A Team that is "Fun to Watch" ........ It's All About Wins and Losses, Nothing More, Nothing Less

[OFFNY]

o

 

I have continually alluded to the point in the season in which the 2012 Orioles were 46-44, having just lost 17 out of their last 24 games.

And I have asserted that I don't think that many Oriole fans were having fun watching the team at that point ....... in fact, some were likely feeling like it might be 2005 all over again.

I wish that there was a way to bring up all of the threads started on that particular day ......... there is not, but I did some scrambling and I found 2 of them.

One of the threads was a very long thread started by Roy Firestone (105 responses.)

The other was a rather short one (17 responses), started by callahan09.

I wish I find more, but this is the best that I could do. ) 

In any event, I'm sure it will be fun to peek back and see what many of us were thinking and feeling on that particular day (July 17th, 2012.)

 

Sorry ...... but This Time, It Won't get Better

 

Roy Firestone said:

 

This is not a 'dry spell".

 

This is what youve got ........

A first baseman who isn't really a first baseman who is paid to drive in runs and rarely does.

A second baseman who isn't really the second baseman, and who really isn't a Major Leaguer baseball player.

A shortstop who absolutely cannot find his way out of a miserable slump, but who cannot be replaced because there is no depth at that position on this teams'

roster.

A third baseman who really isn't a third baseman and has an occasional hot bat but, mostly hurts the team defensively. A leftfielder who really isn't a leftfielder and has

A "mood ring" for a bat and a career. He simply cannot find any kind of groove.

Add to that dog tired players like the catcher and a CF who is playing hurt and all of that BEFORE you get to the pitiful pitching situation.

Starters who cant get to the fifth inning; who cant seem to shutdown opposing rallies, and of course absolutely cannot throw strikes on a regular basis.

 

There is no net now; no "cavalry" because the "cavalry" is worse than the regulars. It has to be just a matter of time before you let the kids play. Hoes, Avery, and

yes, Machado, Schoop, and maybe even Bundy. This team has collapsed, you might as well see what you'll get because you know now what you've got. Not

much.

o

 

http://forum.orioleshangout.com/forums/showthread.php/123559-Sorry-but-this-time-it-wont-get-better?highlight=July+2012+Firestone

 

ALSO:

 

If the 2012 Baltimore Orioles Finish in Last Place ......

 

callahan09 said:

 

It will be one of the worst collapses in recent memory.

I looked at the last place finishers from all 6 divisions in MLB since our losing ways began in 1998, and I learned some interesting things about last place teams. But first, let me just place an info-dump here:

Latest date in the year that the last-place team had been in first place

1. 2005 WSN 7/242. 2006 COL 7/53. 2000 TEX 6/54. 2002 NYM 5/295. 2009 KCR 5/156. 2011 FLA 5/27. 2008 BAL 4/298. 2007 SFG 4/269. 2001 COL 4/2610. 2010 SEA 4/2111. 2005 SEA 4/2012. 1999 ANA 4/1713. 2006 SEA 4/1514. 2009 BAL 4/1415. 2011 BAL 4/1316. 2006 CHC 4/1217. 2007 PIT 4/1018. 2001 MON 4/1019. 2005 TBD 4/920. 1999 CHC 4/921. 2010 PIT 4/822. 2009 PIT 4/823. 2004 MIL 4/824. 2004 ARI 4/825. 2003 NYM 4/826. 1999 MIN 4/827. 2007 TBD 4/728. 2004 MON 4/729. 2000 SDP 4/730. 2009 ARI 4/631. 2000 MIN 4/632. 1999 FLA 4/633. 2011 SDP 4/534. 2010 ARI 4/535. 2008 SDP 4/536. 2004 KCR 4/537. 2002 TBD 4/538. 2008 WSN 4/439. 2005 COL 4/440. 2001 TEX 4/441. 1999 COL 4/442. 2008 PIT 4/343. 2007 FLA 4/344. 2002 MIL 4/345. 2001 TBD 4/346. 2000 TBD 4/347. 2011 SEA 4/248. 2008 SEA 4/249. 2007 KCR 4/250. 1998 PIT 4/251. 2003 TBD 3/3152. 1998 DET 3/3153. 1998 FLA 3/3154. 2003 TEX 3/3055. 2000 CHC 3/3056. 2011 MIN -57. 2011 HOU -58. 2010 BAL -59. 2010 KCR -60. 2010 WSN -61. 2009 OAK -62. 2009 WSN -63. 2008 DET -64. 2007 TEX -65. 2006 TBD -66. 2006 KCR -67. 2006 WSN -68. 2005 KCR -69. 2005 PIT -70. 2004 TOR -71. 2004 SEA -72. 2003 DET -73. 2003 MIL -74. 2003 SDP -75. 2002 DET -76. 2002 TEX -77. 2002 SDP -78. 2001 KCR -79. 2001 PIT -80. 2000 PHI -81. 1999 TBD -82. 1998 TBD -83. 1998 OAK -84. 1998 ARI -

