Tony-OH

Does anyone here think Elias will be swayed by anyone not on his staff? In the times I've dealt with him or heard him talk, he seems like a nice guy who will listen to what people may say out of politeness. But make no mistake, he has his process, and a new minority owner who happens to be an Orioles legend is not going to change any of the ways he does business or makes decisions.

Gotta give Nestor credit, no one thinks more highly of himself, but he does bleed Baltimore and I'm sure he's been waiting for this day for a long time. And anyone who can keep himself a float financially while running WNST, God bless him.

I thought I had posted earlier in the thread. I was on vacation down in Florida and really try to disconnect when I'm on vacation as much as possible, but I did mention that I thoughts this was a fantastic for the organization. The only thing I've added is that I have heard the rumblings about a Leonsis angle to all of this so I would not be surprised if he buys some portion or all of MASN. Anything that removes the Angelos' from being in control and brings in an owner who has the funds to actually spend to maintain a winning organization is great news for all of us.

This has been leaking out for months. Remember the threads here about this? Then JA poo-poo'd the idea because he was working the stadium lease in a way to enrich himself the best.

That was probably nothing more than to help with the transfer more than anything else. The Angelos' have owned this Billion-dollar organization for a long time. It's not like they sold a car. I don't think it means much more than he's not just going to go "poof" and they're going to be like, "Where's the keys to the owner's box?"

Truest statement of the thread. The ego is very, very deeply ingrained in an Angelos.

Someone who is obviously in the know with all of this told me to watch for a Leonsis angle coming up soon. I would not be surprised at all if he ends up buying MASN. I just hope he gets rids of this stupid MASN one and MASN two thing and gives each team the same network always.

Aren't you the guy who hates Rubenstein because he liquidated a company you were part of or am I thinking of someone else?

The only way JA would do that is if he thinks it will help his legacy or should I say his family's legacy of ownership. If the Orioles win the World Series this year, he could still claim credit. So thinking that maybe he would allow them to sign a Snell or Montgomery.

You mean the day when Ripken lost his legacy as Mr. Orioles by bashing the actual Mr. Loyal Oriole? Brooks will always be Mr. Oriole because had never had said something like that on National TV even if he thought it. That comment and the fact he never apologized was when I stopped being a fan of Cal. As a part owner, sure, who cares, but no way they would get rid of Elias or force him to bring in Cal in any meaningful role.

Now he can move to Nashville full time and enjoy his money baths!

I've been on vacation so seeing this makes the Ravens loss a lot more palatable. It might not help the Orioles this offseason, but you have to imagine it will help at the trading deadline and next offseason and beyond. Hard to find a downside in a new ownership.

The team was "furious?" First I've ever heard that. But you seem pretty set in your reality of the situation so we'll just have to disagree. Nothing I've read or heard backs anything you've suggested. The team was 2.5 back, but Elias was a seller. What does that tell you? Where did the Orioles end up? Not to mention Mancini was absolutely terrible (and has been since) after the trade and the Orioles now have Chayce McDermott and Seth Johnson in the organization. The Orioles treated Mancini over and beyond during his ordeal, and traded him to a World Series contender right before his value cratered. Mancini ended up with a World Series ring and the Orioles ended up with two prospects. I doubt anyone involved is too upset.

I've never read anything or seen any interaction from Mancini that suggests he holds "bad blood". He was traded to a contender from a team that had very little chance of going to the playoffs (until they started winning more after he was traded). I doubt getting traded to a World Series contender made him upset. Mancini is a smart guy who the Orioles organization supported whole heartily through his cancer situation. He's shown nothing outwardly but admiration for the support of the organization and the fans. But, back to baseball, he probably knows that he has little chance of seeing major league time with the Orioles and yes, it probably would be a little weird seeing him as AAA depth in an organization where he once starred.

I honestly see McDermott similar to the way I saw Hall coming out of 2021 even though Hall was coming off an an injury plagued season. Basically he gets one more season to improve enough to look like a viable starter, but if it's the same old same old, they have to consider using him in the bullpen where his plus stuff should play even if the command is not great.

This is another big point I've made in my argument. The Orioles are no longer rebuilding and Hall fills a valuable role in the bullpen for a contending team. Even if someone holds out hope that Hall will suddenly figure it out and do something he's never done before and become a consistent starting pitcher who can pitch 175 innings, the chances of him doing it this coming year is extremely, extremely small. If this were 2021, I very well may be willing to give Hall another shot at starting and maybe even return him to AAA to work on it, but its' 2024, this team is a contender, and Hall ca be an impact late inning reliever.

Haha, I like Etzel already more than I liked Hart and I'm not sure Etzel is more than a 4th outfielder.

