as it is easy to find it. Do a better search, its easy to find. I listen to so many pods, read so many things, I cannot possibly remember them all. I don't have the time or see the need to look for it. Disregard this post and any other posts you choose.
I actually spoke with an unnamed baseball executive, an Assistant GM, recently, on various topics. We got to speaking about the Orioles underwhelming offseason. He made it a point to mention Frazier, McCann and Gibson as having qualities of value inside the clubhouse. He went on to say that winning teams have more than talent, and that they have learned how to win. That entails doing their business a certain way, professionally, each day. From their preparation in the offseason to how they handle their day-to-day activities on and off the field. Coaches can only do so much. Veteran players have great value beyond their numbers on the back of the baseball card.
Fans cannot measure the impact of that easily, and I get why you are so critical of it. I am curious what Elias sees in Frazier's ability to justify $8 million myself. I was quite surprised at that figure. I also want to see Westburg, Ortiz and Norby get opportunities. Elias is not quite ready to commit to them, for whatever reason. But there is a process for rookies, and they have adjustments to make to be impactful on a winning team.
As a fan, I just want this team to win, and do so for a long time. I think back to some comments from Dustin Pedroia in an interview several years ago at the end of his career. He was asked about how he developed his routine and how he became a leader on the field and in the clubhouse. He said that when he came into the Red Sox roster, he was shown the right way to go about his business and how to play winning baseball at the ML level. He said he improved greatly by simply having a good routine. I do not remember who his veteran leader was, but it was not someone who was a household name for average fans. He credited that former player with building that winning culture that lead to their WS championships. I want that.
Ideally, we want players like Frank Robinson, who was largely credited with the same kind of impact on the 1966 Orioles. We want guys with All Star credentials who are also veteran leaders. Those guys are very expensive for a cheap ownership group at this time. At some point, I expect them to bring in someone of that caliber. Until then, you get Rougned Odors and Adam Fraziers.
As a side note, how many walk offs did Odor have last year? Was it four, or five? I have no argument on Chirinos and Bemboom after the first few weeks. They were a step up from Severino, but anemic production. Chirinos' defense was not so great either. The Aguilar signing was awful. It was what it was, and your point is well made.
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Westburg has hit pretty well in Spring Training, absolutely. Cool. So is Franchy Cordero, Josh Lester and Ryan O’Hearn. So did Jake Fox, and many others, in the past. lol
Don’t get me wrong, I want him to get opportunities too. There are many times when he reminds me of Cal Ripken with his body language and mannerisms. When I watch him, he just seems to move like him. Weird how he makes me think of Cal, but now I cannot unsee it.
How many walks does Westburg have this Spring? Two, to go with 12 K’s. SSS and all. Is he ready? Maybe, maybe not. A lot of growing pains for rookies like him. Elias bought an asset in Frazier with hopes he’ll turn things around and probably move him at the deadline, at least that makes some sense to me. Frazier is the better 2B defensively, no question about that. With all of the young pitchers, they obviously value that defense. Urias is a tick below average at 2B for me if used there everyday. Frazier is known as a great mentor to these young guys. And that matters to them too, even if it’s a big joke around here.
With all of the talk around here about Westburg’s arm being below average, I’ve been watching the limited games we have gotten a chance to see. I see a tick above average arm myself. I have not seen him make many throws from the different angles an elite middle infielder would need to be able to make. I don’t love him at 2B, better on the left side for me, probably a 3B. A little less athletic than I expected as far as quickness and lateral movement, but he moves well enough for a bigger guy. Kinda like Cal that way. He’s a grinder who doesn’t make things look easy, but he’s a ball player.
If Elias moves Mateo to Atlanta for a good package, Urias to Houston for a good prospect, Frazier goes wherever, and Hyde puts Westburg at 3B and Henderson at SS with Ortiz at 2B, that would make me happy. There will be some growing pains for sure. The pitchers will have to get some extra outs at times, but so be it. I just don’t think that now is quite the time for that yet.
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6 hours ago, dystopia said:
You're a better man than me, then, because I got to admit, for the life of me I can't understand how the first thought to hearing this news would be "let's trade Bautista to them!"
In effing March.
Well, no. But I do understand civility.
