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Manny, Harper and Trout

Frobby

By Frobby
in Orioles Talk

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CA-ORIOLE Hangout Grand Counsel

CA-ORIOLE

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For me a generational talent means one of the best 2-3 players in his generation. I'd say Harper has a chance to be that. It's not guaranteed that he will be.

Yeah, I disagree with that being the interpretation in this case.. Other than maybe Arod perhaps being close, I'm not sure I can recollect as highly a touted prospect with the kind of rhetoric associated with Harper,....unfounded or not.

The phrase, ?once in a generation? is thrown around far too often, but he truly fits the bill.

http://rotoscouting.com/bryce-harper-scouting-report-2011/

Bryce Harper - Best Prospect Ever?-----Bryce Harper has received his fair share of attention over the years, coming as close to being labeled a prodigy as anyone in recent history. As a sophomore in high school, he was launching 500 foot home runs in Major League Stadiums. At 16 years old, Sports Illustrated put him on the cover of their magazine. At 17, he left high school a year early to compete with wood bats against Junior College players and hit 31 home runs, breaking the previous school record for homers in a season… which was 12. He also won the Golden Spikes award as the best amateur player in the country during the year in which he should have been a Junior in High School, and then was the first overall pick in the draft last summer.

And yet, despite all the hype, I’m still not sure we’re accurately appreciating just how good this kid really could be

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/bryce-harper-best-prospect-ever/

I can easily come up with plenty more.

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baltfan Hangout Grand Counsel

baltfan

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Yeah, I disagree with that being the interpretation in this case.. Other than maybe Arod perhaps being close, I'm not sure I can recollect as highly a touted prospect with the kind of rhetoric associated with Harper,....unfounded or not.

http://rotoscouting.com/bryce-harper-scouting-report-2011/

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/bryce-harper-best-prospect-ever/

I can easily come up with plenty more.

Ken Griffey Jr. - better in all aspects but maybe power than Harper

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Frobby Hangout Grand Counsel

Frobby

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Yeah, I disagree with that being the interpretation in this case.. Other than maybe Arod perhaps being close, I'm not sure I can recollect as highly a touted prospect with the kind of rhetoric associated with Harper,....unfounded or not.

http://rotoscouting.com/bryce-harper-scouting-report-2011/

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/bryce-harper-best-prospect-ever/

I can easily come up with plenty more.

Let me know when you find one that says Harper is a great fielder.

I agree that there were articles suggesting Harper would be the Second Coming as an offensive player. So if he hits 550+ homers are we going to consider him a disappointment? I think he'll do that if healthy.

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weams Hangout Grand Counsel

weams

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Ken Griffey Jr was something else for sure, I think he even had the edge over power, the boy could flat hit the long ones.

No one playing today will hit 630 home runs. Except those who already have.

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baltfan Hangout Grand Counsel

baltfan

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Let me know when you find one that says Harper is a great fielder.

I agree that there were articles suggesting Harper would be the Second Coming as an offensive player. So if he hits 550+ homers are we going to consider him a disappointment? I think he'll do that if healthy.

I agree with Frobby on this. Most everything I remember said the bat would play anywhere and he was unlikely to stay a catcher. He also wasn't touted as a speed guy. I think a lot of the speed stuff was as a result of when he first came up and people being surprised a bit by how well he ran. But I'd don't remember anyone as he was coming up taking about him as a 40/40 guy a la ARod or Griffey.

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Stotle Hangout Grand Counsel

Stotle

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That's fine, but remember Harper was widely touted as a generational type talent in the line of Willie Mays and Mickey Mantle. Rhetoric rarely reserved (especially so widely) for anyone really. I gathered backwardsk's point (which I agree with) is that it is probably too early to read much into his baserunning and defensive metrics at this point in time. Between the injuries, moving around at different positions, sample size, maturity issues and the learning curve at the ML level he may very well still become an elite level defender and baserunner in addition to the hitting ability . That takes him to another level and is why that ability bears watching imo.

Personally I'd worry about throttling him back and preventing injuries more than anything. I'd probably have him steal sparingly since it provides such little marginal value and presents another injury risk.

He was never touted as an elite outfielder. He was touted as a potential plus defender behind the plate (mostly tied to catch-and-throw game) and very well could have been if he managed to not outgrow it. No one ever saw his body type as one that was going to allow him to glide around the outfield.

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CA-ORIOLE Hangout Grand Counsel

CA-ORIOLE

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I agree with Frobby on this. Most everything I remember said the bat would play anywhere and he was unlikely to stay a catcher. He also wasn't touted as a speed guy. I think a lot of the speed stuff was as a result of when he first came up and people being surprised a bit by how well he ran. But I'd don't remember anyone as he was coming up taking about him as a 40/40 guy a la ARod or Griffey.

A 5 tool player by definition is a speed guy.

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Stotle Hangout Grand Counsel

Stotle

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Yeah, I disagree with that being the interpretation in this case.. Other than maybe Arod perhaps being close, I'm not sure I can recollect as highly a touted prospect with the kind of rhetoric associated with Harper,....unfounded or not.

http://rotoscouting.com/bryce-harper-scouting-report-2011/

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/bryce-harper-best-prospect-ever/

I can easily come up with plenty more.

Harper easily deserved Arod/Griffey level hype and he's well on his way to living up to his potential as a generational talent.

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Stotle Hangout Grand Counsel

Stotle

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A 5 tool player by definition is a speed guy.

And you can be a five-tool guy that grows out of a tool. Not that complicated. His foot speed graded average or better and as he continues to mature his speed will diminish. So will Trout.

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CA-ORIOLE Hangout Grand Counsel

CA-ORIOLE

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He was never touted as an elite outfielder. He was touted as a potential plus defender behind the plate (mostly tied to catch-and-throw game) and very well could have been if he managed to not outgrow it. No one ever saw his body type as one that was going to allow him to glide around the outfield.

I certainly respect your opinion but 85% "movements of Jason Heyward" suggest to me he has more than enough ability to glide around in RF pretty well.

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CA-ORIOLE Hangout Grand Counsel

CA-ORIOLE

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And you can be a five-tool guy that grows out of a tool. Not that complicated. His foot speed graded average or better and as he continues to mature his speed will diminish. So will Trout.

Everybody's speed can diminish. Maybe he gets big and it diminishes more rapidly like Trout's has. Right now Harper is a career plus 14 rate CF (his most played position to date and that with numeous injuries) and Trout has gone from elite in his first year to a mere plus 2 rate. From what I've seen Harper is more than capable of playing RF at an elite level now and it would not shock me if he did so this year and beyond.

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CA-ORIOLE Hangout Grand Counsel

CA-ORIOLE

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Let me know when you find one that says Harper is a great fielder.

.

Let me know what you think 5 tool player and 85% movements of Jason Heyward means.

I agree that there were articles suggesting Harper would be the Second Coming as an offensive player. So if he hits 550+ homers are we going to consider him a disappointment? I think he'll do that if healthy

Pretty ridiculous comment and not at all the point.

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