Adam Jones wins Gold Glove

[ejf1025]

Can't we all just get along? Damn.

I agree...how is this bad news?

Our centerfield just won the Gold Glove!

Be excited fellas, this is like the first thing to go our way in a decade!

[RShack]

I don't see how anyone gets any satisfaction out of an Oriole being recognized for something he didn't deserve. I guess it's nice on some level, but hollow and meaningless all the same.

Well, you put more emphasis on stats as being "true baseball" than most folks do.

The reason he won is the same reason Brooks won, and it had nothing to do with stats. It had to do with plays that made people think OMG. With AJ, it was taking away dingers, with Brooks it was other stuff. Now, we have reason to think that the D-stats we didn't have for Brooks would have shown him to score quite highly, but D-stats are not why he won his GG's. D-stats are not why anybody anywhere on any planet has won a GG. Rather, GG's are won based on the impression you make, and AJ has what we might call "impression charisma".

If Adam Jones needs undeserved awards to motivate him we have bigger problems.

Well, I don't think he needs it. For myself, I just hope it doesn't go to his head. I think the AS game did, and I hope this doesn't. I hope he still thinks of himself as a young guy who needs to be disciplined and work hard, not as a sudden star who deserves his own brand of bubblegum (yet).

[byrdz]

That might be what the voters are asking each other.

If anything this says more about how much weight the voters (managers) give to UZR and other such stats, which is kinda scary. For all we know these managers could be voting because Jones robbed them of a run in a particular game and this sticks out for some reason. Jones is also establishing himself and has been to the All Star game so that sticks with the voters I'm sure. Maybe Jones smiled at them in the hallway. It's got to be an very unscientific process for sure.

Here's a question, should all the voters do is look at a stats page, and decide from that?

[RVAbird]

Is it?

It's not like Jones embarrased himself out there...

No, of course not. I'm not going to get into the details of why I think my analogy is more fitting because it would get a little weird...

I realize some people are getting pretty sensitive about this topic, so I should say I apologize if I've sounded too contentious or snarky. I said my congrats to Adam Jones, I was just interested in the argument.

This award definitely shouldn't be a reason for Orioles fans to get all uppity with each other. Some of us just have different reactions to this than others.

I will now begin the process that may lead to one of our two analogies

[ejf1025]

No, of course not. I'm not going to get into the details of why I think my analogy is more fitting because it would get a little weird...

I realize some people are getting pretty sensitive about this topic, so I should say I apologize if I've sounded too contentious or snarky. I said my congrats to Adam Jones, I was just interested in the argument.

This award definitely shouldn't be a reason for Orioles fans to get all uppity with each other. Some of us just have different reactions to this than others.

I will now begin the process that may lead to one of our two analogies

Haha...touche.

I guess I feel this is just the nature of baseball....the new wave of stats are great because they take advantge of the fact that baseball is pretty much a series of individual acts that can be measured.

But the great part about baseball....is the main act (hitting the ball) is also the most unpredictable act in any sport. Line drives are outs, dribblers are singles and everything in between.

This is our one little O's fan moment...was he one of the best OFers in the AL...no, prob not. But he's a good OFer with the talent to be great...and that's good enough for me.

[Boy Howdy]

Here's an interesting stat.

Adam Jones' range factor per nine innings in 2009 was higher than any season Paul Blair had in his career.

2009 Jones = 3.21

1974 Blair = 3.18

1976 Blair = 3.17

1970 Blair = 3.13

1973 Blair = 3.00

Now I'll return the forum to the people who want to argue that how many plays a guy actually makes is "meaningless" compared to how many the latest alphabet soup says he coulda woulda shoulda caught.

Then when they get tired of that, they can return to arguing how wins are "meaningless" etc. I'm kidding, but only half kidding.

[OsB4Bros]

Well deserved!!! Congrats Adam!

[Moose Milligan]

I don't see how anyone gets any satisfaction out of an Oriole being recognized for something he didn't deserve. I guess it's nice on some level, but hollow and meaningless all the same.

If Adam Jones needs undeserved awards to motivate him we have bigger problems.

Oh lighten up.

