drjohnnyfeva

I think if the package is right, they could all be traded. I think that the signal about where the club thinks they are is in the Means and Mullins area. I don't think they trade them to try to gain pieces to field a competitive team next year. I don't think you can bank on other clubs prospects completely in that way. If they deal those guys, my feeling is they don't think they are close and they are still in the "Acquire Potential MLB Capital" phase of this rebuild. And the capital they gain should be very high. There are 3 weeks for teams to see how real both are before fringe teams come into the picture, ready to spare no expense to make a run, so it might not happen until the end. If they keep them it's either the club thinks we are close OR they didn't get a sweet enough deal. There's no way to tell which it is until next year or in the prep phases of next year with FA, etc. Mancini is a hard call. He's still a feel good story locally, but if a good offer comes, he's likely gone. He does carry that PR aspect, but if the pot is sweet enough, I don't think a rebuilding club hesitates. He's a pretty good piece for a contender and we have his replacement waiting in the wings. Santander is expendable. I'm willing to be patient because I don't think this team has ever done a "rebuild" right. Despite saying we've been thru several since the 80's. I think this time they are trying to do it right and that takes time.

Well, that's what I'm saying... I don't think we are seeing a team that is a .500ish club next year; maybe 2023??? Even moving Means and Mullins for a true haul now doesn't mean we will be competitive in 2022 or 2023. So, while I see your point of young, MLB ready talent garnered in a trade helping us compete, I have to disagree with it with where we are now. We are not good. If they trade those two, imo, that is an indication that they feel there is still more work to do and these guys won't be on the team or just about off, by the time the team is ready. So to your statement that it would be moronic to hold onto them because - 1. - they feel they are ready or 2. - they haven't gotten a good offer, would be the only two reasonable excuses for not moving them now. So, for me, moving them indicates they are not ready. I stand by my 3-5 year window. IMO, it was a lengthier rebuild from the beginning than many gave credit for or thought to. There was a lot of really Orange Colored glasses estimates going in, but getting into a market, developing a cohesive farm system, and scouting system were huge endeavors. So, I think we make a .500ish season in 2023 and I think we maybe play Playoff level in 2024 or 2025. Also, I don't think Elias is a failure and this is the never-ending rebuild, I just think it is what it is: An overhaul of a poorly managed system. And that takes time. So I'm back where I was. I feel like if they don't trade they think they are close - in which case, I'm wrong and happy to be so. But if they trade, I think my timeline is where they are, but if things happen sooner... bonus! Good baseball finally returns to Baltimore!

Perhaps so, yet I still think we are a few years away. If we say 2-3 years (I say 3-5), that means both of these guys become UFA's at the beginning of our competitive window; unless there is are extensions, Means is an UFA in 2025 - right at the end of that window, and Mullins is an UFA in 2026. If there are no extensions, is their value in remaining around until they contribute a year or two to a semi-competitive team or do we trade to acquire pieces this year or next that that would remain around a little longer into the "competitiveness?" I will add, that one could take the "experts" opinion to keep these guys could be that we are closer than "we" think to the team making the push to become more competitive. And if the window is actually 1-2 years, these two guys have value to us for a year or so longer before reaching UFA while we still work to surround them with youth from our system and FA's. I still think that a trade of these types of players will indicate where we are. I see your point about getting ready talent tho. I'm still in the frame of mind that if we trade we are 3-5 years out and if we don't we're maybe in the 2-3 year area of making a push. And if somehow we were to get extensions worked out with these guys, that would also be a big indicator of the time frame we're talking about. To me, that would signal that the club is preparing, but that they want these guys around for the push for longer than just the year or two it's gonna take to get there.

I think I'm pretty much in line with what Evans is saying on this... If any of these trades occur, it's an indicator that the FO still feels that we are rebuilding. I would put Means and Mullins in this same category. If one or both of those guys gets traded we are still rebuilding. I don't feel that way about Mancini. Mancini could be traded and I don't think it indicates much unless they acquire a decent catcher. For me, that starts to signal that the center of the field is beginning to solidify (I forget which guy stated that, but I think Evans, again.) I'm still not against any of these moves. But I find it interesting that the guys being quoted in the article are in agreement NOT to trade Means or Mullins unless there is some blockbuster deal. Dealing these guys would be a demonstration that we really do stink as much as we seem to from watching.

