If Jones goes, Wieters has to go too.

[JTrea81]

Those two are the future of this club. You can't deal one and keep the other.

Trading Jones signals a rebuild. You can spin it anyway you want but if you don't get talent back for Jones that can contribute right away and you don't replace his bat with proven talent, that's a loss in the near future.

I know people want to give up on 2012 already and build for 2014, but that means you have one or two years of Matt Wieters in his prime behind the plate left. You won't want to extend him well into his 30s as look at the mess the Twins have with Mauer now.

Catchers do not age well defensively. His arm strength is going to drop off and he's going to have issues with his knees and back most likely given his tall frame.

Boras is going to want something pretty substantial for him even if he only improves sllightly offensively and if he takes off, look out.

It's pretty clear that Wieters will have to be traded at some point.

So if you are going to waste 2012 and 2013, it makes no sense to keep Wieters now as he's just being wasted on a losing team when he would have enormous trade value, much more than Jones.

If you really want to get something from Atlanta, offer them a Jones and Wieters package for instance.

You could get 3-4 top prospects for Wieters easily as catchers like him are that rare. And we can stick anybody behind the plate on a losing club. Why waste Wieters there when he has that trade value?

And the sooner you trade him, the sooner those prospects can get ML experience to help with the team in 2014. If you wait to deal him a year or so later, now you have to wait for those prospects to develop and now you are really looking at 2015-2016 to compete.

And that's far too long to wait.

If you want to start that rebuild now for 2014, you've got to deal Wieters now to maximize your talent acquisition and allow time for development.

[CA-ORIOLE]

Those two are the future of this club. You can't deal one and keep the other.

Trading Jones signals a rebuild. You can spin it anyway you want but if you don't get talent back for Jones that can contribute right away and you don't replace his bat with proven talent, that's a loss in the near future.

I know people want to give up on 2012 already and build for 2014, but that means you have one or two years of Matt Wieters in his prime behind the plate left. You won't want to extend him well into his 30s as look at the mess the Twins have with Mauer now.

Catchers do not age well defensively. His arm strength is going to drop off and he's going to have issues with his knees and back most likely given his tall frame.

Boras is going to want something pretty substantial for him even if he only improves sllightly offensively and if he takes off, look out.

It's pretty clear that Wieters will have to be traded at some point.

So if you are going to waste 2012 and 2013, it makes no sense to keep Wieters now as he's just being wasted on a losing team when he would have enormous trade value, much more than Jones.

If you really want to get something from Atlanta, offer them a Jones and Wieters package for instance.

You could get 3-4 top prospects for Wieters easily as catchers like him are that rare. And we can stick anybody behind the plate on a losing club. Why waste Wieters there when he has that trade value?

And the sooner you trade him, the sooner those prospects can get ML experience to help with the team in 2014. If you wait to deal him a year or so later, now you have to wait for those prospects to develop and now you are really looking at 2015-2016 to compete.

And that's far too long to wait.

Well, many people did want to strip the team down and significantly rebuild/restructure. Most, including myself, view Wieters far differently than Jones though. Jones isn't a guy to build a team around. Wieters may very well be. So, I'm kinda with you on the seemingly half ass approach. For me, a lot will depend on the package we get for Jones. Not like this is anything new.

[JTrea81]

Well, many people did want to strip the team down and significantly rebuild/restructure. Most, including myself, view Wieters far differently than Jones though. Jones isn't a guy to build a team around. Wieters may very well be. So, I'm kinda with you on the seemingly half ass approach. For me, a lot will depend on the package we get for Jones. Not like this is anything new.

Wieters is also likely to flame out earlier than Jones because of the position he plays and the value he gets solely from his defense, so Jones is the better bet longevity wise.

Just look at how long Hunter stayed as a good player.

Trading Jones and keeping Wieters is like the Orioles trading Bedard and keeping Markakis.

You've got to go all in if you want to go that route. Otherwise we are looking at a repeat of the previous 4 years.

[CA-ORIOLE]

Trading Jones and keeping Wieters is like the Orioles trading Bedard and keeping Markakis.

You've got to go all in if you want to go that route. Otherwise we are looking at a repeat of the previous 4 years.

I'd have preferred that myself, but probably still would have kept Wieters and the young pitchers. Hardy for sure should be dealt. Guthrie, JJ, Reynolds and even Nick if there was a buyer.

[JTrea81]

I'd have preferred that myself, but probably still would have kept Wieters and the young pitchers. Hardy for sure should be dealt. Guthrie, JJ, Reynolds and even Nick if there was a buyer.

