Churchill's latest - Jones and Bedard

[33rdst]

Before I respond I'd like to clarify a couple of things.

1. I do think it's a big deal if we don't trade Bedard

2. I am for trading Bedard for the right package.

3. While I used to hold a similar point of view to that of Wildcard, I've changed it.

Well my take on it is that it was significant enough to have been mentioned on air in contrast to the fact that Guthrie stayed when he could have left. I think it's just one more indication of Bedard's commitment, or lack there of, to this team and this organization. In chosing to defend his action one would simply be making apologies for him. Why they would feel a need to I don't know.

[mikezpen]

I'm glad he bagged it late in the season. Best thing that could have happened to the Orioles.

[TinCup]

The way the O's were playing, I wanted to go with him. August and September were horrible. I do not question Bedard's wanting to be on the mound nor his effort when he is on the mound. As a guy would has overcome a lot through the rehab of TJ surgery, I think he has earned a little trust.

Sir, can't argue one iota with you on this post. Well stated.

The whole notion of trading Bedard should be based primarily on his talent (secondarily on his apparent unwillingness to re-up) and what he might get us in return. Not at all because of his leaving to go home last year...

[wildcard]

Coming from a highly qualified player/talent evaluator like yourself.

I am not the only one that thinks you and others overvalue Orioles players and undervalue those from other teams. Suffice to say, you clearly don't give them away, but at some point you have to decide what is acceptable or not and move them.

In any event, we don't know yet who may be coming back for sure so you can't say this with full certainty.

I totally agree that we don't know the players that are involved in the trade. However the players that we have heard might have been offered are not enough to trade Bedard for IMO. In reality the players that have been offered are apparently in McPhail's opinion also not enough or he would have made the trade.

[Peace21]

Jason Churchill has posted two interesting comments on his blog. The first one was about Jones returning:

Jones coming to town to get a physical could very well be due to the club anticipating a potential trade.

But it doesn’t mean a trade is imminent, because the Orioles would be the team wanting the physical in that case.

A lot of times we hear about players failing physical thus nixing deals that had been agreed upon previously. The Vizquel deal comes to mind.

http://prospectinsider.com/2008/01/07/ms-getting-closer/#comment-6303

So Jones is returning from Winter Ball for a physical most likely for the Orioles, possibly a prelude to a deal. And the second was about Bedard and specifically his agent:

Bedard told the Orioles he is not interested in an extension at this time and his agent, Mark Pieper, is kind of a Boras wannabe in that he very much prefers and pushes for his client to take it to free agency.

I fully expect that to happen, unless whoever trades for him, or the Orioles, blow him away with an offer, which is not out of the question.

http://prospectinsider.com/2008/01/07/ms-getting-closer/#comment-6308

So there you go, Pieper is a Boras wannabe, so the chances of Bedard and Roberts extending are faint unless we overpay, thus we have to trade them...

The Pieper line is funny. He hates Boras and would laugh reading that line. Plus he lets the player make the decision to what makes that player feel right.

[33rdst]

The way the O's were playing, I wanted to go with him. August and September were horrible. I do not question Bedard's wanting to be on the mound nor his effort when he is on the mound. As a guy would has overcome a lot through the rehab of TJ surgery, I think he has earned a little trust.

If he was hurt certainly no one would want him to pitch. But as a team leader and the so called ace of the staff, he has, in my view, a responsibility to stay wiht the team.

[JTrea81]

The Pieper line is funny. He hates Boras and would laugh reading that line. Plus he lets the player make the decision to what makes that player feel right.

That's interesting Churchill would think that way about him then. I wonder which Seattle player has Pieper for an agent...

[wildcard]

If he was hurt certainly no one would want him to pitch. But as a team leader and the so called ace of the staff, he has, in my view, a responsibility to stay wiht the team.

Bedard has never accepted the role as team leader. He is an ace pitcher would has proven his ability to perfrom. That is his value. I would not include team leader as one of his abilities at this point.

[Peace21]

That's interesting Churchill would think that way about him then. I wonder which Seattle player has Pieper for an agent...

Hmm not sure. Churchill is probably assuming that since Bedard wont sign here long term, that Pieper is micromanaging that (Which is Boras-esq). And thats not it. Bedard doesnt want to sign here.

[Fan4Life]

Hmm not sure. Churchill is probably assuming that since Bedard wont sign here long term, that Pieper is micromanaging that (Which is Boras-esq). And thats not it. Bedard doesnt want to sign here.

It was reported that Bedard said he didn't want to sign here at this time, correct? There are many on this board that have said Bedard would never sign here, is that you opinion?

[33rdst]

Bedard has never accepted the role as team leader. He is an ace pitcher would has proven his ability to perfrom. That is his value. I would not include team leader as one of his abilities at this point.

So it was OK for Bedard to leave because he wasn't "the team" leader? Sometimes you don't get to decide whether you are "the" leader. You don't get to pick and chose. By virtue of your staus, (in this case the fact that Bedard was one of our best players), the "responsibility is thrust upon you.

I agree that Bedard is not a team leader and IMO is incapable of beinig one.

[Peace21]

It was reported that Bedard said he didn't want to sign here at this time, correct? There are many on this board that have said Bedard would never sign here, is that you opinion?

Well this offseason would have been the opritune time.

[Fan4Life]

Well this offseason would have been the opritune time.

So then which of the following were most responsible (IYO) for Bedard not considering resigning:

1) Money

2) Doesn't want to play in Baltimore

3) The lack of a competitive team in Baltimore

4) Other?

[wildcard]

I'll take Bedard the pitcher on my team any day. If he was too hurt to pitch and the team policy is that he can go home, then that is fine also. Many guys who are hurt do not stay with the team.

[33rdst]

A lot of things are mentioned on the air - proves nothing. You also fail to mention that it was brought up by Dave Johnson who obviously had issues with Bedard and apparently jumped at every opportunity to take pot shots at him.

Guthrie's injury was obviously not severe enough to keep him out for the rest of the season. Do you have any proof that Bedard's injury was less serious or that he would have been able to come back?

It isn't an indication of anything.

I'm not making apologies for him - there's absolutely no need for me to do so. And if I were, so what? You don't know the man. You have no idea what makes him tick. Tell us oh wise one how it would have helped him or the team for him to stay with the team. Did Loewen stay with the team? How about anyone else who was injured during the year? Why aren't you trashing them?

First of all save your sarcasm for someone else. Second, I'm not going to get into a pissing contest with you over whether Bedard should or should not have left the team. I don't have the time nor interest to debate this with you all day, so you can save your energy to argue with Va Tech or some other poster you like to screw with.

I'm not going into every ridiculous sarcastic point that you made but I will respond to the one that I think is at the root of the argument, whether it woul have made any difference if Bedard had stayed.

It likely would have not made any difference to the team's performance if Bedard had stayed or not but it would have contributed to the sense of unity that has been absent form this team for too long. The message Bedard would have sent by staying is, we're all in this together' no matter how ugly it gets. That, IMO, is what teams do, that is what teammates do.

The point that Trembley has made many times over the last several months is that the name on the front of the jersey is more important then the name on the back. I don't know what motivated Bedard to leave. All I know is that he did as soon as he got the chance.