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10 hours ago, RZNJ said:
My feeling is that it’s likely all of Cowser, Cordero, Cameron, Lester, Diaz, and O’Hearn go to Norfolk. Haskin is also a possibility as the poor guy OPSd over .800 in AAA. Mazara offers the least defensively from this whole group. His calling card early in his career was some power. I can’t think of a good reason to keep him around but who knows.
You’re probably right. It is fairly crowded. A nice mix of prospects, upside and veterans. Have you seen any legit info on the opt outs for Cordero or Mazara? Cordero might just be in Boston on OD. Maybe, at Vavra’s expense.
Haskin is underrated, definitely. He should be in AAA, but it would not shock me if he starts in Bowie due to the logjam. I forget where I read it, but I believe it said Haskin has the 5th highest OPS of O’s minor leaguers. That surprised me a bit.
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2 hours ago, CharmCityHokie said:
Mazara signed a minor league deal, so he doesn't really have a choice about being reassigned to AAA unless he has an opt-out (which is possible given his major league time). O'Hearn and Cordero are going to be hanging around Norfolk too unless one of them makes the 26-man over Vavra (entirely possible). It's a crowded competition for both the 26-man and the AAA roster it seems, and that's a good thing in my opinion.
Right. Certainly, the opt out is an issue. I’m just saying that I think it depends on what they think he might be capable of doing. Maybe he sticks in AAA until June 1 or so, then opts out. They could just release him at the end of camp and move on. They still have guys like Neustrom and Fontana, and the prospect of Cordero and O’Hearn being in Norfolk as you said. It will be interesting to see how it shakes out.
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With Mazara, it depends for me. Depends on whether it is between a guy like Neustrom or Mazara, maybe. What is his attitude like? Is there some remaining upside? Is he willing to go down to AAA and work on some deficiencies?
I mean, neither is likely long for the organization, but if you want to keep one for a few months because there is some upside there and you want the veteran depth. It should be a little interesting to see who remains in the organization after camp.
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Melanie Newman and Dave Johnson should not work together. That was possibly the worst tv broadcast game I have ever watched. They give you nothing about the actual goings on of the game. No dead air…at all. They talked non-stop about so many trivial things, and even my 12 year old son was annoyed. We were at a tournament all day, and came home excited to watch the replay. Absolutely awful. I had to FF through much of it just to see the last two innings to see Westburg, Kjerstad and Cowser.
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44 minutes ago, waroriole said:
Not sure why you’re so defensive. It’s definitely just a response to Stuff+. Not sure how to rely on a metric that tells me Baumann has plus stuff.
He does have great stuff. If he can command it, not leave it in the middle of the zone, he’ll be very good. Stuff doesn’t mean that he is dominant.
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My thoughts, it’s time. A good move for Mike. His FB/slider combo will be much better in the pen than as a starter. Never really had a third pitch, something off speed, he could command. Many here figured he’d end up in the pen, so not a surprise.
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Just now, Can_of_corn said:
Even for a non-contender that isn't a deal you look to make.
Right, unless you really have little faith in the arm you trade, so trade on a high.
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I understand the thought, Doc, but we have to transition to being a contender. I want the Mountain in our own pen for a few years.
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I picked Heston, but I can see Meyer being very good too. We’ll see. Torkelson looks lost right now.
I wanted Martin, but lost faith in the glove and position. I wanted Asa Lacy or Zac Veen just before the draft. Lacy has been bad, and Veen has been really good. I got to watch Veen and Dylan Crews play some for the Scorpions in HS, fun to watch them hit.
Hard to say what Lacy, or anyone else, would have done in the Orioles developmental program. I remember being a little surprised at Heston being the pick, but I had not seen him in 2020. I went back and watched the video, and I was very impressed. Good for him to be back on track!
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1 hour ago, Moose Milligan said:
Just got an alert from espn that minor leaguer Luis Ortiz has passed away at age 20 from cancer.
Yes, the former touted LHP who signed for $400K in 2019. He died from Leukemia, according to what I have read.
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Mullins played 159 and 156 games the past two seasons, respectively. So, yes, he is going to wear down and his sprint speed is going to dip. Not many players today play that many games, but his bat has been too important to Baltimore. I get all of the “he’s 28 yoa and we’re not going to extend him and he’s peaked” talk, and perhaps we should be shopping him.
