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When do the O's fish or cut bait with Duquette and Showalter?

Frobby

By Frobby
in Orioles Talk

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weams Hangout Grand Counsel

weams

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34 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

If you are going for it next year you keep Dan, if you are blowing it up you replace him.

You let Buck do what he wants as long as he doesn't want to be the GM.

I'm with you.

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Can_of_corn Hangout Grand Counsel

Can_of_corn

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Just now, SteveA said:

And I also doubt he wants to stay past his contract, given his attempts to get out of it and go to Toronto.

I agree with your assessment about keeping Duquette for his last year being dependent on going for it in 2018.

Although I have to say, assuming we have a winning season this year, it seems unlikely that a team would fire a GM after his 6th consecutive non-losing seasons that started shortly after he took over, following 14 straight losing seasons.   I fully understand your logic but how often does a guy producing good, consistent results get fired?

I think that if you tell Dan you are blowing it up (which they won't do if they have a winning season) it wouldn't be hard to get him to step down.

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MDtransplant757 Hangout Grand Counsel

MDtransplant757

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12 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

You think Maddon runs Hardy out there in the two hole for the better part of a season?

Do you see name players taking less money to play for Buck?

Yeah, he did with jayson heyward last year for the most part. 

No, but the Cubs are 5th in player payroll

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Can_of_corn Hangout Grand Counsel

Can_of_corn

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2 minutes ago, MDtransplant757 said:

Yeah, he did with jayson heyward last year for the most part. 

No, but the Cubs are 5th in player payroll

Heyward's OBP last year was 306.  Not good but a far cry from the 282 Hardy put up in 2012.  He also only batted second in 66 games, Hardy did 150 times.  So yea, not the same thing.

As for their payroll, so what?  Do you think that was the best deal Zobrist could get?

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Malike Hangout Grand Counsel

Malike

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42 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

You think Maddon runs Hardy out there in the two hole for the better part of a season?

Do you see name players taking less money to play for Buck?

He did throw Heyward out there for about 81 games with his 70 OPS+ before moving him to the 5th spot for most of the rest of the season.

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Can_of_corn Hangout Grand Counsel

Can_of_corn

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1 minute ago, Malike said:

He did throw Heyward out there for about 81 games with his 70 OPS+ before moving him to the 5th spot for most of the rest of the season.

 

26 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Heyward's OBP last year was 306.  Not good but a far cry from the 282 Hardy put up in 2012.  He also only batted second in 66 games, Hardy did 150 times.  So yea, not the same thing.

As for their payroll, so what?  Do you think that was the best deal Zobrist could get?

I even did the work for you.

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Malike Hangout Grand Counsel

Malike

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1 minute ago, Can_of_corn said:

 

I even did the work for you.

I didn't see that post. Looking at the Cubs lineup all year last year, no matter what work you show, it's hard to defend hitting Heyward in the 2nd or 5th hole after about 1/3 of the season and he wasn't hitting. At all.

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Can_of_corn Hangout Grand Counsel

Can_of_corn

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Posted
Just now, Malike said:

I didn't see that post. Looking at the Cubs lineup all year last year, no matter what work you show, it's hard to defend hitting Heyward in the 2nd or 5th hole after about 1/3 of the season and he wasn't hitting. At all.

Heyward had a substantially better resume to date than Hardy did. 

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Malike Hangout Grand Counsel

Malike

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Just now, Can_of_corn said:

It is still not a miscue on the level of batting Hardy and his 282 OBP second for 150 games. 

No, but it's not as far off as you make it seem either. I'm of the mind that both managers are a bit overrated. Joe's hipster glasses and beard have yet to sway me in his favor.

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Can_of_corn Hangout Grand Counsel

Can_of_corn

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Just now, Malike said:

No, but it's not as far off as you make it seem either. I'm of the mind that both managers are a bit overrated. Joe's hipster glasses and beard have yet to sway me in his favor.

I don't think he is appreciably better than Buck.  I think he and Bochy might be marginally better.  That guy in NY is better than I want to give him credit for as well.

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Malike Hangout Grand Counsel

Malike

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4 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I don't think he is appreciably better than Buck.  I think he and Bochy might be marginally better.  That guy in NY is better than I want to give him credit for as well.

Unfortunately, I agree with you about that guy.

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SteveA Hangout Grand Counsel

SteveA

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5 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I don't think he is appreciably better than Buck.  I think he and Bochy might be marginally better.  That guy in NY is better than I want to give him credit for as well.

Yeah, I have Yankee fan friends that hate Girardi.   And I tell them... look at how the team performs most years compared to their talent.    He's doing something right.

His huge # of visits to the mound (by the catcher, PC, and himself), over managing the bullpen, both annoy me during the game.   And they annoy Yankee fans I know too.

But you can't argue with his results.   (Just like you have to give Buck some credit for our continual over-performance over the PECOTA guesses, nearly every year).

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thezeroes Major Leaguer Rising Star

thezeroes

Posted
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7 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I don't think he is appreciably better than Buck.  I think he and Bochy might be marginally better.  That guy in NY is better than I want to give him credit for as well.

Who was to bat second in his stead??  The Orioles used 8 different batters at lead off in 2012.

Nolan Reimold

Nick Markakis

Nate McLouth

Xavier Avery

Ryan Flaherty

Robert Andino

Brian Roberts

Endy Chavez

Batting third was also in flux with eight different players starting in that spot.

I think to hold Buck and his usage of Hardy in the two hole as an argument when the 2012 team was in flux all year is a bit of stretch.

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