Jump to content

Sometimes Your Best Moves are the Ones You Don't Make

brianod

By brianod
in Orioles Talk

Recommended Posts

Ven6 Major Leaguer Cup of Coffee

Ven6

Posted
Posted
I'm not gonna do this all again, but if you think we can't find a spot for an athletic, versatile 800+ OPS bat in the lineup even with Manny at 3rd, you're nuts.

I'm not nuts. You have the order wrong. That's suggesting we trade for Headley now, with Manny in the lineup.

DD and Buck had a hole to fill. They didn't land Headley, so they promoted Manny. It's an if/then thing.

In no world order do we have any indication that if we had gotten Headley, we would have promoted MM when we did. We wouldn't have, because there would be no glaring "need."

Maybe MM would've gotten the typical Sept call up cup of coffee. Big difference.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
  • Replies 92
  • Created
  • Last Reply
Roll Tide Hangout Grand Counsel

Roll Tide

Posted
Posted
Who would you rather have down the stretch, Oswalt, Greinke, Garza, Dempster, assorted others or Tilman? Now that Machado has shown signs of being a solid major leaguer, was Headly really worth Jake, Matusz and a top position prospect? The fact that we are competing without giving away any top prospects bodes well for the future. Maybe DD is lucky, maybe he's a mad genius, whatever. I like where we are right now and I like the direction DD is taking this franchise.

Still think the Orioles would have been better of with Headley.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Babypowder Hangout Veteran Council

Babypowder

Posted
Posted
Matusz is now being turned into a reliever. Arrieta has been bad in AAA. Headley would be the 2nd best player on the team if they would have traded for him.

This team would be much better with Headley on it regardless of what position he played.

You can take out the "2nd". He would be the best player on the team. Headley has been worth 5.0 fWAR this season, the closest player we have is Jones at 3.7.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Dipper9 Hangout Grand Counsel

Dipper9

Posted
Posted
You can take out the "2nd". He would be the best player on the team. Headley has been worth 5.0 fWAR this season, the closest player we have is Jones at 3.7.

We could trade for any number of players around the majors who would come here and be the best player on the team. But you cannot look at things in a vacuum. You have to look at what it costs us, and how much more valuable Headley is over Machado FOR THE PRICE it would cost us to bring him in.

You can't look at Jake and Brian, two very young pitchers, and say, "they suck, we should have traded them." How'd that work out when we traded Finley, Schilling, and Harnish for Glenn Davis? Its way too early to give up on those two young pitchers, plus maybe Hoes or whomever else the Pads were asking for.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Pedro Cerrano Hangout Grand Counsel

Pedro Cerrano

Posted
Posted
We could trade for any number of players around the majors who would come here and be the best player on the team. But you cannot look at things in a vacuum. You have to look at what it costs us, and how much more valuable Headley is over Machado FOR THE PRICE it would cost us to bring him in.

You can't look at Jake and Brian, two very young pitchers, and say, "they suck, we should have traded them." How'd that work out when we traded Finley, Schilling, and Harnish for Glenn Davis? Its way too early to give up on those two young pitchers, plus maybe Hoes or whomever else the Pads were asking for.

Why do you keep harping on this? Bringing in Headley would not have caused Machado to gain or lose playing time! SrMeowMeow has already covered this in great detail.

As for Matusz and Arrieta, you can keep your faith in them, but fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me, fool me eight times....

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Brendan25 All-Star

Brendan25

Posted
Posted
Why do you keep harping on this? Bringing in Headley would not have caused Machado to gain or lose playing time! SrMeowMeow has already covered this in great detail.

As for Matusz and Arrieta, you can keep your faith in them, but fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me, fool me eight times....

Okay. If you are putting one of them at second and taking Q out, how much more wins do we have right now this season if one of them is at second instead of Q?

Q hasn't played ****ty since we got him.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Dipper9 Hangout Grand Counsel

Dipper9

Posted
Posted
Why do you keep harping on this? Bringing in Headley would not have caused Machado to gain or lose playing time! SrMeowMeow has already covered this in great detail.

As for Matusz and Arrieta, you can keep your faith in them, but fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me, fool me eight times....

And others have disputed you guys and shown your take to be a fallacy. Had we traded for Headley, Manny is in the minors. Simple as that. Its not Headley AND Manny. Not sure why this is so hard to grasp.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Pedro Cerrano Hangout Grand Counsel

Pedro Cerrano

Posted
Posted
And others have disputed you guys and shown your take to be a fallacy. Had we traded for Headley, Manny is in the minors. Simple as that. Its not Headley AND Manny. Not sure why this is so hard to grasp.

Show me proof of this. A quote from DD or Buck; anything other than speculation.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Babypowder Hangout Veteran Council

Babypowder

Posted
Posted
And others have disputed you guys and shown your take to be a fallacy. Had we traded for Headley, Manny is in the minors. Simple as that. Its not Headley AND Manny. Not sure why this is so hard to grasp.

