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Man what is Dan thinking for real. Orioles will Tender all 9 players


Greg

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Can someone please explain the arbitration process? I know the O's come to the table with a number and JJ's agent comes with a number, they negotiate to try to reach a deal. I assume if a deal isn't struck the negotiator arrives at a number. Now...once that number is presented what options do the O's have?

You are almost correct. The arbitrator picks EITHER the O's number or the player's number. There is no "compromise".

They still have the option to trade him if they want. Their other option is to try to negotiate before the arbitration process.

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Can someone please explain the arbitration process? I know the O's come to the table with a number and JJ's agent comes with a number, they negotiate to try to reach a deal. I assume if a deal isn't struck the negotiator arrives at a number. Now...once that number is presented what options do the O's have?

That's mediation. Arbitration means each side presents its case for its number. At the end, the arbitrator chooses one of the sides as the winner. During the arbitration process, the team and player can side bar and reach their own agreement. But the arbitrator can only choose one of the two submitted numbers.

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Can someone please explain the arbitration process? I know the O's come to the table with a number and JJ's agent comes with a number, they negotiate to try to reach a deal. I assume if a deal isn't struck the negotiator arrives at a number. Now...once that number is presented what options do the O's have?

The team presents a number and the player presents a number. They make their cases and the arbitrator picks one if the two numbers. Most often agreements are made prior to arbitration.

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Yeah, I'm having the same problem with DD on this one. Hopefully it's all talk and he is trying to deal him.

This has been my guess--I suspect that Duquette came out early with such a big statement about resigning Johnson in order to (a) allay Buck's fears and (b) not decrease his trade value by countering the impression that the O's wd love to unload him (Johnson's blown saves last season having been widely noted throughout baseball).

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I think probably, but might have to wait until mid-season and hope for a competitor looking to shore up the pen with an extra arm (or to cover an injury). Otherwise, who's the team out there with money to burn and looking for an $8MM pen arm?

Well premium closers are paid more than 8 mil, but yeah, I agree that a lot of teams may not view him as that.

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The issue the Orioles are running into now is they have to keep up the charade that they are actually trying to win and build a team to take it all the way, even though we all know that the main goal is to make money. You can't go trading away your best players, because that doesn't jive with the company line. I mean we were told in no uncertain terms the MASN money would be used to improve the team....they surely can't go and dump salary now or that would make them look like the liars they are.

So we are left with no trades. No spending money. Dumpster diving for reclamation projects. Keep the same old same old around, pray that lightning strikes like it did in 2012 and they can say "see we told you so!" They can trot the same 80-85 win team out there every year and say "well we just didn't get the breaks this year, had injuries" and the casual fan will buy it (and tickets) hook line and sinker. Turnstiles keep moving, the head guy in the law office is happy.

By making bold moves that should be made in a Rays type of operation they are basically saying we have been lying to you all this whole time, we aren't allowed to spend money and the jig is up in Angelos eyes. It is all window dressing, and has been for years. They will NEVER trade any of the big draws on the team, they will never pay them(Ok they do in RARE cases where they are basically forced to ala Jonesy, Nick, BRob), they will just ride it out and make up some other nonsense about "what had happened was..."

What we are left with is a team that he zero capability to win it all, will continue to make money hand over fist every year for the owner, yet leaves the average fan with the idea that things are progressing in the right direction. In reality we are just slowly going back to the "sitting on the fence" days all over again stuck in mediocrity.

Maybe there are some who still choose to "sit down and shut up" like a good little soldier, but I am not one of them and a lot of people aren't these days. They are fed up. I won't accept it, and any other fan of this team shouldn't either. Nothing will change if everyone just falls in line, but unfortunately between the media and the crushed morale of this fanbase I fear that is what is happening with some of the real die hards.

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We'll see how the offseason runs. Right now, I think it's a tough sell to say Mr. Duquette is using best efforts to maximize the product on the field -- if you're spending $10MM on an "okay" closer, you're probably not doing all you can to maximize your team's ability to win on a limited budget.

Nice original post Tony, but in my opinion, your giving DD far too much credit in the 2 winning seasons we have had.

I completely agree with you Stotle!

