Jammer7
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Posts posted by Jammer7
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6 minutes ago, Bahama O's Fan said:
What can Severino do that Sisco can't?
He hablas. I think the only reason he is still here is his salary, but he is certainly more athletic than Chance. Maybe, the hope is that he regains the approach he had in the first month of 2020. Maybe it is just for some form of continuity. I was once a fan of Pedro, but that seems like a long time ago.
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1 minute ago, Can_of_corn said:
Thanks! That bio says he is known as a tough negotiator. It is always interesting to see how these shake out. You have to believe Lawlar has a bottom line number in mind. He is generally seen as a top 5 pick, but the number 1-2 talent. I tend to doubt that Elias will pay him slot, but if he falls to #5, he should.
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1 minute ago, Can_of_corn said:
Greg Genske
Is he with Boras Corp?
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7 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:
Slot for the top five runs from 8.4 to 6.1 million. That is a ton of money to turn down to go to school.
Agreed, but he doesn't have to take below slot. He is 19, so he would re-enter the draft in 2023. He has leverage, but perhaps he accepts a slightly below slot deal if he likes the direction of things in the organization. I wonder who his advisor is.
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45 minutes ago, wildcard said:
Jonathan Mayo June 16th Mock Draft
5. Orioles: Jordan Lawlar, SS, Jesuit Prep (Dallas)
There’s still a lot of buzz the Orioles could cut a deal here, and many feel they like Davis on the college bat end, but here’s saying they’ll lean Lawlar, the top prep hitter available, over Vandy’s Kumar Rocker.I wonder if his number is a little higher than others want to pay. If that is the reason, there is less chance he ends up an Oriole. A Vanderbilt commit, generally seen as the top talent available. The Witt comparisons are not that great. I think he is more of a Barry Larkin type guy.
From what I have read, some think this draft has great value after the first round with depth for many rounds after. If Elias pays full slot, it limits what he can do through round 10, depthwise. But, maybe this is a year where he pays at full slot, or close to it, for a guy like Lawlar. How many chances do you get at a guy like this?
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Neustrom hit a very long home run, maybe two weeks ago, completely out of a ballpark. So, he does have tremendous power, just has trouble getting to it in games. Let’s see how he finishes. If Grenier can make major strides, perhaps Neustrom can make more consistent hard contact in the coming months. He was injured for large part of 2019, so maybe he just needs a little time.
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So, is the tweet legit? Or is it just noise? @Legend_Of_Joey, can you say if this tweet has any credibility to your direct knowledge? Has any Orioles player spoken up about some mistreatment or neglect? Not asking for names, of course.
I have known players in rookie ball who had host families. I always thought A ball and above the guys either had hotels with roommates, or four guys got together and shared an apartment. Of course those players also worked in the off season to make money as well.
The only time a team used to provide housing was in Spring Training, or instructs. We now see the Dominican Academy will provide it, which is I believe is great. Those are kids from a variety of generally poor backgrounds. It protects the investment and gives them a chance to succeed.
Keep in mind the player salaries are for March through September. So, $20K for seven months is not that bad to start. I remember in the 1980’s minor league players made about what I made as an E4 in the military. So, painting these guys as victims, well that is ridiculous. If they are not paying enough for your liking, find another job. Minor league baseball is not a social program. It is an opportunity. Perhaps there can be reasonable advances made, and I can advocate that, certainly. But these players are adults, not kids. Their family should be providing assistance and guidance. Since when are the team officials responsible for being the players parent? They should certainly assist within reason, but what is the average age of a AA player, 23 or 24? What is the age of personal accountability?
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I agree, as a general rule, that we need to draft the BPA. But, what does that mean to Elias? Is that the best player right now? The best player based on projection? The best overall value over the next ten years? IDK, depends on which players are drafted ahead of us. Depends on the year.
Is he feeling good enough about the depth of the farm to go BPA instead of under slot? Maybe he feels that his choices are not worthy of the slot the team holds in round 1, and that his chances of getting over slot value in rounds 2-5 may provide better value for their dollar. I think some of the Oriole rumors out there are all about posturing for the ongoing negotiations between teams and agents. I admit I do not know much about Frelick, other than what i have read and a few videos. I just do not see him as an Elias guy. I think House and Lawlar are more of his type, but perhaps their number is not what he is looking for. Maybe I am wrong.
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4 hours ago, Frobby said:
Well, I think Three Run Homer is right that we need to take the whole season to evaluate whether Westburg or Ortiz is the better prospect. We challenged Ortiz a little by starting him in High A despite not playing above short season A in 2019 and not playing at the alternate site last summer. He hit very well at Aberdeen and is doing a solid job in AA now. With Westburg, a higher draft pick who did play at the alt site last summer, we gave him a conservative low A placement and he quickly showed he was too good for that level. He’s finding High A more challenging in the early going. So, I’d like to see how each of them perform at their current levels before evaluating which one is the better prospect, and how good of a prospect they are.
