Jump to content

Jim Johnson the 2013 scapegoat.


mark_beckens

Recommended Posts

[TABLE=class: tablehead, width: 756]

<tbody style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; border: 0px; outline: 0px; font-size: 11px; vertical-align: baseline; background-color: transparent; background-position: initial initial; background-repeat: initial initial;">[TR=class: evenrow team-10-1, bgcolor: transparent]

[TD=bgcolor: #F1F1F1, align: left]4[/TD]

[TD=bgcolor: #F1F1F1, align: left]Baltimore[/TD]

[TD=bgcolor: #F1F1F1].321[/TD]

[TD=bgcolor: #F1F1F1].429[/TD]

[TD=bgcolor: #F1F1F1].749[/TD]

[TD=class: sortcell, bgcolor: #F1F1F1]23[/TD]

[TD=bgcolor: #F1F1F1]72[/TD]

[TD=bgcolor: #F1F1F1]68.00[/TD]

[TD=bgcolor: #F1F1F1]48[/TD]

[TD=bgcolor: #F1F1F1]30[/TD]

[TD=bgcolor: #F1F1F1]1281[/TD]

[TD=bgcolor: #F1F1F1]252[/TD]

[TD=bgcolor: #F1F1F1]16[/TD]

[TD=bgcolor: #F1F1F1]186[/TD]

[TD=bgcolor: #F1F1F1]2123[/TD]

[/TR]

[TR=class: oddrow team-10-2]

[TD=bgcolor: transparent, align: left]5[/TD]

[TD=bgcolor: transparent, align: left]Boston[/TD]

[TD=bgcolor: transparent].318[/TD]

[TD=bgcolor: transparent].396[/TD]

[TD=bgcolor: transparent].714[/TD]

[TD=class: sortcell, bgcolor: #DDDDDD !important]22[/TD]

[TD=bgcolor: transparent]53[/TD]

[TD=bgcolor: transparent]58.00[/TD]

[TD=bgcolor: transparent]45[/TD]

[TD=bgcolor: transparent]9[/TD]

[TD=bgcolor: transparent]1256[/TD]

[TD=bgcolor: transparent]258[/TD]

[TD=bgcolor: transparent]24[/TD]

[TD=bgcolor: transparent]144[/TD]

[TD=bgcolor: transparent]1994[/TD]

[/TR]

</tbody>[/TABLE]

Boston has 19 less save opportunities, and only one less blown save.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 99
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Nick Markakis has had a bad year but someone like Chris Davis can offset that. Sure you can always say if the team was better at this or that then the closer wouldn't be needed as much. We have had other issues to say the least. Our starters have been bad for stretches and we haven't hit well recently. At the end of the day though we have been good enough to put the ball in JJ's hands to help us win a lot of games. It is hard to fathom a team making the playoffs in a division like the AL East losing the number of leads we have late in games. You need to be a really good team to overcome a year like JJ has had. This is why being a closer is the toughest job on baseball. You are literally on an island, it is all on you.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I fell bad for JJ, I really do. I still think he is a good pitcher. Up until now, I have given him the benefit of the doubt as the best option available to us. I would be open to having him back next year if he will take a paycut and accept money appropriate to a middle relief role. But he simply cannot be the closer the rest of this year, and I hope we bring in somebody who can take over the role next year. That has to be a top priority for the offseason. It's not just the number of losses but the way they have happened. He just looks mentally weak out there and that is the last thing you want in a closer.

Let's see K-Rod close for the rest of the season, see what JJ can do in middle relief, and go from there in the offseason. Maybe Grant Balfour for 2 years, $10 million?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There are other reasons the O's as a team have lost games, but the evidence that Jim Johnson is directly responsible for a number of losses is strong. However, as the closer, he is in more situations when the game DOES depend on him, so the crosshairs are directly on him every time he blows a save or loses a game.

It's easy to blame him, because his mistakes are overt. But he is not the reason why the O's as a team are floundering.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Mark, I hate to tell you this, but sometimes one player does lose the game. Cliches are not always true. Sometimes, they are just sound bites to get the press to ask another question

But, is Johnson responsible for every loss?

There have been several games where the starters blew up and the bats didnt bring them bat.

There have been several games where the bats were totally asleep and the starters didnt really lose the game, but they get tagged with the loss.

Heck, as much as I respect Buck, I would say, he should be accountable for the some of the losses.

Overall, the team is responsible for the team record.

I know, some will not agree, and it has to do with the blame something theory, people love to blame others.

Losing SUCKS, I get it, trust me I do. I was a Senators fan and they lost, and then I became an Oriole fan and it was good for awhile and then sucked again for 14 years.