If this team was being run like the Rays, or another solid low budget team, players like Johnson, Hardy, Weiters, and possibly Davis, would be gone. Instead, at the moment, its being like run like it has no direction. IF, and I say IF because I don't necessarily believe it, DD has to keep the budget down, then he needed to move quickly. This whole, waiting for the "market to set itself" is an excuse for doing nothing. Our players have solid value and waiting for teams to sign FA's at their positions, is an "out" for DD to stand pat. It's compounded by the fact that we all know we cannot truly compete, without a addition of #2 type starter.

Let's go to the dance and let the other guys ask all the pretty girls to dance in the hopes that one will show up late.

Bottom line, the O's can win IF they add a #2, with or without Johnson or Weiters.

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The issue the Orioles are running into now is they have to keep up the charade that they are actually trying to win and build a team to take it all the way, even though we all know that the main goal is to make money. You can't go trading away your best players, because that doesn't jive with the company line. I mean we were told in no uncertain terms the MASN money would be used to improve the team....they surely can't go and dump salary now or that would make them look like the liars they are.

So we are left with no trades. No spending money. Dumpster diving for reclamation projects. Keep the same old same old around, pray that lightning strikes like it did in 2012 and they can say "see we told you so!" They can trot the same 80-85 win team out there every year and say "well we just didn't get the breaks this year, had injuries" and the casual fan will buy it (and tickets) hook line and sinker. Turnstiles keep moving, the head guy in the law office is happy.

By making bold moves that should be made in a Rays type of operation they are basically saying we have been lying to you all this whole time, we aren't allowed to spend money and the jig is up in Angelos eyes. It is all window dressing, and has been for years. They will NEVER trade any of the big draws on the team, they will never pay them(Ok they do in RARE cases where they are basically forced to ala Jonesy, Nick, BRob), they will just ride it out and make up some other nonsense about "what had happened was..."

What we are left with is a team that he zero capability to win it all, will continue to make money hand over fist every year for the owner, yet leaves the average fan with the idea that things are progressing in the right direction. In reality we are just slowly going back to the "sitting on the fence" days all over again stuck in mediocrity.

Maybe there are some who still choose to "sit down and shut up" like a good little soldier, but I am not one of them and a lot of people aren't these days. They are fed up. I won't accept it, and any other fan of this team shouldn't either. Nothing will change if everyone just falls in line, but unfortunately between the media and the crushed morale of this fanbase I fear that is what is happening with some of the real die hards.

The Baltimore Orioles are coming off two winning seasons and a playoff appearance in the last two seasons. I can root for a team like that.

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Step back a second and read what you are writing. I have written many times about how I think AM was judged poorly while he was here and how he laid a foundation that was much stronger than many originally thought.

However, regardless of what you think of DD, it is sophomoric to say that he needs to make an impact trade like AM or this team is spinning its wheels.

Spinning it's wheels?

Spinning it's wheels?

DD got here, was picked to finish last and said, we are gonna win, now. He did. And he followed that up with another winning season. You may or may not remember the previous 14 seasons. I do!

It is fantastic that we have progressed to the point where back to back winning seasons constitutes spinning our wheels. I can actually remember a time when the last two seasons would in fact have been thought of that way. I am not necessarily convinced that DD is going to get the Orioles another World Championship, but the arrogance of he is spinning is wheels, he is terrible, blah blah blah, is exactly the same type of ignorance that we saw in 1997 from a certain owner. And the type of ignorance and attitude that we continue to rail about today as holding us back.

Sorry not necessarily picking on you, and not trying to sanctify DD unnecessarily either, but in terms of comparing DD and AM, who both have had positive value to the franchise, the only real exhibit that needs to be examined is Third Baseman Manny Machado. That is Gold Glove Third Baseman Manny Machado.

DD made that move. And that move had direct impact on two winning seasons.

Spinning wheels at this point is doing just good enough to have winning seasons but not being able to progress farther than that. What happened to doing whatever it takes when we are close? Obviously another lie from Angelos. Now what is likely to happen is that the team may have a couple more winning seasons, not advance in the playoffs, or not even make the playoffs, the core guys leave and the team goes back to losing.

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