Grade the Gausman Deal

[RVAOsFan]

1 hour ago, Redskins Rick said:

This deal to me, almost looks like a Peter inspired deal, maybe DD was told to dump "XXXX" amount of this year's salary, and this was the best he could come up with?

I doubt Peter had anything to do with it since it sounds like he is pretty hands off at this point.  However I have wondered the same thing about DD having to get the payroll down this year.  I wonder if Jones refusing a trade had anything to do with DD getting creative and finding a package to include a salary like O'Day.  Was there a better offer out there from someone who didn't want to take on additional salary.  Pirates sure did give up a lot for Archer.

[Redskins Rick]

Just now, wildcard said:

You are assuming a lot.  If that is true then is a bad ownership deal.   You are trying to place blame within the O's organization.  I am not.   I just say its a stupid deal no matter who in the O's organization was involved.

You are also assuming the worse, instead of waiting to see how it plays out.

I agree with Tony-OH this is a head scratcher and not one of his best deals. It could still work out.

[Redskins Rick]

1 minute ago, RVAOsFan said:

I doubt Peter had anything to do with it since it sounds like he is pretty hands off at this point.  However I have wondered the same thing about DD having to get the payroll down this year.  I wonder if Jones refusing a trade had anything to do with DD getting creative and finding a package to include a salary like O'Day.  Was there a better offer out there from someone who didn't want to take on additional salary.  Pirates sure did give up a lot for Archer.

Instead of Peter, than Ownership. You must admit, it was a complete turnaround to get to this place, and it surely wasn't DD magically walking up in the shower, and started making phone calls.

[wildcard]

17 minutes ago, RVAOsFan said:

I doubt Peter had anything to do with it since it sounds like he is pretty hands off at this point.  However I have wondered the same thing about DD having to get the payroll down this year.  I wonder if Jones refusing a trade had anything to do with DD getting creative and finding a package to include a salary like O'Day.  Was there a better offer out there from someone who didn't want to take on additional salary.  Pirates sure did give up a lot for Archer.

The whole having to get payroll down is  not a good argument IMO.  There was 60m coming off the books this off season by just not resigning the FA that the O's begins he season with.  If they wanted to trade Schoop and Gausman instead of paying them either at the deadline or over winter that is  another 15m gone .   Both were very tradable players.  Players for which they should have been able to get top 100 prospects.    

Any way you look at it the O's could get rid of 75m in payroll with or without trading O'Day.   With the limited amount of players the O's had to get players back that upgraded for the future its a pretty stupid  trade to not get more then that got for Gausman.

[wildcard]

13 minutes ago, Redskins Rick said:

You are also assuming the worse, instead of waiting to see how it plays out.

I agree with Tony-OH this is a head scratcher and not one of his best deals. It could still work out.

Well,  they didn't get a top 100 prospect for Gausman.  That is very clear.

[Redskins Rick]

Just now, wildcard said:

Well,  they didn't get a top 100 prospect for Gausman.  That is very clear.

Maybe the main goal, was obtaining international money and shredding payroll??????

Unless, you know the main objection/goal of the trade,  then things aren't clear.

[Camden_yardbird]

6 minutes ago, wildcard said:

Well,  they didn't get a top 100 prospect for Gausman.  That is very clear.

Unless they sign VVM?

[wildcard]

1 minute ago, Redskins Rick said:

Maybe the main goal, was obtaining international money and shredding payroll??????

Unless, you know the main objection/goal of the trade,  then things aren't clear.

So they get 2.5m in international slot money.  That is not real money coming to the O's.  It just gives the  O's the ability to spend 2.5m on their only money on international players.    If the O's are able to sign an international player that is of the quality of a top 100 prospect, I see it as a bad deal.  I hope they can sign that kind of player and change my mind.

[wildcard]

2 minutes ago, Camden_yardbird said:

Unless they sign VVM?

For how much.  Will they need the 2.5m  slot money  that was in the Gausman deal to sign him?

[Camden_yardbird]

2 minutes ago, wildcard said:

For how much.  Will they need the 2.5m  slot money  that was in the Gausman deal to sign him?

I am guessing they will.

[Redskins Rick]

2 minutes ago, wildcard said:

For how much.  Will they need the 2.5m  slot money  that was in the Gausman deal to sign him?

We wont know, until MLB declares VVM a free agent and available to sign.

It does give the team, the best chance to sign VVM, having that extra money, they could still get some of the other prospects.