 

Most days that the last-place team was in first-place at the end of gameday on a day in which they played:

1. 2005 WSN 532. 2002 NYM 373. 2006 COL 324. 2009 KCR 275. 2008 BAL 146. 2000 TEX 107. 2011 BAL 98. 2001 COL 89. 1999 ANA 810. 2007 PIT 711. 2005 SEA 612. 2001 MON 613. 2008 WSN 514. 2008 SDP 515. 2006 SEA 516. 2004 MIL 417. 2002 TBD 418. 2011 FLA 319. 2011 SDP 320. 2010 PIT 321. 2009 BAL 322. 2009 PIT 323. 2008 SEA 324. 1999 CHC 325. 2011 SEA 226. 2010 SEA 227. 2008 PIT 228. 2007 TBD 229. 2007 FLA 230. 2006 CHC 231. 2005 TBD 232. 2003 NYM 233. 2002 MIL 234. 2001 TEX 235. 2000 MIN 236. 2000 CHC 237. 1999 FLA 238. 1998 PIT 239. 2010 ARI 140. 2009 ARI 141. 2007 KCR 142. 2007 SFG 143. 2005 COL 144. 2004 KCR 145. 2004 MON 146. 2004 ARI 147. 2003 TBD 148. 2003 TEX 149. 2001 TBD 150. 2000 TBD 151. 2000 SDP 152. 1999 MIN 153. 1999 COL 154. 1998 DET 155. 1998 FLA 156. 2011 MIN 057. 2011 HOU 058. 2010 BAL 059. 2010 KCR 060. 2010 WSN 061. 2009 OAK 062. 2009 WSN 063. 2008 DET 064. 2007 TEX 065. 2006 TBD 066. 2006 KCR 067. 2006 WSN 068. 2005 KCR 069. 2005 PIT 070. 2004 TOR 071. 2004 SEA 072. 2003 DET 073. 2003 MIL 074. 2003 SDP 075. 2002 DET 076. 2002 TEX 077. 2002 SDP 078. 2001 KCR 079. 2001 PIT 080. 2000 PHI 081. 1999 TBD 082. 1998 TBD 083. 1998 OAK 084. 1998 ARI 0

 

From this, I came up with the following:

Average Latest-Date in First: 4/11Median Latest-Date in First: 4/3Average Gamedays in First: 3.64285714285714Median Gamedays in First: 1

 

We are oft-comparing this team to the 2005 Orioles, but perhaps we should be comparing them more to the 2005 Nationals, who suffered a similar drop from first to last.

The 2012 Orioles spent 43 gamedays in first place, and if they finish in last, that would be the second most for a last-place team since 1998, behind only the 2005 Nationals. They would be only the 7th last-place team in that span to have spent double-digit gamedays in first place during the season. Fewer than half last-place teams in that span have even spent more than a single gameday in first place.

