What Our Fanbase Seems to Have Forgotten

[birrman54]

Cruz is extremely unlikely to repeat 2014.

I'd also point out that even if you removed every single Nelson Cruz homerun - this team would have been 2nd in the AL in homeruns (171 compared to Blue Jays 177). There's lots of ways to score runs when you have at least 7 regulars capable of 15+ homers (Jones, Pearce, Davis, Schoop, Hardy, Manny, Wieters).

[LoyalBirdFan]

Cruz had a career season and *may* not be able to replicate it next year. Markakis was on a downward slope. Yes, all probably very valid but the big missing piece with these guys leaving is their off-field contribution to the clubhouse. Thats what worries me the most. Both seemingly contributed massively to the team spirit.

So forget OBP and HR's. It's all about somehow replacing that 'character' that concerns me the most

It seems every team Nelson played on won 90+ games and no one knows for sure how right field will play out next year. I'll guess we'll find out, but it is worrisome. Nelson and Nick were signed pretty quick.

[LoyalBirdFan]

Nelson had a 'career year' becasue he played in a lot of games. His OPS was only .030 points above his career average and not the highest of his career.

[weams]

I don't think the "fanbase" (whoever that is) has forgotten anything, except that the offseason doesn't end this week. Our farm system doesn't have a lot of good bats in it, we've lost at least two important veteran position players this offseason, and Duquette acknowledges he has work to do to complete a contending roster. I'm sure he'll put together a team he thinks will be in the hunt, and that will involve adding a couple of players who aren't AAAA fodder and a few who are.

And someone like Travis Ishikawa who will win a world series for someone.

[Nevermore]

Cruz had a career season and *may* not be able to replicate it next year. Markakis was on a downward slope. Yes, all probably very valid but the big missing piece with these guys leaving is their off-field contribution to the clubhouse. Thats what worries me the most. Both seemingly contributed massively to the team spirit.

So forget OBP and HR's. It's all about somehow replacing that 'character' that concerns me the most

Thanks. My sentiments exactly. I do pay attention to stats. But there is something wrong with streaming young players in and then letting them go when they get older. I do believe that some people are rooting for a GM and his colored jerseys and they sometimes forget that there are real players, forming a real team, who occupy these colored jerseys. This isn't fantasy baseball.

[Orioles0615]

Maybe that's all we may need to compete for a playoff spot. But that's probably not what the fanbase wants after getting so close this year. You cant just replace Cruz, Miller and Nick with some scrubs and expect to win it all next year.

This is how I feel. I am fine with letting them go. But at some point, not this year, but probably next we can't just fill spots with AAAA scrubs. What are we going to do if and when Davis, Wieters, Chen, and O'day leave? Replace them with a rule 5 guy and platoon guys? By next year the only reliable guys in the lineup could be Jones, Hardy, and Machado.

[AlbionHero]

This is how I feel. I am fine with letting them go. But at some point, not this year, but probably next we can't just fill spots with AAAA scrubs. What are we going to do if and when Davis, Wieters, Chen, and O'day leave? Replace them with a rule 5 guy and platoon guys? By next year the only reliable guys in the lineup could be Jones, Hardy, and Machado.

Next man up. Good franchises can replace the players that leave. Its how teams like the Rays and A's have been successful with low payrolls.

Though I would really consider trading some of these guys to get future value if that is the direction the O's are going since they can't sign all these guys.

[Three Run Homer]

If DD's mandate was to build a successful organization long term rather than to win in 2014, why did he give up a first and second round draft pick to sign Nelson Cruz and Ubaldo Jimenez? Why did he give up a top-five organizational prospect for Andrew Miller? Obvioulsly, two of these moves paid off in spades and the other did not, but in both cases the clear intent was to win now.

Of course there is a difference between "win now" and "win now by opening up the checkbook." Dan saved money by waiting until late in the offseason and signing Cruz and Ubaldo for relatively cheap deals, rather than paying more for players who didn't cost a draft pick, like Matt Garza. There is a tradeoff between spending money and spending prospects, and Dan decided to spend prospects.

It may be that DD feels less urgency to win in 2015. Hopefully he will keep his first round pick this year. But I will feel a lot more comfortable when Melky Cabrera signs with another team.

[UpstateNYfan]

Maybe that's all we may need to compete for a playoff spot. But that's probably not what the fanbase wants after getting so close this year. You cant just replace Cruz, Miller and Nick with some scrubs and expect to win it all next year.

