Ok, if we’re going to be bad, then...

[SteveA]

10 hours ago, sportsfan8703 said:

It's a scary thought but right now you'd have to handicap as us being worse off than last year.  We're going to leave the prospects in AAA all year, just like we did with Akin. 

I think we have to trade Bundy and Givens.  I don't think Givens racking up saves with us is going to change playoff a contender's mind that he's more than a good 7th/8th inning guy.  Also, I think Bundy is a player that a playoff team would want, but they wouldn't want him starting a playoff game.  So I think that limits his deadline value.  

So that leaves a rotation of Means, Cobb, Wojo, Akin, ?.  I don't even want to think about the bullpen.  

Bold Prediction... We'll have the lowest W total O/U in Vegas.  49.5?

No way will it be that low.

[SteveA]

11 hours ago, atomic said:

I am not sure what your fable has to do with this.  

This is more like someone offering me a taxi tour of Gaza with a taxi cab painted with the American and Israeli flags on it.  And you are telling me I should get on the ride it might not be good at first but it will get better as you go along.  No thanks I will skip the tour. 

I was never on board with the Astro's style rebuild.  And when other teams were in the midst of such rebuilds in the past people on here mocked them.  People were mocking the Marlins on here before the 2018 season began.  Show me some links when the Astro's were in the second year of their tank job where people on here were praising it.  

So you bring up the Marlins.  I guess you think the entire concept of this is to dump talent and get younger, and that what we and the Marlins are doing the same thing. 

Did the Marlins revamp their entire system to go to a data driven approach?  Did they invest in new equipment to monitor hitters and pitchers' body motion at all levels of the system?  Did they take steps to standardize instruction throughout the system?  Did they hire additional personnel to scout Latin America?  Did the Marlins create a whole analytics department out of practically nothing?

I guess if you think there's nothing to this rebuild except getting bad for a while, I can see why you are so opposed.  If you think what the Orioles are doing and what the Marlins are doing is somehow equivalent, then no wonder you don't like it.

So far, only ONE team has done a rebuild in this fashion -- the Astros -- and it worked spectacularly well.  I'm not sure how many others of the so called tanking teams are trying to do a state of the art data driven rebuild like Houston.  But we are.

[theocean]

2 minutes ago, SteveA said:

So you bring up the Marlins.  I guess you think the entire concept of this is to dump talent and get younger, and that what we and the Marlins are doing the same thing. 

Did the Marlins revamp their entire system to go to a data driven approach?  Did they invest in new equipment to monitor hitters and pitchers' body motion at all levels of the system?  Did they take steps to standardize instruction throughout the system?  Did they hire additional personnel to scout Latin America?  Did the Marlins create a whole analytics department out of practically nothing?

I guess if you think there's nothing to this rebuild except getting bad for a while, I can see why you are so opposed.  If you think what the Orioles are doing and what the Marlins are doing is somehow equivalent, then no wonder you don't like it.

So far, only ONE team has done a rebuild in this fashion -- the Astros -- and it worked spectacularly well.  I'm not sure how many others of the so called tanking teams are trying to do a state of the art data driven rebuild like Houston.  But we are.

The Marlins have invested heavily in analytics since the change in ownership. Do a quick Google search and you'll find articles describing what they've done.

I think pretty much every team has a sizable analytics department now. The Orioles were just one of the last holdouts unfortunately - do to a number of reasons.

[atomic]

1 hour ago, SteveA said:

So you bring up the Marlins.  I guess you think the entire concept of this is to dump talent and get younger, and that what we and the Marlins are doing the same thing. 

Did the Marlins revamp their entire system to go to a data driven approach?  Did they invest in new equipment to monitor hitters and pitchers' body motion at all levels of the system?  Did they take steps to standardize instruction throughout the system?  Did they hire additional personnel to scout Latin America?  Did the Marlins create a whole analytics department out of practically nothing?

I guess if you think there's nothing to this rebuild except getting bad for a while, I can see why you are so opposed.  If you think what the Orioles are doing and what the Marlins are doing is somehow equivalent, then no wonder you don't like it.

So far, only ONE team has done a rebuild in this fashion -- the Astros -- and it worked spectacularly well.  I'm not sure how many others of the so called tanking teams are trying to do a state of the art data driven rebuild like Houston.  But we are.

None of the stuff you said the Astros did had anything to do with tanking.  I am not sure why they needed to tank so badly for so long if they are so smart with all the amazing things you said they did.  And you wouldn’t think they would need to steal signs.  And you think they would have been able to develop a few pitchers instead of having to fill their staff with players they acquired. 

[atomic]

1 hour ago, theocean said:

The Marlins have invested heavily in analytics since the change in ownership. Do a quick Google search and you'll find articles describing what they've done.

I think pretty much every team has a sizable analytics department now. The Orioles were just one of the last holdouts unfortunately - do to a number of reasons.

The Orioles has an analytic staff.  The Astros actually replaced Sig with an Orioles employee.

[Frobby]

6 hours ago, atomic said:

The Orioles has an analytic staff.  The Astros actually replaced Sig with an Orioles employee.

No.    The ex-Orioles’ employee, Sarah Gelles, has a significantly lower position with the Astros than Sig had.

[sportsfan8703]

8 hours ago, SteveA said:

No way will it be that low.

If we trade Bundy and Givens it might be. I think the Villar move drew lots of attention to our tank  job. Setting lines is all about public perception.  

[DrungoHazewood]

9 hours ago, makoman said:

“You see home plate was once round, like this pie plate here, before 1900. Which reminds me of ol’ Boileryard Clarke, who managed to play catcher for the Baltimore Orioles quite a bit during the 1890s despite not really hitting a lick. Well there was this time that he lost a bet with John McGraw over a game of cards and...”

”Uncle Drungo, can I just have my pie now?”

 

All Boileryard Clarke references get a like!

[Going Underground]

9 hours ago, SteveA said:

So you bring up the Marlins.  I guess you think the entire concept of this is to dump talent and get younger, and that what we and the Marlins are doing the same thing. 

Did the Marlins revamp their entire system to go to a data driven approach?  Did they invest in new equipment to monitor hitters and pitchers' body motion at all levels of the system?  Did they take steps to standardize instruction throughout the system?  Did they hire additional personnel to scout Latin America?  Did the Marlins create a whole analytics department out of practically nothing?

I guess if you think there's nothing to this rebuild except getting bad for a while, I can see why you are so opposed.  If you think what the Orioles are doing and what the Marlins are doing is somehow equivalent, then no wonder you don't like it.

So far, only ONE team has done a rebuild in this fashion -- the Astros -- and it worked spectacularly well.  I'm not sure how many others of the so called tanking teams are trying to do a state of the art data driven rebuild like Houston.  But we are.

I say almost all of the tanking teams are. As Jon Meoli said the Astros were successful so now it is the way teams are going to do it for now till the next thing comes along. 

The Tigers' player payroll is expected to stay much the same going into next season, enough to make some signings on a budget but not a major splash. Their major investment continues to be in analytics.

What was a one-man analytics department when Al Avila took over as general manager was up to 14 members this year. It’ll grow beyond that this winter as the Tigers look to add analytics brain power to their farm system.

“We’re adding more analytics. We’re adding more people,” manager Ron Gardenhire said. “We’re going out in search of college people that have really set the table and the groundwork for all this stuff, that know what they’re doing. As we speak, our guys are out there looking for people that are more involved in this.

 

https://www.mlb.com/news/tigers-to-spend-on-analytics-again