I would be surprised if Mullins, Hays or Santander is still in the roster when the Orioles are serious WS contenders. I will say that all three are just learning how to take care of themselves to last 162 games, and how to play through being dinged up. I could probably see Hays and Mullins having 3-4 more good years before an obvious decline happens. Santander is harder to say, with his inconsistent offseason workout goals. He gets leaner, the next year he sells out to get bigger, and this year it seems more lean and limber.
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39 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:
This could mean two things in my mind. They feel Westburg has more value in trade if he's considered a 3B/SS/2B infielder and also that they do NOT view him as a first base option if something happens to Mountcastle or if he struggles badly this year.
I think it would be bad if O'Hearn/Lewis/rest of the cast of 1B rejects are getting everyday PAs playing first base with the Orioles while Westburg is tearing it up in AAA while being blocked at 3B/SS/2B.
I don’t really see Westburg at 1B, not now anyway. If there is no room for him in the Orioles infield plans, trade him. Or, they introduce him to the OF. Maybe in a super UT role, or permanent switch to OF. I mean, the guy is a very good athlete, and the consensus seems to say the bat is going to play. Find a spot for him, somewhere. Perhaps the arm plays better from the OF, a longer throwing motion.
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9 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:
You must have missed a certain poster talking about all the HR he gave up on the road.
I don’t get on here much. Every thread ends up being the same garbage. Everything is stupid, etc…
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6 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:
Irvin's career rate is 37.3%
Gibson does throw a ton of ground balls but he's only one man.
That's fair. I mistakenly thought Irvin was more of a 2S guy, but not much of a GB rate.
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5 hours ago, emmett16 said:
I think having two guys that can capably play the most demanding defensive position (that isn’t C)is only a good thing. SS takes a toll and keeping a defender fresh can only help IMO. I don’t think you lose an edge by taking a break a couple times a week.
I agree with this, to a point. Mateo looked worn down last year by July or so. Maybe dinged up in the collision he had around then. The thing you can lose is timing at the plate, depends on the number of days in between, at least for some guys anyway. He strikes me as a guy who wants to be "the man" at SS and he needs relatively everyday at bats as he did not thrive in a bench or UT role. I don't think that ownership is a bad thing at all, honestly. Can he put that pride away? IDK.
I do not like a guy playing SS one day, and then 3B another. These are very different positions. It affects a lot of things, like feeds to the 2B on double plays or whatever. Does Gunnar make some of the plays that Mateo made to get the young pitchers out of innings? IDK, maybe.
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6 hours ago, forphase1 said:
I doubt any deal is in the works. But it's simple, he's fantastic with the glove, but so poor with the bat it's just hard to have him in the lineup consistently if there are viable options. Playing Gunnar over Mateo at short makes the overall team better. Sure, the defense takes a small step back, but the offense takes a giant leap forward. That said, I'm not sure I like moving Gunnar from 3rd, but if you ask me who I'd rather be on the bench more, Mateo or Urias, to make room for Gunnar, I'm sitting Mateo. I think Mateo needs to come out of the gate quickly, swinging a hot bat, or else he's going into a utility/part time role, Pending injuries of course.
I get that Gunnar’s bat is better, absolutely. Well said post. I think Mateo still has upside with his bat, and there is good value in a trade with him.
Personally, I am also not a big fan of moving the SS and 3B around often to other positions at the MLB level. I guess we’ll see how it goes.
The competition this Spring will be something I watch closely. Gunnar is the future, somewhere. Urias might just figure out how to get the ball in the air more to take advantage of his exit velo. Mateo was fun to watch last year, and I want to see if playing five days a week can help him learn better swing decisions. It may not be likely, but he made huge strides in his first everyday chance to play SS. Ortiz will make someone expendable soon.
Adam Frazier 2023
in Orioles Talk
Posted
Something else he did today that was important. His first at bat, he saw 11 pitches, I believe. He struck out on a nasty 2S than ran back over the inside corner. That is a great AB to me, along with his counting stats today. Yeah, it’s one game, but he showed some things that are valuable beyond the stat line.