It probably is very low on the list, but at some point, and that point is usually at this time of the year, those priorities are met. I highly doubt making an agreement with Johnson took away from Elias monitoring his cell phone for a Getz call or any other major move.

Why would there be bad blood between Mancini and the Orioles?

Just my hunch, but the Orioles seem to be very keen on having their two best OBP guys at #1 and #2. Until Holliday is deemed ready, I think those two remain at the top of the order. Once Holliday arrives, Gunnar probably move to #3 with Adley staying at #2.

Orioles HoF, sure, 1st ballot let's go. Regular HoF, not in the conversation. At just 32.6 rWAR and 106 OPS+, he was a very good player but not a HoF worthy player. Now don't get me wrong, Harold Baines' inclusion has watered own the HoF a bit (i know Drungo will now tell us 80 more guys who played that were worse but still), but Jones belongs in the hall of pretty good.

This is the time of year that these Veteran players will sign AAA contracts (probably with an invite to spring training) after they realize they are not getting major league ones. Spring training is only 3-4 weeks away so many of these guys want to start planning. Johnson looks like a decent depth piece who can play all three outfield spots. As some one pointed out, he looks like the Daz Cameron guy for 2024. I expect Elias will sign some more of these type, particularly at 1B/3B, middle infield, and maybe another outfielder.

Jim was always a great guy to talk to in the press box. He had such a long career that he knew just about anyone and everyone who came through that press box over the years. He was a smart baseball guy as well, but most importantly, he was one of the nice guys in there. As a quasi-press member for 20+ years while running the Hangout, I wasn't part of the "gang" per se of the local press because I wasn't in the box all the time. Then, because I was one of, if not the original, internet guy with regular press passes (until it was pulled by the Orioles new PR staff tow years ago), many were either dismissive or downright hostile towards me. Don't get me wrong, I wasn't losing sleep over some knuckleheads who thought they were better than me because they worked full time covering the team, but their attitudes helped highlight the genuinely kind people in the box. Jim Henneman certainly fit the category for me. He'd greet me with "Hey guy!" when he saw me, which I never knew was whether that was just his typical greeting or couldn't remember my name, but that's neither here nor there! But I sat and ate with him many times in the press lounge before games and he was always up for a good baseball chat. His knowledge of Orioles history was among some of the best I knew, right up there with Scott Garceau (another fine gentlemen). Either way, I'm happy for him that he's receiving this honor. It's well deserved, and I'm glad he was able to see this for himself.

I don't think is has anything to do with philosophical differences at all. If you are comfortable with a starter that may or may not get you five innings every five days (I know I've done the work before but his ability to get past the 5th in the minors is very, very low and that's against minor league hitters) then he's your guy. If you are comfortable taking a guy and have him become a mediocre starter because of lack of ability to cover innings, vs being an impact left-handed reliever, then he's your guy. You said, "We're talking about a high school pitcher who has 288 IP as a starter under his belt before last season where he was pitching without his real stuff for most of it." You do realize that's because he's not been able to stay healthy to compile those innings, right? You know he's a guy who's velocity has dropped off already from where he was in his first two years in the minors, right? You do know he's had back, shoulder, and even a strained forearm at points in his career, right? Most great closers probably could have been used as a starter and been at least effective enough to be a back of the rotation guy, but they found that their best role was in relief because it maximized what they are good at. Hall is very good at inducing weak contact and missing bats, but that leads to high pitches per inning because he's never had great command. In his 11 starts last year at Norfolk he was able to get past the 5th inning one time, and it took him 98 pitches to complete 6 innings. How many more pitches would it take against major league hitters? He had a 5.5 BB/9 in AAA last year at 5.7 BB/9 in his 11 starts. Some of you point to his improvement at the major league level when he dropped to 2.3/9 as a reason to be hopeful. Maybe the fact that he never pitched more than two innings of threw more than 27 pitches (not including his one long relief outing early in the year where it took him 75 pitches to get three 3 INNINGS!!) had more to do with that improvement than any sudden better command? As for McDermott, he has some of the same concerns and we'll need to see how he does in Norfolk this year before making a final call, but he did show more signs last year of potentially being able to stick as a starter.

Don't get me wrong, you an have any opinion you like and all things considered, I hope you are right and I'm wrong. but you mentioned how his development was interrupted, and it was, by injury multiple times. Guys with high pitch counts and haven't pitched a full season as a starter since Low-A ball, who are 25-years old, in an organization that needs him out of the pen, are all great reasons why the Orioles should shelf any ideas of trying to move him back to a starter's role. He's got a chance to be a Billy Wagner type closer and hopefully will have a nice long career like Wagner in that role.