Maybe, maybe not. Since Quintanilla is now showing his true colors...it's possible they still would have called him up, just maybe not as soon. I certainly am not a fan of giving everyday at bats to a 30 year old with a sub .600 OPS. I doubt Duquette is all that excited about it either.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Brendan25 All-Star

Brendan25

Posted
Posted
Maybe, maybe not. Since Quintanilla is now showing his true colors...it's possible they still would have called him up, just maybe not as soon. I certainly am not a fan of giving everyday at bats to a 30 year old with a sub .600 OPS. I doubt Duquette is all that excited about it either.

If Duquette didn't want to do that, he would have traded for Headley and not traded for Q. Q plays pretty good defense.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Brendan25 All-Star

Brendan25

Posted
Posted
Not good enough to carry a sub .600 OPS everyday.

So you're saying that Q's better defense and average to below average offense is less valuable then Headley or Machado's offense at second but most likely below average defense?

I guess that's your opinion. I don't agree with it. Machado is not quick enough to play second base. Q has gotten to many balls in the holes that Machado would not get close to.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Go to topic listing


  • Posts

    • Can_of_corn
      Who will pay Burnes $400M this offseason?

      By Can_of_corn · Posted

      Good point, no other metropolitan area has more than one team.
    • Roll Tide
      Who will pay Burnes $400M this offseason?

      By Roll Tide · Posted

      Could it be that they allowed the Gnats to reside within 30 minutes of their home. Effectively cutting their market in half? 
    • Yossarian
      Anyone tried the Immaculate Grid game?

      By Yossarian · Posted

      Got my all-time low rarity score on today's game - 6.
    • Baseball fandom
      Elias: Hyde will be back

      By Baseball fandom · Posted

      Lol.  I give up. Next. 
    • Baseball fandom
      Elias: Hyde will be back

      By Baseball fandom · Posted

      41 freaking years and here's this guy with the name pickles telling me I should be happy with 91 wins and getting owned in the playoffs again. 😂 😂 I saw a team that looked terrible the second half and probably didn't even deserve that spot the way they were playing .
    • Baseball fandom
      Elias: Hyde will be back

      By Baseball fandom · Posted

      Lol. Here's the funny they know more then you know. Typical Oriole fan who's happy with getting punched in the mouth. 
    • e16bball
      Walltimore

      By e16bball · Posted

      I don’t like the wall. I think it’s affecting our hitters. I’ve mentioned before that I think it has totally warped Mountcastle into something he was never really meant to be. The guy came up as a pull-heavy HR hitter, and in his first season-plus (725 PAs), he puts up 38 HRs and a 116 wRC+. Since then, the wRC+ is down to 110, and his approach has totally changed, with his pull numbers plummeting (down from 39% in 2021 to less than 28% this year). He still hits the ball hard, but constantly underachieves his batted ball data — probably because he’s trying to avoid the pull field and hitting balls to the deepest parts of pretty much every other park. Will the same thing happen to Mayo? Maybe he has more pure power, but it’s always going to be a challenge for a RH slugger to survive with that wall. So much harder to do damage.   Beyond that, I think it’s also creating a serious risk of changing our LH hitters’ approaches too. These guys (Henderson, Holliday, Cowser, 2/3 of Adley) have come up with a reputation for being able to drive the ball to all fields. But how long does that continue when they just can’t hit it out to the opposite field? Our LH hitters had a combined 44 wRC+ at OPACY, and only one HR. They had the 3rd most balls hit to LF at home by LHHs, but the lowest wRC+ of any team on those balls (for the second straight year). The Royals, ironically enough, were the only team that was lower than a 70 wRC+ — that’s how much worse our lefties fared going oppo (at OPACY) than everyone else’s. By player: Gunnar Henderson: 112 wRC+ / .160 ISO (51 PAs) Adley Rutschman: 10 wRC+ / .026 ISO (38 PAs) Anthony Santander: 14 wRC+ / .095 ISO (43 PAs) Colton Cowser: 58 wRC+ / .057 ISO (36 PAs) Ryan O’Hearn: 47 wRC+ / .091 ISO (55 PAs) Cedric Mullins: 23 wRC+ / .100 ISO (41 PAs) Jackson Holliday: -72 wRC+ / .000 ISO (16 PAs)   On the road, they had a combined 126 wRC+ (with 9 HRs) going to left field, so it’s not like they’re bad at it. It’s just Death Valley out there in LF for them at OPACY.  How long will it be until these LH guys just start going full pull-happy? Essentially, the opposite of what’s happened with Mountcastle. When (a) your team’s philosophy is to focus on doing damage and (b) you can’t DO damage to the opposite field — the rational endpoint is just to try to pull everything. I don’t think that’s a good outcome. I think it makes them much worse hitters in the other 81 games, and I think it’s a terrible waste of a bunch of really talented hitters with all-field abilities.

  • Popular Contributors

×
×
  • Create New...