The only good thing about Toronto is that it's a short drive to Buffalo.

The real question seems to be more like do we stay the course with Elias or change gears? Clearly the OP thinks he's failing. I don't agree. With the farm system improving, the use of analytics, and other changes, we've yet to see on-field improvement, true; but changing course despite infrastructure improvements, would set us back further. I think we'd all agree that the system was a total mess when he started. We need to get a lot of the prospects involved at the ML level before casting off Elias. I think the manager and coaches are more likely to change before or in conjunction with the younger guys coming up. Verdict: B I don't think anyone on this team is necessarily part of the future if Elias thinks he can make an upgrade by trading. I'll continue to trust his guidance given how highly rated the farm has become since he began. I just wanna see those guys who are expected to be MLB quality to hit the field before I say Elias is a complete success or failure.

Mullins is fun to watch. Mountcastle too. There are some definite bright spots on this team. But I'm not going to lie - I hate the Blue Jays! I'm just glad their pitcher was ejected for that shoulder shot to Franco. I was surprised by the O's announcers saying they didn't think Manoah threw at Franco. Come on, guys. That was a d-bag move after back to back homers.

Great game. And you could still see the Bromo Seltzer Tower before that city owned gray disaster was constructed destroying what was the best centerfield cityscape in MLB.

A little dab'll do ya.

Back when we were contenders, I suggested doing something like this to prop up our rotation of #2's, 3's and5's... I still think it's a model worth doing the logistics on. I don't think it would work today, however, given we have a #1 on the DL and 5 number 5's behind him... Back when we had a whole pile of #2's to throw at everyone, it might have worked.

I lost respect for the players in the steroid era. I understand the mindset of an elite athlete to do those sorts of things, but if ML:B hadn't enabled it by not enforcing the rules they already had then it would have been of a shorter duration or may have been stamped out altogether. The fact that clubs are potentially pursuing measures to outright cheat, is indeed shocking. But once again, by not enforcing rules and allowing practices that should not be allowed MLB sort of endorse the "crime" and encourage it. The only thing MLB has ever stuck to is the Pete Rose ban. Everything else they have been wishy-washy on or outright ignored, at least initially. I think they are definitely more hard-line on performance enhancers now and it probably scares a good portion of players away from such things. They'll need to have similar backbone with this ball doctoring problem now. I say good, but it's not like they haven't known what's going on. Maybe it's just reached critical mass...

Regardless of sport, players are ALWAYS seeking competitive advantage whether it's within the rules or not. This is nothing new to MLB. Their feigned indignation is almost comical. The whole HR/steroid era... took them probably a decade to do anything about that. I still think it wasn't steroids but Sammy Sosa's corked bat that was the death knell of that era, but the point remains, MLB did little about something they had to have known about for a long time until they had to. Here's an article from the other day... https://sports.yahoo.com/the-monday-9-mlb-is-already-behind-on-pitchers-using-sticky-substances-205030244.html

I like seeing the prospects playing even if they aren't ready for PrimeTime... I want to believe we are working toward success, but it's hard to maintain that belief. I'm back to distrusting ownership more than that Elias or Hyde are deficient. I hope the team is sold. I seem to just err on the idea that they aren't doing something. But the prospects should be showing more than they are. Maybe it's Covid - not getting the practice in - but it seems unlikely given other teams look more prepared. I'd hate to think losing is by design; which I get to a certain extent, but not wholesale suckitude.

I think what we're also seeing is that last year was more of an exhibition type display than anything real. As hopeful as I was starting this season, it's pretty obvious that last year was nothing to gauge the future on. I jokingly said my first born will be a Junior or Senior in HS by the time we're a winning club again. We're still 4 years from Junior year, so, sadly that looks like as reasonable a guess as any. I can't imagine they wouldn't trade Means at some point and Mancini deserves a better situation despite the love the town gives him.

If the FO thinks they are 2-4 years out that would dictate extensions, imo. I think that's their signal in providing an answer to this thread's OP. The most likely candidate to extend under the Padres' model is Means... If they extend him for 4-6 years, this season or next, that's signalling we're going to run. But he might very well be a bridge/ trade candidate when we're really in again. Who knows. We ain't there yet.