The 2012 Orioles were last in first place on June 7. If they finish in last place, that would qualify as the third-latest date that a last-place team was in first place, behind only the 2005 Washing Nationals (July 24), and the 2006 Colorado Rockies (July 5). They would be only the 7th last-place team in that span to have spent any time after the month of April in first place.

We all know the 2005 team had a disastrous fall, but they didn't finish in last place. This team very well could ...

o

 

 

http://forum.orioleshangout.com/forums/showthread.php/123581-If-the-2012-Baltimore-Orioles-finish-in-last-place?highlight=July+2012

 

o

[Dark Helmet]

I commented this team isn't exciting to watch. I've found myself switching channels alot this year. I've turned the channel for minutes, just to turn back and the opposing teams pitcher had already retired the offense in like 8 pitches. That gets old. I'm kind of blah about them making the playoffs because deep down I know they have no shot at going deep. I can't explain my lack of interest. Wish I could . I love the Orioles, but I just don't feel a connection with this team.

[survivedc]

The offense slumps don't bother me.

Starting pitching incapable or unwilling to challenge hitters is not fun to watch.

Poor defense is not fun to watch.

This. I can't stand watching pitchers that nibble, especially when that nibbling isn't working. It's why I didn't mind Ubaldo earlier in the year, even when he was getting rocked, something was happening.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Ori-Al]

I don't have fun watching our hitters consistently making life easier for pitchers by swinging at pitches out of the strike zone (often way out.) And the discipline never improves. Getting beaten is one thing, beating yourself is another. But, I still watch every game, just as I did through the 14 season desert and the not very good stretch before 1996-97.

Buck frustrates me sometimes, too. But I'm glad he's here, even if I have to cuss at him occasionally.

[Babypowder]

Whether a team is fun to watch is subjective. If you prefer teams that have great starting pitching and play a lot of small ball and are good at that, and don't enjoy watching a team that relies heavily on homers, has shaky starting pitching and doesn't execute small ball well, then I guess you are entitled to say this team isn't fun to watch.

For me, this team is fun to watch. First of all, winning is fun, and we've won significantly more than we've lost. Second, there is a core group of guys who seem like good people and teammates, get along well with each other, work hard and enjoy playing the game, who I can identify with as a fan. I feel good for the players when they win, and bad for them when we lose. The jerk quotient on the team is extremely low. Third, I am fairly agnostic about how we win. Winning on homers, great infield defense and an excellent bullpen is just fine with me.

My advice -- if you don't think the team is fun to watch, then don't watch. Because the only reason to watch is to have fun doing it. And I'm going to keep watching, because I am having plenty of fun doing it.

Agree with everything but the jerk quotient part. I don't think you'll find many baseball fans outside of Baltimore who would agree with that. Showalter and Machado are pretty universally disliked outside of Baltimore from my experiences. Adam Jones also recently ruffled some feathers for taken out of context headlines.

We don't think of them as jerks because we are Oriole's fans, and therefore inherently biased.

[Bmorefan24]

I commented this team isn't exciting to watch. I've found myself switching channels alot this year. I've turned the channel for minutes, just to turn back and the opposing teams pitcher had already retired the offense in like 8 pitches. That gets old. I'm kind of blah about them making the playoffs because deep down I know they have no shot at going deep. I can't explain my lack of interest. Wish I could . I love the Orioles, but I just don't feel a connection with this team.

Bingo! Even though you can't explain it, I think you nailed it (if that makes sense, haha). I feel the exact same way, and I imagine a lot of others do as well. There is just something missing with this team that isn't allowing us to connect with them.

[MDtransplant757]

They've broken my spirit later than they did last year. I'll give them that. If we make the playoffs and win the WC game, there is a god after all.

[VeveJones007]

2009's team was excruciating to watch. At worst, 2016's team will be periodically frustrating and ultimately disappointing.

This, but it runs a bit deeper for me. This team too often offends my baseball sensibilities.