Don't get me wrong, I agree with you and Three Run Homer. Ortiz was my pick to have a breakout year for the Orioles minor leagues. He is having a wonderful year so far, and that makes me smile. The power he has shown at Bowie is a welcome development. He'll have to continue to produce like he is for the remainder of the year to get on a top 100 list. I'm a fan of Joey Ortiz.
Tools wise, Westburg is certainly the superior prospect. He has struggled in the six games, 30 at bats, so far in Aberdeen. I think it is early to poo poo how he mashed in Delmarva. Lets see what adjustments and progress he makes in the next month or two, certainly. He will get back on track. If my memory is correct, isn't Aberdeen a park that does not yield a lot of home runs?
Ortiz is likely a real candidate to be a SS at the major league level, while Westburg is likely a 3B.
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1 hour ago, bpilktree said:
I didn’t see anyone call him a bust but if you are currently nit on top 100 list and you already got a promotion you need to hit at that level if you want to move up to the top 100. You add in the draft next month putting another 10 guys or so on list it will be tough ask to move up.
The post you quoted was humor, a joke. I was being mildly sarcastic. I thought it was obvious.
Give him some time to make some adjustments. Honestly, I don’t care if he makes it on some list or not. He is going to hit, hit for big power, and defend at an elite level. He will be a major league starting infielder (a 3B for me) within two years. He was in the “just missed” section of this list. So, he’s not far off at this moment. He does everything very well. His tools are undeniable, and his swing is going to work. When he refines the swing decisions, he’ll take off. And he is a better prospect than more than half of the infielders on that list, in my opinion. It is just a matter of time.
It is a weaker draft. One of the weakest drafts in years. No real elite college bats, and not really any college middle infielders of note. The high school infielders will take a while.
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12 hours ago, Three Run Homer said:
Westburg needs to start hitting at Aberdeen to merit being in the top 100. Joey Ortiz is also 22 years old and he's hit very well at both Aberdeen and Bowie this year--maybe he should be in the conversation for top 100.
Yeah, you’re right. Two mediocre weeks in Aberdeen. He’s a bust.
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I don't like the way he has been handled this year either. Second tier prospect or organization guy? I don't know yet, and it doesn't really matter right now. They don't know for sure yet either. I would bet that Elias does not like the way he has had to move Lowther around, but had to do it out of necessity. They had him at the Alternate sight, so they got a good read on where his innings are. I think he is a candidate to replace Paul Fry when he is traded in July. Or perhaps he does that in 2022. Better get him some better sticky stuff, though.
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Sal Frelick at 1-5 would be a bit of a disappointment for me. He is a good player, sure, but at 1-5? A 5-09 speedy (65 grade speed) CF with a 60 hit tool. Has some limited infield time, apparently. A three sport athlete in high school: hockey, baseball and football.
Henry Davis has an ugly caveman swing, but when he barrels it goes. Not sure that swing will work. More strength than quick hands and wrists
FWIW, I think Brady House and Harry Ford are Elias' type of guys. I could even see Khalil Watson. There really isn't a good college bat at the top of the draft, at least not the kind I think Elias would want. I think he is posturing and negotiating to see what he can get House to accept first. Then Ford and Watson after that. In the end, I hope he takes House. That 70 power will look great wherever he plays. Pay him, and ditch the under slot shrewdness. This is a year when you can play it straight. Since they have good depth now, they can afford to gamble a little on some younger talent early. Maybe take a college OF bat like Robbie Martin (FSU) or Isaiah Thomas (Vandy) with the 3rd or 4th round pick.
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He went deep for the second time in two games.
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15 hours ago, sportsfan8703 said:
It’s going to be hard for Westburg to crack the top 100, and for Kjerstad to remain in, with the draft upcoming. Crazy to think that one year after #2 overall that Kjerstad won’t be a “top 100” prospect.
There are several prospects that will move off these lists. Some are in the major leagues, and some are under performing. And perhaps he is just a better player than many on the list right now. It won't bother me either way, but he is legitimate.
As far as Kjerstad, I could see him dropping off if he does not play. That would only be fair. He'll be back.
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51 minutes ago, VaBird1 said:
In the original list he was listed as “Just outside” FWIW. I’m excited about him.
I also wonder if Bradish is able to make these lists before he gets promoted to Baltimore. It doesn't really matter to me, at all, but he's nasty.
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Westburg has to be getting close on these top 100’s.
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Once a very promising prospect, highly ranked infielder. Had shoulder surgery in 2017 and an 80 game suspension for PED’s before the 2020 season. Why not take a look.
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2 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:
Maybe...some offensive talent did develop. If you are really good, you figure it out. Coaching matters a lot..talent matters more.
I didn’t think the team could develop Manny and I didn’t want them draft him because of that...I was wrong. Elite level talent wins out in the end.