I was never in a playoff hunt as a Senator's fan, it was until following the Orioles that I got spoiled a bit.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Some here think he's the reason we will not make the playoffs. They forget that baseball is a team game and no one player ever wins or loses any game. Yet he seems to take the blunt of the blame. To the point that some are making these kind of excuses for his teammates!

So based on this quote, any run that is given up honestly is ok. It's only the dishonest runs that get a pitcher blamed

I'm confused, does that mean when a starter comes out of the bullpen to start a game, he's not expected to not give up runs? I thought the job of all pitchers was to not give up runs.

Has JJ pitched as well as last season, NO.

Has he had really bad stretches this season, YES.

Does he deserve some of the blame for losses and our mediocre season, YES. However, he is not the reason we won't make the playoffs, if we don't. He is part of the reason. Every player is responsible. Buck and the coaching staff are responsible. DD and the front office are responsible. They all share the blame for every loss and us not being good enough, not playing well enough to win the division, make the playoffs, and win a championship.

That is a good post. I have never liked blaming one player.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You seem to be quite the Johnson fanatic. Maybe after the season is over you can have the honor of presenting him with his award in person.

It will be a pair of goggles personally signed by Kevin Gregg himself.

No he is an honest fan that knows how silly it is to blame one player like so many

want to do. To me it is dishonest to blame him for the being the reason the O's

don't make the playoffs.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Has JJ pitched as well as last season, NO.

Has he had really bad stretches this season, YES.

Does he deserve some of the blame for losses and our mediocre season, YES. However, he is not the reason we won't make the playoffs, if we don't. He is part of the reason. Every player is responsible. Buck and the coaching staff are responsible. DD and the front office are responsible. They all share the blame for every loss and us not being good enough, not playing well enough to win the division, make the playoffs, and win a championship.

The outcomes of JJ's performances have had a disproportionally negative effect on the season.

But that's not the same as saying his talent or skill or even execution were the cause of the Orioles missing the playoffs, and he could legitimately pitch the same (on aggregate) next year and be a positive force for good.

It wouldn't at all surprise me if Johnson was a great value for someone next year, signing for maybe $4M after being non-tendered and producing 2 rWAR.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I fell bad for JJ, I really do. I still think he is a good pitcher. Up until now, I have given him the benefit of the doubt as the best option available to us. I would be open to having him back next year if he will take a paycut and accept money appropriate to a middle relief role. But he simply cannot be the closer the rest of this year, and I hope we bring in somebody who can take over the role next year. That has to be a top priority for the offseason. It's not just the number of losses but the way they have happened. He just looks mentally weak out there and that is the last thing you want in a closer.

Let's see K-Rod close for the rest of the season, see what JJ can do in middle relief, and go from there in the offseason. Maybe Grant Balfour for 2 years, $10 million?

I fear this is exactly what is going to happen. I mean, I have confidence in Duquette. But the pressure will be strong to say Johnson is going to be overpaid and underperformed, so we'll replace him with Grant Balfour for $5M a year and get two years of 60 innings, 4.40 ERAs, negative WARs and constant whining about how stupid DD is. While Johnson gives the Tigers or the Mariners or somebody 70 innings of a 3.00 with 40 saves.

Do we not remember the Baez/Walker/DeJean/Kline/Reed fiascos? I think I'd rather try the loopy Trea idea of just promoting all of the good young starters from the minors and making them the bullpen, than sign a Balfour for $5M. If you're going to sign a veteran reliever at least make it someone without 37 saves on the resume.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't have the stats to back it up, but from my personal observation ever since him blowing the playoff series last year JJ's pitching seems to correlate negatively with leverage. It's like the higher the leverage the worse he pitches it seems. I don't know for sure and we certaintly remember his debacles with the game on the line more so than his mop up games, but he just has this knack for being really bad when he need him to be good.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.