-Pitchers getting beat in 0-2, 1-2 counts by leaving pitches over the plate

-Guys periodically falling asleep on D

-Impatience and lack of composure at the plate, throwing away ABs

-Idiotic base running mistakes

-Odd managerial choices on lineup, when to pull pitchers, play match ups, etc.

I can live with a team that simply isn't good enough, but too often this team doesn't play baseball the right way. They play that way occasionally, which makes it all the more frustrating when they fall into these bad habits and mental mistakes.

[VeveJones007]

They've broken my spirit later than they did last year. I'll give them that. If we make the playoffs and win the WC game, there is a god after all.

If this team advances to the ALDS, I'm not sure that's a just outcome.

[Camden_yardbird]

I commented this team isn't exciting to watch. I've found myself switching channels alot this year. I've turned the channel for minutes, just to turn back and the opposing teams pitcher had already retired the offense in like 8 pitches. That gets old. I'm kind of blah about them making the playoffs because deep down I know they have no shot at going deep. I can't explain my lack of interest. Wish I could . I love the Orioles, but I just don't feel a connection with this team.

This. It is not a fun team.

[Ripken]

I commented this team isn't exciting to watch. I've found myself switching channels alot this year. I've turned the channel for minutes, just to turn back and the opposing teams pitcher had already retired the offense in like 8 pitches. That gets old. I'm kind of blah about them making the playoffs because deep down I know they have no shot at going deep. I can't explain my lack of interest. Wish I could . I love the Orioles, but I just don't feel a connection with this team.

This is where I am, and I suspect a lot of others. This team is just off. I can not watch our offense without going insane. I was a lead-off hitter for years. I had little power but was a total PITA to pitch against and got on base constantly. Watching these guys hack at everything upsets me terribly. It is not how you hit.

[24fps]

This, but it runs a bit deeper for me. This team too often offends my baseball sensibilities.

-Pitchers getting beat in 0-2, 1-2 counts by leaving pitches over the plate

-Guys periodically falling asleep on D

-Impatience and lack of composure at the plate, throwing away ABs

-Idiotic base running mistakes

-Odd managerial choices on lineup, when to pull pitchers, play match ups, etc.

I can live with a team that simply isn't good enough, but too often this team doesn't play baseball the right way. They play that way occasionally, which makes it all the more frustrating when they fall into these bad habits and mental mistakes.

No disagreement here. I just don't get Buck Showalter right now.

[MDK02]

I commented this team isn't exciting to watch. I've found myself switching channels alot this year. I've turned the channel for minutes, just to turn back and the opposing teams pitcher had already retired the offense in like 8 pitches. That gets old. I'm kind of blah about them making the playoffs because deep down I know they have no shot at going deep. I can't explain my lack of interest. Wish I could . I love the Orioles, but I just don't feel a connection with this team.

I've felt the same way. I love the team, but they're not an exciting team by any means. Just something missing from this team.

[OFFNY]

OFFNY said:

o

 

It has often been said by many that the 2016 Orioles team has "Not been very fun to watch." And this is almost always said after the Orioles lose 2 or 3 games in a row, and particularly when they lose 2 or 3 games in a row to a division rival, such as the Yankees, the Red Sox, or the Blue Jays.

We all look back at the 2012 Orioles team with loving memories, and remember them a young, spunky team that never quit. That team went 93-69, beat the Texas Rangers in a one-game playoff in their home park, and took the Yankees right down to the wire in the A.L.D.S.

However ........ that same 2012 team had a record of 46-44 after 90 games, which was well past the midway point of the season. After starting the season at 39-27, the Orioles went 7-17 over their next 24 games, and all of us (myself included) were extremely fearful that we might be witnessing a repeat of the 2005 season. We were so desperate that we called up Tommy Hunter from AAA-Norfolk to start the next game against the Twins in Minnesota. What happened ??? The Orioles scored 2 runs in that game and they lost ano ........ NO !!! Tommy Hunter pitched 7 innings of 1-run ball, and the Orioles won the game by a score of 2-1, which started them on a 5-game winning streak. After that, the lowest number of games that the Orioles ever were over .500 for the rest of the season was 4 (51-47), and they in fact did the complete opposite of what the 2005 team did after their very promising start to that season.

