Wieters is staying with the Orioles for 2016

[24fps]

I would rather have had Wieters reject the QO, but I think the O's took an intelligent calculated risk that just had a sub-optimal outcome. Those who have called it a "gross miscalculation" are mostly just second-guessing the outcome.

The upside here is that Buck can optimize his use of Wieters. He'll catch much more often than he did after he returned in 2015, but Buck won't have to run him into the ground as he did in 2011-13. I won't be surprised if Wieters has his best season as he drives to get his big contract next offseason. And I think Buck will find ways to maximize Joseph's value, too. I'd rather have had the $15.8 mm to spend and the pick, but I don't think this has to turn out to be a disaster.

What do you consider to be the more dangerous human tendency, the impulse to second guess or the desire to immediately start glossing over situations that have unexpectedly turned "sub-optimal"? Everyone will have their own opinion, but regardless the Wieters/QO affair is going to provide plenty of opportunity for partisans of both persuasions to indulge to their heart's content.

"Wieters, Thumbs Up or Thumbs Down?". Behold the theme for the 2016 Orioles season.

[BohKnowsBmore]

What do you consider to be the more dangerous human tendency, the impulse to second guess or the desire to immediately start glossing over situations that have unexpectedly turned "sub-optimal"? Everyone will have their own opinion, but regardless the Wieters/QO affair is going to provide plenty of opportunity for partisans of both persuasions to indulge to their heart's content.

"Wieters, Thumbs Up or Thumbs Down?". Behold the theme for the 2016 Orioles season.

I don't think it's immediately glossing over. I was among the group that said it wouldn't be a bad outcome for MW to accept back when many here were fearing the possibility. It was our best option IMO. Letting him walk for free was a bad idea and we would be worse off today had we chosen that course.

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[Orioles4Life21]

Caleb Joseph, class act

source - Roch

Wow. What an awesome quote by Caleb.

[weams]

"Wieters, Thumbs Up or Thumbs Down?". Behold the theme for the 2016 Orioles season.

Whether 'tis Nobler in the mind to suffer. The Slings and Arrows of outrageous Fortune, Or to take Arms against a Sea of troubles, And by opposing end them.

[scOtt]

Caleb Joseph, class act

"I talked to Matt a few days ago and he kind of updated me on the situation. I told him, 'Buddy, if you accept it, I promise you I'll be the most excited person in that clubhouse.' There's no doubt about it. Matt makes the Baltimore Orioles better and he makes me better and I'm excited to be his teammate again."

"You never know what could happen," Joseph said. "It's sort of a double-edged sword. It's intriguing, but at the same time it's kind of nerve-wracking. But there's more to this life than catching 120 games and making a lot of money. What we're able to get from Matt's family, a relationship and accountability and stability from them, just for me and my wife, it's worth every game that we don't catch and it's worth every penny that we don't make. I can't stress that enough. The relationship that we have is so much more important than who's catching more games and who's catching two in a row.

"I said this back when I got drafted, I'd love to be Matt Wieters' backup for the next 10 years and that was back in 2008. I'm excited about the opportunity to be able to work with Matt again. Just what he brings every day is something I want to emulate. Whether it's 20 games, 50 games, 100 games, as long as the team is winning, I couldn't care less."

source - Roch

I would expect no less of Caleb.

[scOtt]

Whether 'tis Nobler in the mind to suffer. The Slings and Arrows of outrageous Fortune, Or to take Arms against a Sea of troubles, And by opposing end them.

[video=youtube;EdTnlnJjSqE]

[scOtt]

I would rather have had Wieters reject the QO, but I think the O's took an intelligent calculated risk that just had a sub-optimal outcome. Those who have called it a "gross miscalculation" are mostly just second-guessing the outcome.

The upside here is that Buck can optimize his use of Wieters. He'll catch much more often than he did after he returned in 2015, but Buck won't have to run him into the ground as he did in 2011-13. I won't be surprised if Wieters has his best season as he drives to get his big contract next offseason. And I think Buck will find ways to maximize Joseph's value, too. I'd rather have had the $15.8 mm to spend and the pick, but I don't think this has to turn out to be a disaster.

Call me naive. I think PA might just take this under his wing, pay the 15.8 out of pocket, and let the rest of the $$$ flow just like before.

It's not even $15.8 million off the projected 40 mill. It's $15.8 million MINUS Matt's salary this past year. Because the $40 million was figured adding in Matt's "missing" salary. So... 15.8 - 8.3 = 7.5 . so 32.5 million left to spend.

