Pickles

He's pitched well in an extremely small sample size.

Pepiot couldn't sniff Grayson' jock in terms of value.

Outrageous free agent contracts could easily be interpreted to mean the O's should be hanging on to their prospects.

I don't know about that, but there are things to like about him and he would probably upgrade the rotation.

Santander is probably considered an impact bat; Hays and Mountcastle you could probably sell as "impact" position players- in that they're above average regulars.

Are any of those guys considered impact bats?

Somebody's lying then.

We're at page 85. Santander is about the 17th guy to get a deep dive.

It's a factor to consider but is no certainty, and isn't crazy valuable anyway.

Maybe. Players tend to like longer contracts and more guaranteed money for a number of reasons.

I remember that thread, and I believe I said 4/80, which others suggested was too high, and perhaps with hindsight they were correct. I'm still fairly confident, if Santander has another season as he has the last two, he'd get a multi-year deal that made turning down the QO the smart thing to do. Something I think that would lend to that is something that hasn't been discussed, but he would in this hypothetical hit the market being viewed as a "winner"/a "winning player." He would be seen as a young vet leader that was instrumental in one of the historic turnarounds the game has ever seen. It's not everything, but it's something. Nobody is going to have to worry about fitting in the clubhouse, or committed to winning, etc.

I think 3/45 would be the lowend of what he's looking at with another "typical" season, and yeah, I think he'd take that over 1/20.

I'm not sure I agree with that. If he puts up another 30 Hr 30 2b season, he'd be looking at multiyear deals that far outstripped 20 in total value.

Well I guess I have to define solid. I'd put solid in the ~20% range. I definitely think there's a 1 in 5 chance that Wells is better than Cease next year. Second, ok I just wanted to confirm.

As a third piece for Dylan Cease? LOL. Yeah, he's got a solid chance of being better than Cease next year on his own. That's madness.

Oh please. You want to say even though Cowser has long been a better prospect than the other guy, because of six weeks of their first taste of the MLs, suddenly those years of evaluations are wrong. Sorry, but you are mistaken. Again, if anybody I'm in talks with starts talking about "Cowser only hit .188 this year" then you walk away because they're not negotiating in good faith.

Well last year's "decline" was based solely on him missing some time with injuries. Now if that continues, yeah it's a problem.

Again, if anybody I'm dealing with tries to discount Cowser because of his ML time, then I'm not engaging with them in a serious way because they're not serious people.

I probably overestimated Glasnow in regards to Cease, as @StottyByNature, has likewise pointed out. IMO, Cowser and Ortiz is 2x the value of what the Rays just received for Glasnow and I don't believe Cease has 2x the value of Glasnow. Some people might, and I can't argue it, because it's an opinion and a valid one.

Sure, but if anybody is going to discount Cowser based on 78 ML PAs then you walk away.

Well, in that case you'd probably be comfortable giving up Cowser and Ortiz. As you said, reasonable minds can disagree.

Neither do you, but you don't let that stop you from saying it isn't an overpay, so by your own standards, you're being foolish. And that's where we differ. I'd rather not get him than give up more than he's worth. IMO, Cowser and Ortiz can have prominent roles on this team going forward. I'm not COMPELLED to give that up for Cease. He's not the only pitcher in the world, and I don't think we need to upgrade the rotation for the regular season, but I agree with you and others we should be looking to upgrade the playoff rotation. If something doesn't get done this offseason, there's always the deadline and perhaps a more favorable opportunity.

LOL. Says who? History would suggest the exact opposite. Pepiot was a top 60 guy coming into this year and was oft-injured. Cowser was a top 30 guy who had a very good AAA season and made his ML debut. Pepiot has nowhere near the value of Cowser.

Imagine being so stupid you got played by John Angelos.

Sure, it's the Rays doing what the Rays do. But it also tells us about the trade market, because obviously, the Rays took the best deal they could get. If this is the best deal they could get for Glasnow, then it suggests that Cowser/Ortiz is a serious overpay for Cease.