tntoriole

And Odor?

No he is a much more proven 2b option at the moment and Westburg will not be given a chance to come and hit .175 for a month or two while adjusting. He will have to be better than Frazier to play much this year. One year contract .. hardly Chris Davis in terms of blocking anyone .. and rookies are rookies ..

Maybe Hays can’t play 162 games in left or Santander 162 in right. Could Odor play the outfield? Odor was not a good player period. Frazier a lefty bat would be a stronger option than McKenna as a sub in outfield against righthanders or better than trying to play Mancini out there which we have tried in the recent past. Same reason if Westburg rakes that Frazier could not necessarily be on the bench if he can play in outfield slots. And this board always underestimates thst guys get hurt, don’t live up as rookies to expectations so having a veteran All Star might be a good thing. And it is not “years” .. several others keep suggesting it was ancient history ..he hit .305 and was an All Star in 2021, he is only 31.. one season back from 2022 when he switched leagues and had 1 down season out of 8. Do we have anybody on the team who got 179 hits in 2021? Sometimes guys on 1 year deals that have something to prove so they get another deal often exceed expectations. Let’s revisit at the end of 2023 and see if Mike and i are correct or you are.

Talking about Frazier

Talking about Frazier

2021 he was not just an OK player .. he had 176 hits in 577 ABs and a .305/.368/.411 slash line. That is 2 years ago .. so yeah if he is anything like that then I am happy.

He actually was worse than what you cite last season which as I said was a down season in a new league and was a .612 OPS not .662 . However, his 7 year big league season average OPS is . 728 and in 2021 with Pitt before trade his OPS was .836 in 428 ABs. He is 31 … not 36… Not lightning.. just his norm would be a substantial upgrade from Odor and defensively he is as well.

And we don’t know yet what Odor will get in 2023 .. and what does 7 mil get you on the free agent market these days? You think if they hadn’t spent it, then Angelos would have spent 20 mil on Bassitt? I don’t. As I said, these are small moves but each one I believe is an improvement. So does Mike. We shall see.

Down year for Frazier.. his utility gives much more flexibility than Odor .. He could play RF or LF if needed or against righthanders Let’s look at the end of 2023 and revisit this dispute and see how much WAR dif between 2023 Odor and Frazier

Disagree.. last year was below his norms and he is much better defensively and can play the outfield. You want to wager who has more WAR in 2023? I will take Frazier

Frazier is significantly better than Odor and 2023 results will be more dramatic in difference… Frazier is also a competent utility guy at outfield and 2b and gives much much more flexibility than Odor did. 1 year deal, he will not block anybody who is ready McCann is better than Chirinos .. backup catcher is a necessity obviously ..and he is 2.5 mil per year cost with fringe prospect given up Gibson is better than Lyles and we did not have to give him 2 years like Lyles got. Givens is a plus addition in my view All small pieces but all make us better than what was there in 2022

The only next year that will ever result in a change such as suggested in the OP is the next year after the Angelos clan gets out.

Mateo costs 300 times less.

He is a definite upgrade over Odor and the commitment is minimal and given outfield capabilities he allows Santander to DH at times. it is not pitching or a MOO bat but just the signing makes us better at second than last year.

Me too. Most winning teams though do have a Lyles or Gibson every year so we may just have to find a new one every season .. there is downside risk to 2 years but the upside could be if he overperforms then you get a second year way below market.

Jordan Lyles signs with KC 2years 17 mil with incentives to 20 mil

Mullins is worth much more to us than the Dodgers are likely willing to part with. And this will be no Machado where we get prospects with only Kremer being worth anything.

Yeah if Angelos is still the owner then you know the answer You have to believe all the accumulated knowledge of the Elias war room did not enter the offseason saying “If we can just get our main targets, Kyle Gibson and Adam Frazier and Rich Hill, our process will be complete!!”

If this is true, MLB never should approve him as owner

I guess no regression is even possible among those proven arms of Bradish, Kremer, Voth ..and sure .. banking on a rookie even one as talented as Grayson .. sure no one could see that maybe all the pieces won’t line up quite like 2022. This is the same mentality in the offseason of 2012 that saw a much more proven lineup than we have now still regress in 2013 because once they made the playoffs they took their foot off the gas and stopped improving the team Exactly the same with the best team in the last ten years .. 2014 squad.. the mentality was oh we were close so let Cruz, Miller, Nick all walk and do zero to improve the team If they do not improve this team before spring training, the 2023 team as is will win fewer games than 2022, imho. If not going to sign or trade for any substantial improvements, then try to sign Adley to a mega deal right now.

Of course they did

But the Os generally ONLY make what others rightly see as “depth” moves .. then the offseason is over and off we go lol Problem is we never have the quality pitching which “depth” moves are designed to enhance. Jays signing Cueto to be a 4th or 5th starter behind their quality starters would be very different than us signing him to somehow be an upgrade.

The Os are not signing any free agent pitcher.

How did he do it last year then? Lol I am serious. Is the stat useless?

Hahaha