[24fps]

Whether 'tis Nobler in the mind to suffer. The Slings and Arrows of outrageous Fortune, Or to take Arms against a Sea of troubles, And by opposing end them.

Fair enough, although I'm too heavily scheduled to shuffle off this mortal coil just yet.

Human adaptability is a wonderful thing. As the offseason unfolds adjustments will by the O's front office to the new reality and they will do their best to field the best team they can under the circumstances. We fans will find ways to see the silver lining if given even the smallest opportunity - whether it's in our best long-term interest or not.

What to you think Shakespeare would have made of this if he even bothered noticing. Comedy or tragedy?

[scOtt]

What do you consider to be the more dangerous human tendency, the impulse to second guess or the desire to immediately start glossing over situations that have unexpectedly turned "sub-optimal"? Everyone will have their own opinion, but regardless the Wieters/QO affair is going to provide plenty of opportunity for partisans of both persuasions to indulge to their heart's content.

"Wieters, Thumbs Up or Thumbs Down?". Behold the theme for the 2016 Orioles season.

Matt Wieters. Keeping the OH talking to the top of the Forbes' List.

It's what we do here. Talk Orioles baseball.

[weams]

Matt Wieters. Keeping the OH talking to the top of the Forbes' List.

It's what we do here. Talk Orioles baseball.

It's what we do.

[Tony-OH]

Last year Wieters lost alot of value by only catching in 55 out of his 75 games played. As a DH he's probably at or below replacement level and that really hurt him. Assuming he goes back to being a regular catcher, he's going to be worth more per game than he was last year. I don't think the Orioles will restrict him catching back to back days like they did this year.

Steamer has Wieters projected at 2.2 WAR in 98 games next year. Prior to his injury he was at over 140 games a year. He won't do that again, but it's certainly reasonable that he could be pushing 3 WAR, and he's a pretty safe bet to be 2 WAR or better.

For the QO contract, in a vacuum, Wieters' deal is certainly reasonable and has good upside for surplus value. I think that's the only point Drungo is trying to make and I think he's right there. The problem is that the Orioles have a more than capable replacement in Joseph, who may be as good as Wieters, and A LOT of holes and not nearly enough money to fill them now.

This is my entire point. Besides blind fandom, there is not good reason to pay Wieters $15.8 million when they had Joseph and name your back up available for about $1 million. Wieters might have a good year and i hope he does now that he's on the team, but I'm not quite sure people gather how much this will affect the rest of the offseason. Does anyone here really think a $14 million difference is not going to affect who the Orioles can go after this offseason?

There is some serious naive fans on this forum when it comes to value and building a team within a tight budget. Adding an additional $15.8 million salary that was not expected is going to majorly affect how the Orioles operate this offseason. Maybe I can put it this way to the fans out there who are think this is a good thing. The Orioles were a .500 team with Wieters last year (actually they were under .500 while Wieters was on the roster but who's counting?) and now they get to double his salary with no appreciable gain from last year's roster.

If we were a big budget team and money didn't really matter or if the Orioles had no capable player ready to take over then I'd be ok with this move, but the Orioles had a capable plan that was going to allow them to spend more money on their holes at LF,RF, 1B, and starting pitching.

Hey, but at least some you can keep that Wieters bobblehead on the mantle.

[OsEatAlEast]

Well whether any of us like the move or not. It happened and there isn't a thing any of us can do about it either way.

They should have went with my plan last summer and blew it up in early July.

[Bmorebirds24]

Who did you want to buy with his one year of money?

I would take Alex Gordon for 3-4 years at 15-16 per. Then sures up LF and have a cheap option at C.

The Weiters deal hurts, IMO.

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[weams]

I would take Alex Gordon for 3-4 years at 15-16 per. Then sures up LF and have a cheap option at C.

The Weiters deal hurts, IMO.

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The Wieters deal hurts. But it does not keep you from the 100 million dollar payoff that Gordon expects. Even though my one year dollars talk is called simplistic, it is very real. And is for one year. Over a seven year term it means that you can't spend two millions more. We already lost one pick with this event. I am in no way interested in blowing our first pick.

[Bmorebirds24]

The Wieters deal hurts. But it does not keep you from the 100 million dollar payoff that Gordon expects. Even though my one year dollars talk is called simplistic, it is very real. And is for one year. Over a seven year term it means that you can't spend two millions more. We already lost one pick with this event. I am in no way interested in blowing our first pick.

Gordon had a player option and opted out, right? We lose a pick if we sign him?

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