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Hardball Talk: Why can't the Orioles develop pitchers?

weams

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weams Hangout Grand Counsel

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Q: The Orioles haven’t developed a starting pitcher that played in an All-Star game (for us) since Mike Mussina (unless you think we “developed” Chris Tillman). Why?

A: I’m sure hardcore Orioles fans and analysts have better ideas than me but it has struck me how little the O’s play in the international market, thereby limiting their talent pool. I’m sure there are a lot of inside reasons beyond that too, but I can’t say I know enough about how pitching is truly developed to say.

 

 

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esmd All-Star

esmd

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He didn't really answer the question.  His answer is more of a scouting issue than a development issue.  They've had talented guys come through that haven't delivered, such as Loewen, Matusz, Gausman, Bundy, etc.  Some are obviously injury related (Loewen/Bundy, and you can throw Harvey into that group), some are possibly guys that just weren't as good as they thought (Matusz), and others underachieve such as Gausman.  Then you have a guy like Britton who didn't work out as a starter but was the most dominant closer in baseball for a stretch and very good for several other years.  I get the insinuation that they're doing something wrong in their development system (i.e. after they acquire the talent), but I've yet to see concrete proof of what that is.

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Tx Oriole Hangout Grand Counsel

Tx Oriole

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18 minutes ago, Finisher said:

It's not like we're good at developing position players either.

Better at that than developing pitchers. It seems this organization hasn't done that since Angelos bought the team. I know it's a coinendence. I just wonder what has happened? Look at the pitching the team had when Weaver was the manager. Four twenty game winners. I can't remember what year that was though. Just hope they can the reason and correct the problem. 

 

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JR Oriole Major Leaguer

JR Oriole

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Whatever other teams seem to be able to do with pitchers, we just can't.  Not sure why but it can't be a coincidence after this many years.  The sample size is big enough.....we just stink at this.

I liked the most painful loss question, to which the answer given was the Leyritz homer off of Wohlers in 1996.  I think not only was that really bad at the time, but it completely changed history.  The Braves never won a Series game again and the Yankees went on to win 5 World Series. 

The 2011 World Series, Game 6 was probably the worst loss in baseball history.  One foot from the Rangers first title.  And it never happened.  Just brutal.

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nate22 Veteran All-Star

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Didn't Arrieta make a comment about how the Cubs didn't really try to change what he was comfortable with, while the O's did? I could be wrong. Maybe we try to tinker too much with our young pitchers and that leads to either injury or poor results. Just a guess. I know Buck is obsessed with TTP, but keeping runners off base can solve that issue.

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Tx Oriole Hangout Grand Counsel

Tx Oriole

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6 minutes ago, JR Oriole said:

Whatever other teams seem to be able to do with pitchers, we just can't.  Not sure why but it can't be a coincidence after this many years.  The sample size is big enough.....we just stink at this.

I liked the most painful loss question, to which the answer given was the Leyritz homer off of Wohlers in 1996.  I think not only was that really bad at the time, but it completely changed history.  The Braves never won a Series game again and the Yankees went on to win 5 World Series. 

The 2011 World Series, Game 6 was probably the worst loss in baseball history.  One foot from the Rangers first title.  And it never happened.  Just brutal.

Yes I remember those games. I was a big Braves fan in those days. Whatever the reason the O's stink at devrloping pitchers I want whoever is in charge to fix the problem. 

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Ruzious Hangout Grand Counsel

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33 minutes ago, Tx Oriole said:

Yes I remember those games. I was a big Braves fan in those days. Whatever the reason the O's stink at devrloping pitchers I want whoever is in charge to fix the problem. 

As an always Braves fan, it's absurdly fun to watch 20 year old Acuna lead them to the playoffs - and see all those 20 and 22 year old pitching phenoms make it to the bigs.    

If the O's can get an Acuna, I'd be on board with that.  Albies needs to become a lot more selective to reach his potential.  

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weams Hangout Grand Counsel

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49 minutes ago, nate22 said:

Didn't Arrieta make a comment about how the Cubs didn't really try to change what he was comfortable with, while the O's did? I could be wrong. Maybe we try to tinker too much with our young pitchers and that leads to either injury or poor results. Just a guess. I know Buck is obsessed with TTP, but keeping runners off base can solve that issue.

Are they tinkering with him again now that he is in Philly?

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JR Oriole Major Leaguer

JR Oriole

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14 minutes ago, Ruzious said:

As an always Braves fan, it's absurdly fun to watch 20 year old Acuna lead them to the playoffs - and see all those 20 and 22 year old pitching phenoms make it to the bigs.    

If the O's can get an Acuna, I'd be on board with that.  Albies needs to become a lot more selective to reach his potential.  

Acuna is great.  With that power, I expect he will be in the 2 or 3 slot next season.  The whole team is fun to watch.  The Arizona series was exactly what needed to happen after the Boston disaster.  I am going on Sunday to see them play the Gnats. 

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Can_of_corn Hangout Grand Counsel

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2 minutes ago, JR Oriole said:

Acuna is great.  With that power, I expect he will be in the 2 or 3 slot next season.  The whole team is fun to watch.  The Arizona series was exactly what needed to happen after the Boston disaster.  I am going on Sunday to see them play the Gnats. 

Gosh I hope they are smart enough not to waste his bat in the three hole.

I don't see the problem with letting him continue to hit leadoff.  Why not give him the most at bats you can?

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JR Oriole Major Leaguer

JR Oriole

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3 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Gosh I hope they are smart enough not to waste his bat in the three hole.

I don't see the problem with letting him continue to hit leadoff.  Why not give him the most at bats you can?

I think it will depend on what the Braves do in the offseason.  Although they unloaded on Arizona in the 9th yesterday, they have been struggling to score runs.  If they can get another slugger in the offseason to hit 4th, that will help a lot.  Acuna has the potential to drive in a lot more runs if he isn't leading off as many innings bc he follows the pitcher in the lineup.  Maybe they move him to the 2 slot but either way, he has been great.

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