tntoriole

Umm i guess the last 6 years of being under .500, they didn’t “want “ to win.. then. But Now.. they want to win now lol

What is amazing is how wrong these predictions routinely are every year. No better than Sporting News used to do 50 years ago.. with zero computer algorithms lol

Would you be surprised by 92? Lol

And all players , particularly the Verlanders and DeGroms and Judges owe everything they get now to the efforts of guys like Mark Belanger… and Curt Flood and Dave McNally etc

I saw Belanger and Aparicio. Belanger was the best shortstop I have ever seen overall but Mateo was as good last season as any I have seen and better than any other Os shortstop since Belanger.

Brewer fans hate the proposal https://reviewingthebrew.com/posts/brewers-this-mlb-insider-s-corbin-burnes-trade-proposal-is-literal-insanity-01gn02e443mq/amp

I was ecstatic about 2022 and support the decisions Elias made that have gotten us this far. Second guessing is what being on this board is sbout, but the reality us that it is water under the bridge and you cannot know if the actions you wanted to see would have worked better or worse.

Thank you for the feedback. But all is good.. I will simply acknowledge our differences and wish you well for the season to come!!

Thanks so much to all my fellow friends and fanatics here in the Hangout! We remember the dear friends here who have passed and for peace to their loved ones. We are a family, Tony and you are the binding glue and support for all of us! Thank you so much. God bless to each one of you for a Merry Christmas and Happy Season! And for a very happy baseball season for all of us in 2023!!

I would have signed Frazier obviously because I believe he may well outperform his contract and that he will contribute more at 2b in early 2023 than any other current option. If Westburg proves me wrong then trade Frazier or move him to the outfield.. but I believe he will surprise those currently down on this signing.

And you seem unable to grasp that I simoly disagree with your assessment of moves he has made.

How much did those acquisitions cost us? Yes they did not work out. It happens. How much did Elias obtain in the trades of Lopez and Mancini who then sucked for their teams? And how much bad performance did he save us from by sending them away? We can’t know. I am not so much a fan of the idea of the so called “stunted” growth of players. There is something to be said for player development in having to overperform as prospects to beat out a veteran. But Elias clearly has a plan that relies heavily on the success of his drafted prospects and so that plan probably does not involve harming their development.

I don’t see any of the players we signed are “terrible” nor are they “washed up, long in the tooth.” Adam Frazier is 31 and was an AllStar in 2021. He may not perform again at that level but it is probably not due to age. I do agree that it all comes down to value and contribution not being a good presence or role model. But I believe these guys will contribute in 2023 as does Mike. Now if they sign Rich Hill… lol

By “supporting the success” you mean making some big acquisition that you liked mid year ? To “improve” the team? Sort of like the Astros getting Trey? Did that “improve” the team? Or the Twins getting Jorge Looez? If those two player performances had been the same as they did for their new teams and they were still on the 2022 squad would that have “improved “ or weakened the team? . It is unfair to suggest that Mike Elias and his entire team of leadership that he also has assembled was not more invested and involved in wanting the 2022 team to win as any of us. But he is a professional GM .. unlike you and me. So not making a trade that doesn’t fit his process just to appease fans who will bash him for not “supporting” the team was the correct call imho

So who does deserve the credit? Dan Duquette? Mike surely would have gotten the blame if they had won 40 games. I don’t view building a “winning team” as something that you do in isolation. Elias drafted and assembled the roster and it was better than expected. Why no credit? The only obstacle to Mike’s success will be the same one that has been the obstacle for decades .. Angelos family ownership. And yes they may prevent us from ever winning a championship.

I agree with this. Now add in the usual but unexpected DL time or underperformance say of a rookie who has yet to take a big league at bat and what seems like a “logjam” becomes “barely enough”. And Frazier being able to spell or platoon at times with Santander in right and Hays in left could be valuable to our roster makeup for 2023. There is a reason why Frazier was in demand at the trade deadline in 2021 by many contender GMs. He doesn’t strike out, he plays the game hard-a BJ Surhoff intensity. And the Seattle GM saw also all those advantages he brings plus a limited cost. And sometimes a 31 year old past AllStar on a one year deal after an off season has a lot of motivation to get another deal. I think we are all going to be much happier with Adam Frazier than some have been to date.

I guess that is why the team underperformed so badly last year. All those bad moves Elias made.

I went through this in the Frazier thread. Suffice to say, I disagree with your sky is falling down stance because somehow Jordan Westburg is “blocked”. He isn’t and won’t be. I suspect Mike probably realizes how many middle infielders he has and might actually have a plan about that. Having rookies pushed to do well to earn a spot is not “blocked”.

Adam Frazier will be seen as the valuable pick up of the 2022 offseason.

Agreed .. do both

Seattle’s GM disagrees with you.. but hey you know more than him and Elias. “He can play second, he can touch third, he can play both left and right. That just gives us so much flexibility in what we do with the other players,” Dipoto said. ” … We felt like adding Adam made us a deeper team without stopping us from doing anything else we would have wanted to do, which is double the fun. We can continue to add to our team because Adam is so versatile. Frazier is certainly elite in that regard, having struck out just 315 times in 2,443 career plate appearances and no more than 75 times in a single season, so it makes sense that a team that preaches controlling the strike zone would keep trying to acquire him. https://sports.mynorthwest.com/1536104/mariners-breakdown-2b-adam-frazier/amp/

I have lost before.

I think that would be a good problem to have. So I would not be unhappy with the deal, no.

Pretty big tick I wager lol

Are we winning in the AL East with him contributing? Then yes. Are we in last place again? Then no and I would probably trade him and bring the kids up or maybe Hays is on the DL and Santander needs to DH more and Frazier could play out there too. Or it could be that Westburg is at .650 OPS and then is it a good deal? I just think a one year deal with a guy with a track record and a multiple position capability gives us all kinds of flexibility for 2023 unforeseen events.