Criticism of Duquette

[russ snyder]

Most of the stuff you mentioned if the NFL draining EVERY - LAST - PENNY out of its customers. The reason football became huge is every game is an event. It works great on commercial TV, its timed making it easy to schedule. You have built-in commercial breaks that are a boon for advertisers, and simple supply of games make every seat artificially scarce thus driving up the prices and forcing the league to make the TV product just that much better because they know that is how a large majority of the fan base will usually follow the team.

What we see now is the NFL taking that "event" lesson and really going insane and disgusting with it. The draft is stupid, I'm sorry it is. After the first round it is a giant waste of time. It is the same for baseball too. Drafts are boring. And if you don't believe me, just watch the intro to Sunday Night Football on NBC - my God, that is simply the most annoying, ridiculous, ludicrous, nightmare. WHY IS IT SO LONG?! WHY?!

The reason, it is another minute for Verizon to flash a logo at you.

I agree with all of this. I have to give the NFL credit. They managed to make an event out of the draft. It is boring, yet it is shown live on two cable networks. ( ESPN and the NFL) The Sunday Night Football introduction reminds me of the concerts that the NFL has on its opening night. That's another "event" that I forgot to mention. Remember all of the moaning about the Ravens not being able to host the NFL Opening Night this year? What an injustice to the team and the city!

[SilentJames]

It's all about marketing and tailoring your game to that marketing.

Why do you think the rules are geared towards offense in the NFL? Why do you think QB's are protected? They get the fact its about action and making things happen.

You know we all sit here and blast guys like McGuire, Clemens, Sosa, Raffy and rightfully so to some extent but the reality is that baseball was desperate at that point and INTENTIONALLY turned a blind eye to the use of PED's because it they learned it helped market the sport (the resulting increase in offense etc).

I find it laughable that all the owners, GM's, writers etc act as if they are some kind of purists who never went along with the idea of PEDS use. When guys like Brady Anderson started hitting 50 HR and suddenly Bonds/Sosa etc is wacking 60+ like its no problem you either can bury your head in the sand and pretend like these guys are doing it on their own or realize that a sudden and massive spike in numbers like that are likely due to some kind of PED. Maybe the average fan was not aware they were available at that point but writers, GM's and people who follow sports did.

It was only once the outrage started with the everyday fan that everyone decided to stand for purity in the sport, pretended like they never benefited. Hell half the guys standing on their soap box now about Clemens, Bonds and the bunch made their careers covering them guys in their heyday on PEDS. They were either very very stupid or just looking the other way while the golden goose was laying its eggs. I am guessing its the later.

You're absolutely right. And they paid the price for it. Baseball is a different thing than football. And I am okay with that. Most people really are. It doesn't have to be number one, I don't care if it is, no one should.

I would rather baseball be They Might Be Giants (slightly unknown but awesome quality) of sports, than the Nickleback (ya'know Nickleback... sheesh.).

[SilentJames]

I agree with all of this. I have to give the NFL credit. They managed to make an event out of the draft. It is boring, yet it is shown live on two cable networks. ( ESPN and the NFL) The Sunday Night Football introduction reminds me of the concerts that the NFL has on its opening night. That's another "event" that I forgot to mention. Remember all of the moaning about the Ravens not being able to host the NFL Opening Night this year? What an injustice to the team and the city!

It really annoys me. Like I watched that intro, i was physically ill. It's so ridiculous, its just so over-the-top and cheesy. But not fun cheesy, like, we are trying WAY TOO HARD cheesy.

[russ snyder]

It's all about marketing and tailoring your game to that marketing.

Why do you think the rules are geared towards offense in the NFL? Why do you think QB's are protected? They get the fact its about action and making things happen.

You know we all sit here and blast guys like McGuire, Clemens, Sosa, Raffy and rightfully so to some extent but the reality is that baseball was desperate at that point and INTENTIONALLY turned a blind eye to the use of PED's because it they learned it helped market the sport (the resulting increase in offense etc).

I find it laughable that all the owners, GM's, writers etc act as if they are some kind of purists who never went along with the idea of PEDS use. When guys like Brady Anderson started hitting 50 HR and suddenly Bonds/Sosa etc is wacking 60+ like its no problem you either can bury your head in the sand and pretend like these guys are doing it on their own or realize that a sudden and massive spike in numbers like that are likely due to some kind of PED. Maybe the average fan was not aware they were available at that point but writers, GM's and people who follow sports did.

It was only once the outrage started with the everyday fan that everyone decided to stand for purity in the sport, pretended like they never benefited. Hell half the guys standing on their soap box now about Clemens, Bonds and the bunch made their careers covering them guys in their heyday on PEDS. They were either very very stupid or just looking the other way while the golden goose was laying its eggs. I am guessing its the later.

Right. Baseball marketed the home run. We had a couple of home run chases and the Home Run Derby became a showcase event at the All Star Game. Further, there is no doubt that almost everyone in baseball was complicit during the boom in Offense that was apparently fueled by steroids.