What does keeping Wieters gain you though?

Why not deal him for a maximum return if we need an infusion of talent? He is our best trading chip by far and will not be the player he is today at least defensively when this team is ready to compete if they stay the course.

Jones may only have two years left under team control, but Wieters likely only has 4 years left of being the player he is now. The clock is ticking on him.

[CA-ORIOLE]

What does keeping Wieters gain you though?

Why not deal him for a maximum return if we need an infusion of talent? He is our best trading chip by far and will not be the player he is today at least defensively when this team is ready to compete if they stay the course.

I think you keep/extend him and see if he develops into a premium talent before dealing him. He has much more upside than Jones and I'm not sure we'd be getting maximum return at this point. Also, he has spent a lot of time with the young pitchers already.

[JTrea81]

I think you keep/extend him and see if he develops into a premium talent before dealing him. He has much more upside than Jones. Also he has spent a lot of time with the young pitchers already.

So you'd be willing to pay $15+ million per season for a broken down Matt Wieters in his 30's, as Boras won't let you only buy out one or two FA years, but not less than that for a healthy Adam Jones?

The only upside Wieters has left is with the bat and it remains to be seen how much. His defense can't improve any and it will only decline. Jones can improve his defense and his bat and will likely outlast Wieters.

[CA-ORIOLE]

So you'd be willing to pay $15+ million per season for a broken down Matt Wieters in his 30's, as Boras won't let you only buy out one or two FA years, but not less than that for a healthy Adam Jones?

The only upside Wieters has left is with the bat. His defense can't improve any and it will only decline. Jones can improve his defense and his bat and will likely outlast Wieters.

ehh, hard to say what will happen with Boras/an extension. He's not god. He didn't exactly help out Madsen. That said,even if that the case, yeah you wait for him to develop as a hitter and then deal him if things don't work out with the young pitchers. I'd say Wieters has some pretty huge potential upside with the bat over Jones and Jones needs to be a corner OF and not a centerfielder. He's not a good defender in CF and will only get worse there imo.

[ChaosLex]

If Jones goes, so does Wieters

If Fielder signs elsewhere or we don't trade the farm for Votto, I'm done with the team

Anyone who wants Jones traded should be ashamed of themselves

I'll give Trea one thing, he's been on a roll lately.

[ScottP]

If Jones doesn't want to extend, now would be the time to move him; you'd get less if he's a 1 year rental. I'd hate to see Wieters go, but if I were in that mindset (and I see the logic in making the move), I'd give him another year; he should continue to progress and his trade value would be even higher. It's not like this team, currently constructed is going anywhere, any time soon, unless the pitching staff does a turnaround.

[Fan4Life]

:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:

punchline

[JTrea81]

How much is Wieters' value going to increase really?

Right now he's probably worth 3-4 top prospects.

Teixeira himself didn't net much more than that.

Nobody was willing to trade 5 top prospects for Justin Upton, a player that had more value than Wieters ever will.

So why do we think a team will give up their farm system for Wieters when no team has done that for any player in recent history?

I think it's more a matter of some fans like Wieters better than Jones and want something to watch when they go to the ballpark.

[Dr. FLK]

So...if we trade the CFer with a sub 800 OPS and defense better suited for left field who may not even want to extend here anyway, we also have to trade the gold glove catcher? I think people really, REALLY overrate Jones's level of performance and his value to this team. He's a good player for sure, but he's not all that "special" compared to typical OF. His performance is not hard to replicate.

So, if we "must" trade Wieters also, lets perform one exercise first. List all of the OF who are more valuable than Jones. Then, list all of the C who are more valuable than Wieters.

[Dr. FLK]

What does keeping Wieters gain you though?

It gains you Wieters.

[UMDTerrapins]

1) He's under our control for 4 more seasons.

2) He will bring as much in return next offseason as he will this offseason if his production remains comparable, so there's no urgency to deal him.

3) He's only 26 and has just two full seasons of experience......we don't know that he's peaked offensively yet.

4) We've already screwed with Britton, Matusz, Arrieta, Tillman, Bergesen and Berken enough with our changes in pitching coaches and managers....let them at least keep Weiters, their only constant.

5) Like we are with Jones, I think his trade value is being overstated a little.

6) There's virtually no chance it will happen because of who's in charge and how they value him, so what's the point in debating it. (rhetorical, hence the absence of a question mark)