emmett16

And together we will get the Cease thread to 300+.

Sure. That’s fair. All I’m saying is guys they’ve drafted in the 2nd, 4th, & 5th rounds just might turn out to be better than the guys from round 1.

Gunnar’s not too shabby. Kjerstad & Holliday havn’t done anything. Adley has been great, agreed. The farm system would still be ranked very high w/o Holliday & Kjerstad. The high picks have helped out, no doubt. But the system is ranked so highly because of the depth. I’d say the majority of the posters thought the farm rankings would drop after Adleys promotion and then again after Gunnar’s promotion, but there here we are. Darell Hernaiz (ranked 17th in our system at time of trade) was a 5th round pick that netted us an established starter and was the A’s MILB player of the year last year with a chance at the MLB SS job this year.

They have consistently drafted well after the 1st round for the last 5 years, why would that suddenly change w/o having a high first round pick? They get 3 picks in top 34 this year and I fully expect them to have a very impressive draft. I’d take 3 Mac Horvaths all day er’day.

With Frazier finally off the roster, Mateo and Urias have to be traded to make room for Holliday, Ortiz, & Mayo. Gunnar and Westburg should have 3B on lockdown, Ortiz & Gunnar at SS, and Westburg and Holliday at 2B. Mayo getting time at 3B, RF, & DH. Let’s go!

I’d sign up for that right now. That improves the team substantially. We need a good BP arm and Paxton would be a fun lottery ticket and add competition to the group.

They are so bad that no one in baseball poaches their employees.

Heh? They tanked, sure. But to say that was the sole strategy you’re missing the boat. They turned over almost the entire organization, built an international program from scratch, built a DR training facility, implemented new age development techniques, and started the pipeline that will be delivering players for years to come. Their strategy wasnt tanking. They built an entire new baseball organization from scratch. I’ll give them a pass on not wasting money on the MLB product during that process, I’ll also wait patiently to see how the 2024 roster unfolds because every single poster (including myself) has been proven wrong when doubting them.

Sure. Thats the goal. But if you deem the team not successful if they don’t win the WS, not sure what to tell you. WS is a roll of the dice. Making the playoffs is success. Making the WS is incredible success. Winning the WS is luck. I love watching good baseball night after night. Not gonna say they aren’t successful if they don’t with the WS. Maybe if I were a dodgers fan and my team had won the division a million times in a row and went out and spent $2BB I’d say it’s WS or bust, but I watch the Baltimore team.

What about Mayos in the 4th, Hernaiz’ in the 5th, and Ortiz’ in the 4th? Dumb luck?

Tampa is one of the best, if not the best, at finding and developing talent.

Making playoffs 5 years in a row and the WS in One of those 5 is not “real success”?

Man, thought for sure this was going to be a funny top ten list. Caught hook, line, and sinker.

Hope not But reading that makes Holliday sound like a freak show and that it would be silly not to have him start the year on the roster. I've heard a few outlets now say that if starts OD he would be favorite for ROY.

When you are hurt and can't play, people can't evaluate you.

Interesting Holliday mentioned in the Best Defensive prospects blurb and not Ortiz. Nice to see Hernaiz mentioned in most underrated part.

Not a lot, if any. They are essentially indentured servants to their “academy” who takes ~20% of their bonus. Teams might find ways to get some money invested in the academies and a player might get thrown a bone or some gear. The academies/trainers are operating in their best interest to make money. The academies have multiple players and are trying to max out their earnings. Players might get food, lodging, “supplements”, and some gear but nothing to help out the family in earnest. The kids are also often “traded” from academy to academy and used as a source of income for their coach/trainer. Once they hit 18/19 they are “old” and discarded with nothing to show for themselves, no education, and no training in anything. They also aren’t really taught the game, but rather skills/tools(hitting for power & throwing hard). Nothing is regulated so steroids are often used to get the skills/tools to a point where a scout will be interested. The whole system is really fd up. These kids stop school around 5th/6th grade and train all day/ everyday for a very small opportunity of making anything.

To me that reads “we aren’t trading our guys unless we get a bonafide difference maker back”. Do you think the most pitch inefficient SP in MLB is that difference maker? I don’t, I think people have been talking this to death for so long that they are just desperate for something to get done. I personally would do some of these proposals, but having watched this FO operate, I just don’t see it. My 2 cents.

1. Honestly, I’m not 100% sold that he is. 2. If he is I think he’d reluctantly give up one IF but would be pretty shocked (Westburg or Ortiz) + Norby, & Stowers. Not super sexy but that’s a lot of MLB ready talent. I also don’t think those players line up well with CWS which is why I’m not sold that a deal will get done.

I’ll believe it when I see it.

I don’t think a deal gets done. Elias isn’t likely to trade a top 100 guy (history says so) and I don’t think Cease will be the guy he breaks from the norm on. With how this org is run, they can’t afford to give away service time. Everything is made in house. Just my two cents.

It’s interesting comparing the two. They are quite similar (stat profile). Cease logged 354ip in minors 4.2 bb/9 11.4k/9. Cease came out of HS while Povich went to college and they both made it to AAA at same ages. In 250ip Povich is 3.8bb/9 12.1 k/9. I’ll put my money long term on the 6’3” lefty who has a full arsenal and doesn’t rely on one pitch for success. Cease gave up slightly fewer h/9 & .7 fewer hr/9 (Fairly significant and Povich’s big weak spot). WHIPs almost identical.

Who said anything about 4 cheap guys laying around in FA? I just said I’d like to upgrade those 4. Starting with Webb & Baker. Now that they have no options, they are not appealing at all. I imagine a thrifty waiver wire pick up could replace those two. DL Hall can replace another, potentially Wells replaces another. Sign 1 maybe 2 impact BP arms et voila After Bautista, Cano & Coulombe the BP was pretty bad last year. Bautista is gone, and Cano & DC both had their issues. To me, it’s a major issue that needs to be addressed.

Sure they do, but they ain’t telling us

I think Westburg is the guy (we are willing to trade) that will bring back a big fish. Would be very painful.