So that 2012 season IN HINDSIGHT looks like a team that was "Much more fun to watch" than this current 2016 is. However, looking at it more objectively, I don't think that there were 5 posters that were fondly thinking of that team as "Fun to watch" when they were 46-44, had just lost 17 out of their last 24 games, and were counting on Tommy Hunter to stop the bleeding.

And while I'm stating the obvious (teams that win games are more fun to watch than are teams that lose games, REGARDLESS of how they win the games and/or what their Pythagorean record is), I think that it needs to be stated. Currently, the Orioles are 82-69, and are riding a 2-game losing streak to their division rival Red Sox. 4 or 5 years from now, will we all look back on this team as one that was "Fun team to watch" with glowing memories, as we do of that 2012 Orioles team ??? It all depends on several things ........ how the Orioles fare in their final 11 regular season games, how the Orioles fare in the postseason if and when they reach it, and how the Orioles are doing 4 or 5 years from now when we are looking back at this 2016 season.

 

o

 

o

 

The Orioles went 7-2 over their final 9 games ........ and I had fun watching it.

I would have preferred that they had won the division and bypassed the Wild Card playoff game, but I'm still happy with them coming through down the stretch the way that they did.

 

o

 

[atomic]

o

It has often been said by many that the 2016 Orioles team has "Not been very fun to watch." And this is almost always said after the Orioles lose 2 or 3 games in a row, and particularly when they lose 2 or 3 games in a row to a division rival, such as the Yankees, the Red Sox, or the Blue Jays.

We all look back at the 2012 Orioles team with loving memories, and remember them a young, spunky team that never quit. That team went 93-69, beat the Texas Rangers in a one-game playoff in their home park, and took the Yankees right down to the wire in the A.L.D.S.

However ........ that same 2012 team had a record of 46-44 after 90 games, which was well past the midway point of the season. After starting the season at 39-27, the Orioles went 7-17 over their next 24 games, and all of us (myself included) were extremely fearful that we might be witnessing a repeat of the 2005 season. We were so desperate that we called up Tommy Hunter from AAA-Norfolk to start the next game against the Twins in Minnesota. What happened ??? The Orioles scored 2 runs in that game and they lost ano ........ NO !!! Tommy Hunter pitched 7 innings of 1-run ball, and the Orioles won the game by a score of 2-1, which started them on a 5-game winning streak. After that, the lowest number of games that the Orioles ever were over .500 for the rest of the season was 4 (51-47), and they in fact did the complete opposite of what the 2005 team did after their very promising start to that season.

So that 2012 season IN HINDSIGHT looks like a team that was "Much more fun to watch" than this current 2016 is. However, looking at it more objectively, I don't think that there were 5 posters that were fondly thinking of that team as "Fun to watch" when they were 46-44, had just lost 17 out of their last 24 games, and were counting on Tommy Hunter to stop the bleeding.

And while I'm stating the obvious (teams that win games are more fun to watch than are teams that lose games, REGARDLESS of how they win the games and/or what their Pythagorean record is), I think that it needs to be stated. Currently, the Orioles are 82-69, and are riding a 2-game losing streak to their division rival Red Sox. 4 or 5 years from now, will we all look back on this team as one that was "Fun team to watch" with glowing memories, as we do of that 2012 Orioles team ??? It all depends on several things ........ how the Orioles fare in their final 11 regular season games, how the Orioles fare in the postseason if and when they reach it, and how the Orioles are doing 4 or 5 years from now when we are looking back at this 2016 season.

2012 season was awesome. I just wanted them to finish above .500. They made the playoff and beat the Rangers in the Wild Card and played the dreaded Yankees.