  • Posts

    • Thanks for the detailed explanation of all of the issues.  Sounds like a mess.
    • Yeah the amenities are pretty outdated at the yard and they seem to do nothing year over year to improve them. The touchscreens have been banged on to death to the point they barely function, so you can't accurately fill out your order at the kiosks, and they don't have a way for the people behind the counter to ring you up at many of the food places. The sound is low to non-existent in certain sections of the club level, like around 218. Seems like there should be speakers that reach there but they might have been damaged by rain, etc. and they are too lazy to fix them. If you go to a game that's even slightly busy, you will wait forever to get into the bathroom, and the sink will be an absolute mess with no soap or paper towels. It's even worse on the club level where they have one sink that's right by the door. Nearby businesses don't care, either. The Hilton parking garage reeks of decay, pot and human waste. They don't turn on the air circulation fans, even if cars are waiting for an hour and a half to exit from P3, filling up the air with carbon monoxide. They only let you enter the stadium with one 20 oz bottle of water. It's so expensive to buy a drink or water in the stadium, but with all the salty food, 20 oz of water isn't enough, especially on a hot day. Vegetarian food options are poor to none, other than things like chips, fries, hot pretzels and the occasional pizza. Vida Taco is better, but at an inconvenient location for many seats. The doors on the club level are not accessible. They're anti-accessible. Big, heavy doors you have to go through to get to/from the escalators, and big, heavy doors to get to your seats, none of them automatic (or even with the option to be automatic with a button press). Makes it hard to carry food out to your seats even if not handicapped. The furniture in the lounges on the club level seem designed to allow as few people as possible to sit down. Not great when we have so many rain delays during the season. Should put more, smaller chairs in and allow more of the club level ticket holders to have a seat while waiting for thunderstorms to pass. They keep a lot of the entrance/exit gates closed except for playoff/sellout games, which means people have to slowly "mooooo" all the way down Eutaw St to get to parking. They are too cheap to staff all the gates, so they make people exit by the warehouse, even though it would be a lot more convenient for many fans to open all the gates. Taking Light Rail would be super convenient, except that if there's at least 20k fans in attendance, it's common to have to wait 90-120 minutes to be able to board a non-full train heading toward Glen Burnie. A few trains might come by, but they are already full, or fill up fast when folks walk up to the Convention Center stop to pre-empt the folks trying to board at Camden Station. None of the garages in the area are set up to require pre-payment on entry (reservation, or give them your card / digital payment at the entrance till). If they were, emptying out the garage would be very quick, as they wouldn't need to ticket anyone on the way out: if you can't get in without paying, you can always just leave without having to stop and scan your phone or put a ticket in the machine. They shut down the Sports Legends Museum at Camden Station in 2015 because the Maryland Stadium Authority was too greedy. That place was a fun distraction if you were in the area when a game wasn't about to start, like if you show up super early on Opening Day or a playoff day. Superbook's restaurant on Eutaw is a huge downgrade from Dempsey's in terms of menu and service quality. Dempsey's used to be well-staffed, you could reserve a table online, and they had all kinds of great selection for every diet. Superbook seems like just another bar serving the same swill that the rest of the park serves, with extremely minimal and low-quality food. For that matter, most of the food at the stadium is very low quality these days. A lot of things we used to love are made to a lower standard now if they are served at all. These are gripes about the stadium and the area that haven't changed my entire adult life. Going to an O's game requires one to tolerate many small inconveniences and several major inconveniences, any number of which could easily be fixed by the relevant authorities if they gave a damn about the people who pay to come see the team play. You would think a mid-market team would be able to afford to invest in the fan experience. You would think the city and partnering organizations like garages, the Stadium Authority and MTA would at least try to do their part to make the experience enjoyable and free of kinks. You would think they would put some thought into handling the "growing pains" of the fanbase due to recent renewed interest after the dark years. Instead, all we get is the same indifference and the same annoyances year in and year out. The whole area is overdue for a revamp. Not sure if $600 mil will get it done, but at least it's a start. Hopefully they can start to patch up some of the many holes in the fan experience. If you're not going to invest in Burnes, at least make it so paying customers have an easier, more enjoyable time getting to/from the stadium and having some food while we're there.
    • Elias has only been in rebuild mode with the O's so there's not much to speculate on there.  Houston, where he spent his formative years, doesn't seem to like to be on the hook for more than a couple of big long-term contracts at any given time.  I can see that as being Elias' choice as well, albeit with a lower overall cost - Houston runs a big payroll.  But it's all guesswork.  I really don't know. If Elias takes the 2025 payroll to $150 million it will creep up to $200 million or so by 2028 just from keeping the core together.  That's where I start to wonder about sustainability due to market size, economic forces, etc., etc., etc... If it were up to me, I would add a couple of free agents this offseason even if the contracts were longer than ideal and be conservative about extensions elsewhere until the prospects establish themselves a little better.  I think there's a competitive opportunity that the team is already into that's worth exploiting. I think ownership is very happy to have Elias on board and they're not inclined to force him to do anything.  I also think Rubenstein's demonstrated business prowess is great enough to assume that he has had plenty enough time to come to a mutual understanding with Elias as to goals.
    • We need a RH O’hearn…in addition to Westburg. At least 3 batters that will push up the pitch count and cause damage in the top 5 of the lineup.
    • Boy,  that Jackson Merrill is a good young player that is playing his best ball down the season stretch and in the playoffs.   He's only 21.  I guess some young guys are able to play up to the pressure.   Who could have guessed that?
    • I’m aware.   You are arguing something im Not.
    • What agreement? The agreement you are talking about happened as a result of the move.  The MASN agreement would not have existed if Angelos had gone to court to block the move.
  • Popular Contributors

×
×
  • Create New...