Sure you can. There is no guarantee that if all three remained O's that the O's would even be in the playoffs next year. The O's were likely to get the AL East without Miller. Would they have gotten by Detroit with out him? Not likely. Markakis, just solid, but not remarkable numbers. Cruz is the one you miss. But, keep in mind, the greatest improvement in the club was pitching. That has not changed.

The O's replaced Machado, Davis and Weiters with "scrubs" and still won. The O's system currently works because DD works hard to get satisfactory replaceable parts. He cares about the 20-25 spots on the active roster and all the remaining spots on the 40 man. I don't think any GM does it better.

What will have to happen, no later then the next winter meetings IMO, is the O's will have to deal a Kevin Gausman or some other high end player to bring in some high level prospects like MacPhail with Bedard did to get Tillman and Jones.

It will be unpopular here for sure, but if they don't make moves like that they can fall into a black hole again.

[weams]

If DD's mandate was to build a successful organization long term rather than to win in 2014, why did he give up a first and second round draft pick to sign Nelson Cruz and Ubaldo Jimenez? Why did he give up a top-five organizational prospect for Andrew Miller? Obvioulsly, two of these moves paid off in spades and the other did not, but in both cases the clear intent was to win now.

Of course there is a difference between "win now" and "win now by opening up the checkbook." Dan saved money by waiting until late in the offseason and signing Cruz and Ubaldo for relatively cheap deals, rather than paying more for players who didn't cost a draft pick, like Matt Garza. There is a tradeoff between spending money and spending prospects, and Dan decided to spend prospects.

It may be that DD feels less urgency to win in 2015. Hopefully he will keep his first round pick this year. But I will feel a lot more comfortable when Melky Cabrera signs with another team.

The Orioles own 5 of the top 105 picks this year. Also that second round supplemental we gave up for Cruz became a first round one.

[Reboulet'sStache]

What will have to happen, no later then the next winter meetings IMO, is the O's will have to deal a Kevin Gausman or some other high end player to bring in some high level prospects like MacPhail with Bedard did to get Tillman and Jones.

It will be unpopular here for sure, but if they don't make moves like that they can fall into a black hole again.

I'm not sure Gausman has reached the level where he would even bring back a high level return like Bedard did. But assuming he has, why would you trade him? He's young and under team control. Basically, any prospect you trade for, you are hoping they end up Gausman. Tillman seems like the player to trade if we are going to make that deal. Or maybe even Adam Jones if you're feeling crazy.

But I do agree. I like what DD has done in terms of not locking the team up into long term contracts that will come with diminishing returns (Markakis, Cruz). But I'd also like to see him not be afraid to sell high on some players, even if it is coming off a winning season, in order to keep young, controllable high upside pieces coming to the bigs. Davis had so much value after 2013, he should have been traded. Instead the Orioles were trying to lock him up long term.

[Oriole1940]

Maybe that's all we may need to compete for a playoff spot. But that's probably not what the fanbase wants after getting so close this year. You cant just replace Cruz, Miller and Nick with some scrubs and expect to win it all next year.

I'm with you on this one. My competitive fire says, not just get to playoffs, but win it all. Show me a good loser and i will show you a loser.

[Reboulet'sStache]

The Orioles own 5 of the top 105 picks this year.

It feels like a big year for the future. Lots of uncertainty with the big league squad, and lots of picks to replenish the farm. Could easily be the type of year we look back 2 or 3 years from now and say, "that was the year that truly proved we turned a corner, or that was the year that sapped us of the momentum we had going."

[weams]

I'm not sure Gausman has reached the level where he would even bring back a high level return like Bedard did. But assuming he has' date=' why would you trade him? He's young and under team control. Basically, any prospect you trade for, you are hoping they end up Gausman. Tillman seems like the player to trade if we are going to make that deal. Or maybe even Adam Jones if you're feeling crazy.

But I do agree. I like what DD has done in terms of not locking the team up into long term contracts that will come with diminishing returns (Markakis, Cruz). But I'd also like to see him not be afraid to sell high on some players, even if it is coming off a winning season, in order to keep young, controllable high upside pieces coming to the bigs. Davis had so much value after 2013, he should have been traded. Instead the Orioles were trying to lock him up long term.[/quote']

Erik Bedard was a Top lefthanded starter, like Lester with a strike out pitch. Gausman is not anything like that in terms of value.

[weams]

I'm with you on this one. My competitive fire says, not just get to playoffs, but win it all. Show me a good loser and i will show you a loser.

Wild card teams played for the World Series last season. The playoffs are a fluke. Fun, but a fluke. This is not like when the two best teams in baseball squared off, with no designated hitter, and a tall mound.