Anyone else cheering for the O's to lose?

[BaltimoreTerp]

Scenario 1:

O's end the year hot and finish 500...Because of the hot finish, we decide to go for it...We sign A Jones to a 7/119 deal and we don't trade anyone. Over the next 7 years(the terms of Jones's contract), the Orioles max out at 88 wins and are usually in the 75-85 win area...We never make the playoffs.

Scenario 2:

We end the year with 72 wins....The FO decides it is finally time to rebuild properly...They trade guys, get younger, build a lot of talent and get a high draft pick, thus setting us up long term.

Which scenario would you prefer?

So those are the ONLY two scenarios?

[rolliefingers]

This is a terrible attitude. This isn't a hedge fund, and it ain't the NBA, it's baseball. Of all the crappy things to suggest...

Tanking works better in MLB than in the NBA, as the Celtics just found out the hard way.

That said, no, I'm not rooting for them to lose. I'm rooting for them to play the kids and for good things to happen when the kids play. I'm also rooting for Tejada, Huff, Payton, Bradford, Walker and Baez to keep raising their respective trade values. The final score doesn't really matter to me.

[Sports Guy]

So those are the ONLY two scenarios?

Did you see a third one? Fourth one? Fifth one?

Those are your choices...We go for it and it never amounts to anything(similar to Javy/Tejada) or we rebuild, get younger and build for the future properly.

[JoeOrsulak]

Exactly! And who is to say that just because you draft at the number #5 that you might not get a pick who was projected to be at #2 or 3. Wasn't Weiters slotted to be a top 3 pick? And we drafted him at 5.

How about the Tigers in this years draft. They certainly didn't have to lose to get the top pitching prospect in the draft, Frederick Porcello.

You can hope, but it makes it less likely that a player that caliber of Alvarez will drop to lets say 6.

[orioles119]

Those are your choices...We go for it and it never amounts to anything(similar to Javy/Tejada) or we rebuild, get younger and build for the future properly.

What would "building properly" look like? I can't take your word for it, because your version will change about a hundred times.

[rolliefingers]

Let's say we lose out from now on and end up with that pick of Alvarez, whoever the Hell he is.

OK, it's posts like this that drive me insane. If your contention is that tanking to get the #1 pick will not be a good strategy, at least know something about the guy who's widely expected to go #1.

There's no chance we get Alvarez - the Rays have him sewn up - but if we had a chance at him, then I might advocate tanking.

[Mashed Potatoes]

Scenario 1:

O's end the year hot and finish 500...Because of the hot finish, we decide to go for it...We sign A Jones to a 7/119 deal and we don't trade anyone. Over the next 7 years(the terms of Jones's contract), the Orioles max out at 88 wins and are usually in the 75-85 win area...We never make the playoffs.

Scenario 2:

We end the year with 72 wins....The FO decides it is finally time to rebuild properly...They trade guys, get younger, build a lot of talent and get a high draft pick, thus setting us up long term.

Which scenario would you prefer?

Obviously scenario 2, but there's a million problems with your question.

-If we finish well that doesn't mean we will even try, much less succeed in signing Jones and completely go for it next year.

-If we tank what makes you think we'll decide to properly rebuild since we've tanked the past 9 seasons.

-There are many other scenarios in between and outside those two. It's possible to win now and make moves that improve us in the short and long term.

No one wants to trade a hot finish and 3rd place in the division for a shot at real contention, but tanking is far from causation much less correlation to our organization finally doing the right things.

[BaltimoreTerp]

Just answer the question....Was it good or bad for the Orioles that we swept the Yankees?

It is an impossible question to answer, because it assumes that we knew ahead of time that we had a choice:

Lose and get Mark Teixiera, future superstar and possible hometown hero.

Win and get Chris Smith, future injury magnet and definite bust.

So, like I said, tell me right now what the future consequences of winning a couple extra games versus losing a couple extra games THIS year, when it comes to players.

[rolliefingers]

As I type this Dane Cook is on TV talking about baseball. I'm in a horrible mood.

This is going to be a lonnnnnng "Actober".

[Sports Guy]

What would "building properly" look like? I can't take your word for it, because your version will change about a hundred times.

Getting young, cheap talented ML ready players AND building and deepening out weak farm system.

Get rid of a lot of money so that we have that to spend long term as well.

[BaltimoreTerp]

Did you see a third one? Fourth one? Fifth one?

Those are your choices...We go for it and it never amounts to anything(similar to Javy/Tejada) or we rebuild, get younger and build for the future properly.

In other words, you are saying that this team is guaranteed to do scenario one if we win and two if we lose. There is no chance of something else happening.

Andy McPhail and Peter Angelos told you this?

[Sports Guy]

Obviously scenario 2, but there's a million problems with your question.

-If we finish well that doesn't mean we will even try, much less succeed in signing Jones and completely go for it next year.

-If we tank what makes you think we'll decide to properly rebuild since we've tanked the past 9 seasons.

-There are many other scenarios in between and outside those two. It's possible to win now and make moves that improve us in the short and long term.

No one wants to trade a hot finish and 3rd place in the division for a shot at real contention, but tanking is far from causation much less correlation to our organization finally doing the right things.

Well, you can't really tank in baseball.

And it doesn't matter if the Orioles will accomplish those things...Those are directions that the team could realistically go...Which way is the best way?

[BaltimoreTerp]

OK, it's posts like this that drive me insane. If your contention is that tanking to get the #1 pick will not be a good strategy, at least know something about the guy who's widely expected to go #1.

There's no chance we get Alvarez - the Rays have him sewn up - but if we had a chance at him, then I might advocate tanking.

Umm...did you read the WHOLE post?

[ElToro75]

He is rooting for them to loose for long term gain...Not sure why this is so hard to figure out.

Who cares if we win 75 games or 68 games? What the hell is the difference besides a better draft position?

I see that side of the debate, but I just can't bring myself to root for my team to lose. Maybe it's just me (and others here as well), but I just can't do it.

If we lose a game by putting prospects in to get them playing time, that's a whole different story. I'm still going to root for the team the same whether it's the everyday guys out there on the field or a mix of prospects and everyday players. Hopefully we win with the prospects on the field, but a lot of times their MLB inexperience can end up costing the team the win.

[JoeOrsulak]

OK, it's posts like this that drive me insane. If your contention is that tanking to get the #1 pick will not be a good strategy, at least know something about the guy who's widely expected to go #1.

There's no chance we get Alvarez - the Rays have him sewn up - but if we had a chance at him, then I might advocate tanking.

Justin Smoak 1b USC has been called 1B by baseball prospectus. Keith Law of ESPN states he likes Justin better than Alvarez. Haven't seen anyone support that claim.

Don't think i would stick my nose at a college read 1b prospect.