WaPo: Spin Rates and Buy In

[theocean]

4 hours ago, Bradysburns said:

That is nasty. I seriously wonder if Dylan Bundy might not become the ace he was supposed to be... this season. No joke. It feels to me like we've messed with every pitcher's mechanics for years, without having the right information. Now, it's possible Elias can make some changes like these and suddenly, boom. We have our ace... the ace that we were supposed to have originally. 

Interestingly, the Astros' instructions didn't say anything about the pitcher's mechanics, just his pitch selection. I'm sure they work on mechanics, too. But this was a simple pitch-selection issue and it made a huge difference. 

This also makes me wonder about the Kevin Gausman trade again, and what we might have just given up (in potential trade value, or just performance on the field next year). 

I'm starting to think it was no coincidence that our "marginal" players kept finding major success the moment they left this organization. 

But, his time to the plate though...

I remember hearing Elias say on 105.7 that he felt sometimes players get drafted for something they do really well and then the development process makes them change that thing they do really well in order to fit within an organizational philosophy. I couldn't agree more - the Orioles have been really bad about trying to make pitchers be something they aren't. So, I'm really optimistic about what Elias & Co can do with Bundy and others.

[weams]

1 hour ago, Can_of_corn said:

Dan should have been worried about the damage it did to his pitchers' ERA!

It wasn't the 2 seam FB Dan and Co had issues with, it was the Cutter.

Rick Peterson. Pedro's guru.

[Cumberbundy]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Cumberbundy]

Elias, “if you can’t trade for’em, join’em”.

 

2017 Bundy:

Spin me round round Frobby

If only this could be replicated with regularity, perhaps Bundy needs pregame activa?

And because...Bundy’s a wicked pissa 

 

 

[weams]

But Bundy can’t really throw 95 anymore. 

[Cumberbundy]

5 minutes ago, weams said:

But Bundy can’t really throw 95 anymore. 

Fb average was only down half a mph last year from 2017.

 

[Can_of_corn]

5 minutes ago, Cy Bundy said:

Fb average was only down half a mph last year from 2017.

 

Check out the drop from 2016-2017.

http://www.brooksbaseball.net/velo.php?player=605164&time=&startDate=03/30/2007&endDate=01/09/2019&s_type=2

Quote

In 2018, he relied primarily on his Fourseam Fastball (92mph) and Slider (82mph), also mixing in a Change (84mph), Curve (75mph) and Sinker (92mph).

 

[Flash- bd]

Still can't believe that *expletive* Gausman trade. Would've liked to see what a competent organization could've done with his value. Well, I guess we already saw some of that in Atlanta. 

 

What still pisses me off about the Duquette regime is how little value we got from Gausman, Arrieta, Eduardo Rodriguez, and Zach Davies. We actually produced a decent amount of pitching talent in those year but got so little from it. Inexcusable from a low-mid payroll franchise that by definition must punch above its weight. 

[Luke-OH]

3 minutes ago, Flash- bd said:

Still can't believe that *expletive* Gausman trade. Would've liked to see what a competent organization could've done with his value. Well, I guess we already saw some of that in Atlanta. 

I’d argue he wasn’t better in Atlanta, he just had a much better defensive, faced inferior lineups, and got some gimme outs vs pitchers. 

[Can_of_corn]

1 minute ago, Luke-OH said:

I’d argue he wasn’t better in Atlanta, he just had a much better defensive, faced inferior lineups, and got some gimme outs vs pitchers. 

Considering the return and how stacked Atlanta's farm system is I would say the return was light even if you don't think Gausman's superior results are meaningful.

[Flash- bd]

1 minute ago, Luke-OH said:

I’d argue he wasn’t better in Atlanta, he just had a much better defensive, faced inferior lineups, and got some gimme outs vs pitchers. 

Yeah, to be fair, I figured this was probably the case, his FIP there isn't that impressive. Still, I would've liked to see Gausman under a more forward-thinking organization, like the one we should theoretically have under Elias. I don't know if Atlanta fits that bill or not, but the point remains, I would've liked to see him under a different regime and have gotten something more substantial or potentially far more substantial back for him. 

[Luke-OH]

1 hour ago, Can_of_corn said:

Considering the return and how stacked Atlanta's farm system is I would say the return was light even if you don't think Gausman's superior results are meaningful.

I wasn’t arguing that point, but I think O’Day had a negative 8-9M value which significantly effected the prospect return. I’m not thrilled with it either but it wasn’t a fleecing. 

[Can_of_corn]

13 minutes ago, Luke-OH said:

I wasn’t arguing that point, but I think O’Day had a negative 8-9M value which significantly effected the prospect return. I’m not thrilled with it either but it wasn’t a fleecing. 

I wonder what the Slot money was valued at?

Was it just a throw in to make the deal look more palatable or did the O's take that over a more talented return?

[AceKing]

I think they really thought they could get one or both of the Mesa kids, or the Gaston kid, but it backfired on them.

 

i also think think they save a lot of money that they need right now more than Gausman.

30 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I wonder what the Slot money was valued at?

Was it just a throw in to make the deal look more palatable or did the O's take that over a more talented return?

 

[Luke-OH]

1 hour ago, Can_of_corn said:

I wonder what the Slot money was valued at?

Was it just a throw in to make the deal look more palatable or did the O's take that over a more talented return?

I don’t think they valued the slot money particularly highly, maybe a Million, but I could be wrong.