Personally, I don't really think a jury could be seated on whether Elias has addressed pitching development or not yet. We clearly have some guys who might, but they haven't been tested. I agree it was a total weak point for two or three decades. But I'm certainly not ready to say this is a 10 year multiple GM rebuild we are in either. That seems an excessive assessment. We're not even into May and have only had a handful of games that were out of reach. If we play at .475 or higher for a full season after last year, I feel like that is a great success and would expect a more competitive team in the next 2-3 years under the same GM. Pitching development is an area of required proficiency, but I just don't think there's enough evidence from the changes that have been made to even measure their effectiveness at this point. Perhaps with all of the other changes, we are developing capital to acquire arms while building the foundation to a long-term pipeline of arms a few years down the road???

I like Scott Garceau talking sports. I don't like him calling sports. He's good at banter, but when banter extends through 2-3-4 pitches with just a note as to the pitch call while the banter continues, that's something I don't like. It often has nothing to do with the either the batter or pitcher either. Like Jim Palmer talking about a guy who he was pitching against in 1947 in Jr High League... I love it when the announcers are having fun, but it's about the call of the game first and then the ability to color it with the stories or jokes or whatever. These guys have it backwards. I'm going to give the radio call a try.

I'm going in with 71-75 wins. I'll take 74 specifically. That is a .460 clip and an improvement over last year. Hope springs eternal!

I've wondered for years with all of the WBAL2's and WJZ2 why they don't simulcast RSN's to those channels and just totally bypass the cable/dish companies. Would suck for out of town fans, but that's gotta be a tiny part (not unworthy) of the fan base. Dish was great when we had it, but they really pissed me off when they would refuse to pay carriage rates and then have to drop them until they got a new deal inked. Plus, I don't think they ever learned that UM transferred to the Big10 because the Terp games were always blocked on Big10 Network even when not on locally. Called and called and all they said was they had rules to follow. When we moved, I went to Verizon and now Comcast. We'll continue to do the two year rotation between the two forever now because they don't try to keep you by giving the same rates, they just up you to normal rates which are usually $100 more per month. But I digress. Weren't they supposed to have they app up by now anyway? I would think also that even the most basic tv on either Comcast or Verizon would carry it, definitely with a sports pack...

A shame it wasn't his oblique! He coulda been lost for the season...

Leave it to Stan the Fan... lol. Wondering which CD will be handling more this year... bat or the clubhouse broom.

So now he's arriving at practice in a Mercedes instead of his BMW?! ...wait... ...wait... Nope, that would be a discernible change. I'm still trying to figure it out.

I'm glad I'm not the only one to see this! His ego and vanity precedes him. It's a terrible combination for a coach. In the line of Lefty and Gary, this guy is a hump. And the truth that he is among the highest paid state employees is utterly galling. Especially to this20 year veteran 3rd grade teacher. I cringe when commentators ask him for his thoughts on the game they lost. There's never any humility or magnanimity in his explanation. It's, "We came in here with a good game plan, the players knew how to achieve a win, and the guys just didn't quite get it done. THEY had opportunities, but mental errors caught up with them." That's just sad. And he's obviously shameless, because it's his goto response. I'm going to share a betting line with you all. Under Turd, bet on them as they approach the top 25. Use care when they creep closer to the top 20, bet for but watch it. Once they get inside the top 20, bet against despite being favored. Go back and look! It's a pattern. Get inside the top 20 and collapse. God that felt good to get off my chest. The only thing that would make this worse is for them to still be in the ACC and me REALLY care. .........I always really care...... a little hyperbole.

We are definitely in "Turgetory." That's a great term! Tee shirt worthy! When he's interviewed he's all about the great kids in the program. But when they don't win it's about selfish players who can't implement what they do in practice. That's not a good coach. Getting the best talent to sign here and having it not lead anywhere? They are are a marginal team under a marginal coach. I hate watching them. "Coach Turd."

Hopefully, this is one of those times the Onion turns out to be right. Anyone remember the story about Arnold Schwarzenegger when he was Governor of Caulifornia seeking funding to destroy the Moon. LOL!