This is very true. Manny got his coaching from outside the organization for his offensive improvement. He and Schoop credited Cruz for much of their improvement. I will give Bobby Dickerson a ton of credit for his coaching. He is pure gold.
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Would you trust the former regime minor league/player development staff to coach and develop Gunnar Henderson today? Would they have helped him become the player he has become already to this point? Be honest.
All of this will be a moot point sooner than later. Gunnar will be in high A in a few weeks or so, I would think.
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6 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:
The part I find funny is that Schoop had a 111 OPS+ in 2015 and a 124 OPS+ in 2017. So at 23 and 25 he could hit. How are the struggles he's had since then a product of him reaching the majors at 21?
He's basically been a league average hitter (99 OPS+) for his career.
I am saying he should have been better. There was more there. When he did not try to yank everything, he was much better. This regime would have developed him better and he would be a more productive player in my opinion. His approach was just terrible the majority of his career.
And yes, development can and has happened at the major league level. Of course it does. But to have core members of your team doing this is not meant to happen on a competitive playoff contender in my opinion.
I said what I wanted to say. I’m done with this discussion.
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15 hours ago, survivedc said:
This is starting to border on the absurd. Schoop had like 1700 minor league AB’s. Britton pitched in the minors for 5 seasons. Sisco was a quality minor league batter with over 1500 MiLB AB’s, but it isn’t like there weren’t questions about whether his game would translate.
Some guys just are what they are, and no amount of development was going to turn Schoop into Roberto Alomar or Bobby Doerr.
You misunderstand what I wrote, I think. Schoop was pushed up at the end of his development. He became content to try to yank every pitch. If you are satisfied with that, that’s on you. This regime would have done a much better job developing him into a better hitter, and that is all I am saying.
Britton went to spring training, and he was out of options. Dave Wallace worked extensively with him and helped him to be able to throw strikes. He went from a borderline failed starter to a high leverage reliever.
Disagree all you like. Feel free not to read it then.
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3 hours ago, Ruzious said:
Haskin was a high 2nd round pick, already 22, OPSing .941 in Delmarva with 11 steals in 12 attempts... Is he really going to develop as well and as quickly in Delmarva as he would in Aberdeen?
It’s been a month...draft eligible sophomore with a short college season. Probably won’t be long, though.
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5 hours ago, glenn__davis said:
I think we're largely on the same page. I would disagree about the "terrible development of players not named Machado" line. I think the team has largely been adequate at developing position players. They have been horrendous at developing pitchers, like almost impossibly bad.
I do think myself and others (certainly Can of Corn leading the charge) feel that the team has been too conservative with the placement of their prospects, and that this is unnecessarily delaying the next competitive window. I say that with the full understanding that we don't have all of the pieces to the puzzle. But they essentially acted as if last year didn't happen at all and that no development took place, which is a mistake IMO. We heard that Gunnar was extremely impressive at the camp site last year. Mostly against older more experienced players. Could have been just hype but certainly doesn't look that way right now.
In his case - I'm not interested in "rushing" him. I am interested in him becoming an asset to the big league club as quickly as possible. I think we understate the fact that players develop at the big league level also. So, is a timeline arrival of 2023 a good timeline for him? I guess...but if he gets decent time at AA this year, why not push to start him at AAA next year and starting getting his feet wet in the majors next year? Again, with assumption (not at all a foregone conclusion) that he'll continue to have success.
I mostly like Elias, but I do think he's intentionally slow-playing some of these guys.
I think we are largely on the same page. This regime is very different than what we were used to in Baltimore. The current group is very very respected throughout the industry. People are watching what is happening and others will try to emulate them. Quite a switch from a few years ago when we were in the Stone Age.
The previous regime was terrible in development. Everyone in baseball knew that. They rushed Machado, but his talent kept his head above water until his offense caught up two years later. He was there for the defense to help in a playoff run. They had no other choice but to rush him up with very little time in AA.
Schoop was rushed and his overall offensive game suffered for it. Solid 2B, great arm, one dimensional offensive player. There was a lot more there to develop. Instead, he had two decent years. That was really it.
Dave Wallace saved Zack Britton at the MLB level.
Sisco was handled terribly by DD and Buck. That is why he is where is right now. He is absolutely terrible right now.
Hays was rushed to Baltimore, way before he was ready. Jury is still out on my favorite player because he cannot stay healthy. Learning how to condition yourself and workout and stretch and nutrition is all part of the development cycle.
There are so many things we cannot take for granted after the COVID cancellation of 2020. The Alternate Site can only accomplish so much. They cannot replace game experience against true competition. Yes, the powers that be extolled his improvement, and rightfully so. But that means nothing until he does it against competition. He has begun to do just that. It will not be long.
Sisco DFA’ed
in Orioles Talk
Posted
I would be shocked if they call up either one. That service time thing.