[Tony-OH]

27 minutes ago, Redskins Rick said:

Instead of Peter, than Ownership. You must admit, it was a complete turnaround to get to this place, and it surely wasn't DD magically walking up in the shower, and started making phone calls.

Duquette has been making a lot of public comments about the Orioles dropping a lot of payroll and no matter what people may think of him, he's not a dumb guy.

For the most part, since Duquette has taken back on this public face of the Orioles role once again, his comments seem to be very forthcoming vs the cryptic tones of the past.

This suggests one of two things in my mind, he either thinks he's out of here next year and wants to make sure the rest of baseball knows what he's been under, or that he's truly been told to be more transparent because Orioles ownership (Read John Angelos maybe some of Lou Angelos now) want the fans to know what they are doing.

Either way, the fact that O'day was sent in the deal and the Orioles were unable to to recoup one of the Braves top prospects tells me this was either rushed or a forced salary dump and Duquette took the best deal he had on the table.

Think about how fast this thing seemed to come together? I was on travel for my other work when this trade went down so I didn't have time to really analyze the trade at the time, but it;s pretty clear the prospects the Orioles received seem to lack the caliber they should have received for 2 and a half years of Gausman.

 

[AnythingO's]

6 minutes ago, wildcard said:

For how much.  Will they need the 2.5m  slot money  that was in the Gausman deal to sign him?

People were speculating at least $3.5 M for VVM back when NYY were accumulating additional slot $$. Miami still has almost $4 M I think and a natural fit with their Cuban community. IMO we would need to go $4.5 M, maybe higher, to get VVM. Maybe also sign his brother for $500 K so that is probably $5 M needed conservatively. Then there is the pitcher who Miami had a $2 M offer to but pulled because reportedly a failed drug test. Maybe $1.5 M for him and you have 3 new top Cuban prospects, at least 1 of which is top 100 immediately. Gausman was traded for slot money, to dump salary, and a lottery ticket.

[Redskins Rick]

1 minute ago, Tony-OH said:

Duquette has been making a lot of public comments about the Orioles dropping a lot of payroll and no matter what people may think of him, he's not a dumb guy.

For the most part, since Duquette has taken back on this public face of the Orioles role once again, his comments seem to be very forthcoming vs the cryptic tones of the past.

This suggests one of two things in my mind, he either thinks he's out of here next year and wants to make sure the rest of baseball knows what he's been under, or that he's truly been told to be more transparent because Orioles ownership (Read John Angelos maybe some of Lou Angelos now) want the fans to know what they are doing.

Either way, the fact that O'day was sent in the deal and the Orioles were unable to to recoup one of the Braves top prospects tells me this was either rushed or a forced salary dump and Duquette took the best deal he had on the table.

Think about how fast this thing seemed to come together? I was on travel for my other work when this trade went down so I didn't have time to really analyze the trade at the time, but it;s pretty clear the prospects the Orioles received seem to lack the caliber they should have received for 2 and a half years of Gausman.

 

I agree, it came together very fast, considering DD had been busy elsewhere too.

DD is not acting like a lame duck GM thats for sure. I also agree, he is out of here and telling the world he still has it, or he will be here.

[theocean]

16 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

Duquette has been making a lot of public comments about the Orioles dropping a lot of payroll and no matter what people may think of him, he's not a dumb guy.

For the most part, since Duquette has taken back on this public face of the Orioles role once again, his comments seem to be very forthcoming vs the cryptic tones of the past.

This suggests one of two things in my mind, he either thinks he's out of here next year and wants to make sure the rest of baseball knows what he's been under, or that he's truly been told to be more transparent because Orioles ownership (Read John Angelos maybe some of Lou Angelos now) want the fans to know what they are doing.

Either way, the fact that O'day was sent in the deal and the Orioles were unable to to recoup one of the Braves top prospects tells me this was either rushed or a forced salary dump and Duquette took the best deal he had on the table.

Think about how fast this thing seemed to come together? I was on travel for my other work when this trade went down so I didn't have time to really analyze the trade at the time, but it;s pretty clear the prospects the Orioles received seem to lack the caliber they should have received for 2 and a half years of Gausman.

 

Great summary. I felt that money was the motivating factor in this deal. While Gausman had a track record of "consistently mediocre" - he was consistent, durable, and relatively effective with the O's. That's worth a lot in today's game.

While I'm hesitant to 100% believe it - there are a lot of signs that the Angelos sons are getting ready to sell the team. Cut future commitments. Resolve the MASN dispute. Put some sort of International Scouting System in place.