I think the only think that went wrong with this was that it's least likeable star ( Barry Bonds) made a mockery of some of the most sanctified record in the sport . ( the Home Run Record) People were not outraged when McGwire and Sosa broke Maris' record during their loefest. However, the hated Bonds hitting 73 could not be stomached.

Like you said, baseball is a game of acquired taste. To enjoy it, one must embrace some of the nuances of the sport. One issue that I alluded to before is the fact that the defense controls the ball. It's the only sport that I know of where this takes place. Maybe MLB should raise the mound and market how difficult it is to hit a baseball.

[russ snyder]

It really annoys me. Like I watched that intro, i was physically ill. It's so ridiculous, its just so over-the-top and cheesy. But not fun cheesy, like, we are trying WAY TOO HARD cheesy.

You know it's cheesy when they show Eli Manning tossing a TD pass from a platform in Week 17 when he's thrown close to 30 interceptions.

[Redskins Rick]

Right. Baseball marketed the home run. We had a couple of home run chases and the Home Run Derby became a showcase event at the All Star Game. Further, there is no doubt that almost everyone in baseball was complicit during the boom in Offense that was apparently fueled by steroids.

I think the only think that went wrong with this was that it's least likeable star ( Barry Bonds) made a mockery of some of the most sanctified record in the sport . ( the Home Run Record) People were not outraged when McGwire and Sosa broke Maris' record during their loefest. However, the hated Bonds hitting 73 could not be stomached.

Like you said, baseball is a game of acquired taste. To enjoy it, one must embrace some of the nuances of the sport. One issue that I alluded to before is the fact that the defense controls the ball. It's the only sport that I know of where this takes place. Maybe MLB should raise the mound and market how difficult it is to hit a baseball.

Dont forgot the ball was juiced too, not just the players.

raise the mound back to what it was.

Bring back the 1 1/2 hour games, and the scores of 2-1.

[Redskins Rick]

You know it's cheesy when they show Eli Manning tossing a TD pass from a platform in Week 17 when he's thrown close to 30 interceptions.

Yeppers, but playing as Peyton and dropping back and finding Harrison, Wayne or Clark in the End Zone, now that was fun.

[russ snyder]

Dont forgot the ball was juiced too, not just the players.

raise the mound back to what it was.

Bring back the 1 1/2 hour games, and the scores of 2-1.

I wonder how much uproar there will be if someone posts an ERA of 1.50 or so.

[Redskins Rick]

I wonder how much uproar there will be if someone posts an ERA of 1.50 or so.

Not much.

People love excitement, the love watching the home team hit 4 three run bombs and blow the other team out.

[russ snyder]

Not much.

People love excitement, the love watching the home team hit 4 three run bombs and blow the other team out.

Sorry. I was being kind of sarcastic.

Yeah, I think most casual fans would complain about the lack of offense if they made it tougher to hit.

[Flosman]

I think these Football/Baseball debates are always interesting. Everyone is so sure that they understand which sport is more popular and what makes it so. Football is clearly the most popular american sport even in Baltimore. Why is that the case, well football provides more instant gratification. The games bring more resolution, each game having much greater meaning than an individual baseball game. The determination of failure is more accurate and complete in a football game. Teams are judged more completely based on the game that day. The attraction is the fan at the end of the game obtains a greater feeling of resolution. This goes hand in hand with the violent nature of the game stemming from the human war mythology concluding in the heroic victory of the protagonist or the vanquishing of our hero by the antagonist. The NFL (and even college) players are literally godlike (in the Greek sense) in their physical abilities and the foes they face on a weekly bases.

Each individual baseball game is just a stretch on the course of a marathon. Failure in baseball is expected and even accepted has part of the game. We really never get resolution from an individual game. It is a game about overcoming human failure. The attraction is observing the struggle. Real baseball fans understand this at least on some level and people that don't get this feel unsatisfied by following the game. I personally believe baseball fans are more invested in their teams than football fans.

Football was the perfect game for America post WW2 in our culture became very competitive and fast paced. Fans with a limited time investment could observe what they perceived as illustration of the cut throat world they experienced in everyday life. Limited bandwidth TV was perfect for Football, or more correctly Football was perfect for limited bandwidth TV. The idea that football's position in our culture is related to a video game is crazy talk. TV and violent competition made football and until recently when bandwidth became less of an issue baseball had a huge disadvantage. Calculate how many hours of game coverage are necessary to cover the MLB until recently that sort of bandwidth was not available. Baseball fans followed boxscores and radio largely for decades. Baseball is currently cashing in on the availability of bandwidth. Baseball still is a game that real fans have to invest themselves greatly to get the satisfaction that football provides most.

So the NFL probably stays king for the foreseeable future but baseball is doing just fine and neither is going anywhere any time soon. Baseball is a pass time whereas football is a string of events. It is easier to be a fan of Football it really is as simple as that, IMO.