Next you'll be talking about how Jones "thinks he can get away with" subpar outfield play.

Sound familiar?

[BaltimoreTerp]

That might be what the voters are asking each other.

If anything this says more about how much weight the voters (managers) give to UZR and other such stats, which is kinda scary. For all we know these managers could be voting because Jones robbed them of a run in a particular game and this sticks out for some reason. Jones is also establishing himself and has been to the All Star game so that sticks with the voters I'm sure. Maybe Jones smiled at them in the hallway. It's got to be an very unscientific process for sure.

Here's a question, should all the voters do is look at a stats page, and decide from that?

If the voters don't even know who Gutierrez is, and can't find some way to figure it out without just looking at a stats page (a :rolleyestf: on it's own), maybe they SHOULDN'T BE the voters.

[Mike B]

Awesome for AJ. An O finally gets some love.

Something positive from a dark dreary season for the O's and their fans. A reason to celebrate!!!! :clap3:

An O finally wins a GG and it's been 10 yrs. in coming, and some still want to argue about whether he deserved it or not. I just don't get it!

So what, bottom line, it's a fact....he won it. SWEET!!!!!!!

Spot on. Good for AJ and good for the Orioles.

[Boy Howdy]

Adam Jones' range factor per nine innings in 2009 was higher than any season Paul Blair had in his career.

2009 Jones = 3.21

1974 Blair = 3.18

1976 Blair = 3.17

1970 Blair = 3.13

1973 Blair = 3.00

Just to follow this up, I looked at 56 years of Baltimore Orioles centerfielders, 1954-2009.

Here are the top range factors per 9 innings based on playing at least half the club's innings at the position:

3.22 - Al Bumbry (1982)

3.21 - Adam Jones (2009)

3.18 - Paul Blair (1974)

3.17 - Paul Blair (1976)

3.16 - Al Bumbry (1980)

3.13 - Paul Blair (1970)

3.06 - Chuck Diering (1954)

3.04 - Jim Busby (1957)

3.04 - John Shelby (1984)

3.01 - Mike Devereaux (1990)

3.00 - Paul Blair (1973)

Say what you will,but that's pretty good company. Jonesy had a helluva year.

[BaltimoreTerp]

I don't see how anyone gets any satisfaction out of an Oriole being recognized for something he didn't deserve. I guess it's nice on some level, but hollow and meaningless all the same.

If Adam Jones needs undeserved awards to motivate him we have bigger problems.

Simple: we're fans, and one of our players has been recognized for a major league-wide award.

I mean, if Roberts won the MVP this season (which I know is a complete impossibility, before anyone tries to destroy my weak hypothetical situation) should we complain to high heaven about Mauer getting screwed? Let everyone else bemoan the crime! Let us celebrate not getting screwed ourselves for once! :clap3:

[RShack]

Just to follow this up, I looked at 56 years of Baltimore Orioles centerfielders, 1954-2009.

Here are the top range factors per 9 innings based on playing at least half the club's innings at the position:

3.22 - Al Bumbry (1982)

3.21 - Adam Jones (2009)

3.18 - Paul Blair (1974)

3.17 - Paul Blair (1976)

3.16 - Al Bumbry (1980)

3.13 - Paul Blair (1970)

3.06 - Chuck Diering (1954)

3.04 - Jim Busby (1957)

3.04 - John Shelby (1984)

3.01 - Mike Devereaux (1990)

3.00 - Paul Blair (1973)

Say what you will,but that's pretty good company. Jonesy had a helluva year.

For those who might wonder, his 2008 RF/9 was 2.78, so the improvement in that particular measure was quite large.

[byrdz]

If the voters don't even know who Gutierrez is, and can't find some way to figure it out without just looking at a stats page (a :rolleyestf: on it's own), maybe they SHOULDN'T BE the voters.

That's kind of my point. The wrong people are voting.

[RevOlution]

Here are the top range factors per 9 innings based on playing at least half the club's innings at the position:

3.22 - Al Bumbry (1982)

3.21 - Adam Jones (2009)

Say what you will,but that's pretty good company. Jonesy had a helluva year.

My two fav O's!

Ditto!!!!! Couldn't have said it better.