I’ve pretty much stopped watching

[Can_of_corn]

1 minute ago, OsFanSinceThe80s said:

Or MLB has to emulate the NFL and implement a salary cap and forced revenue sharing to give the smaller markets a chance to compete. Problem is I can't see the Yankees, Red Sox, Dodgers, etc. agreeing to give up their golden goose. 

Then you have to force the smaller market teams to spend and not just collect the money and laugh.

[DrungoHazewood]

1 minute ago, orioles22 said:

Yes, seems impossible unless there is a salary cap like the NFL.

Salary cap does nothing to level the revenue gap.  Alabama and Clemson don't pay their players anything (at least legally) and they still win almost every game.  Put a harsh salary cap in place without revenue sharing or revenue constraints and the Yanks/Dodgers/Sox would still win more because they'd have gold-plated locker rooms and personal Lear jets and each player gets a free $20M mansion.

[OsFanSinceThe80s]

1 minute ago, Can_of_corn said:

Then you have to force the smaller market teams to spend and not just collect the money and laugh.

Yeah a salary floor would have to be a requirement in this plan. 

[osfan83]

4 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

Salary cap does nothing to level the revenue gap.  Alabama and Clemson don't pay their players anything (at least legally) and they still win almost every game.  Put a harsh salary cap in place without revenue sharing or revenue constraints and the Yanks/Dodgers/Sox would still win more because they'd have gold-plated locker rooms and personal Lear jets and each player gets a free $20M mansion.

Weight wins based on total dollars spent. Go to a point system. When the Yankees win a game they get one point in the standings, when the O's win we get 10 points. The higher your overall team expense, the less points you get for a win. 

You want to hide expenses? Then you pay more tax dollars. 

[DrungoHazewood]

3 minutes ago, osfan83 said:

Yep, that's why I've become a Premiere League fan. Would be great if the O's played in 3 or 4 tournaments a year against teams with similar payrolls. That would keep me interested. 

I've watched a lot more 1860 Munich this year than the Orioles.  Even though they're in the German third division.  It's so much fun to watch a team with a small, dedicated fanbase competing with other teams roughly on the same financial footing. 

I also watch Tottenham Hotspur a lot, but they've been trending more in the dumpster fire direction over the last year or so.

Main point is that with multiple competitive goals everyone stays engaged, there are always things to shoot for.  Even if you're far out of the league title you might still be in the national cup, or the regional cup, or one of several European competitions.  Or just trying desperately to not be relegated.  The last game of the year between the 17th and 19th-best teams can have massive implications. That never happens in baseball.

[SteveA]

2 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

I've watched a lot more 1860 Munich this year than the Orioles.  Even though they're in the German third division.  It's so much fun to watch a team with a small, dedicated fanbase competing with other teams roughly on the same financial footing. 

I also watch Tottenham Hotspur a lot, but they've been trending more in the dumpster fire direction over the last year or so.

Main point is that with multiple competitive goals everyone stays engaged, there are always things to shoot for.  Even if you're far out of the league title you might still be in the national cup, or the regional cup, or one of several European competitions.  Or just trying desperately to not be relegated.  The last game of the year between the 17th and 19th-best teams can have massive implications. That never happens in baseball.

Yeah and there are also about 5 or 6 teams in the EPL that will never have the money to be be good enough to finish in the top 6 or whatever it takes to get into those major competitions, and unless they really screw up royally they'll never have to be relegated, so basically all they ever do is play .500ish ball every year.   Rinse, lather, repeat.   Oh yeah, they get a few Carabao Cup games or whatever it is.  Just another year in Southampton or Crystal Palace.

[DrungoHazewood]

6 minutes ago, osfan83 said:

Weight wins based on total dollars spent. Go to a point system. When the Yankees win a game they get one point in the standings, when the O's win we get 10 points. The higher your overall team expense, the less points you get for a win. 

You want to hide expenses? Then you pay more tax dollars. 

I like the idea of realigning into 2-3 leagues based on market size.  Maybe a 10-team huge market league, a 10-team mid-market league, and a 10-team small market league.  The top league gets four playoff spots, the middle three, and in the bottom league the top two teams play to get into the 2nd league playoffs.  Maybe have yearly promotion/relegation or reassignment as markets and revenues change.

Sure that's admitting that they couldn't solve revenue imbalances.  But that's the truth.  The big market teams will fight to the death to keep their inherent advantages, even if it means a third of the league has given up on competing in any given year.

[DrungoHazewood]

3 minutes ago, SteveA said:

Yeah and there are also about 5 or 6 teams in the EPL that will never have the money to be be good enough to finish in the top 6 or whatever it takes to get into those major competitions, and unless they really screw up royally they'll never have to be relegated, so basically all they ever do is play .500ish ball every year.   Rinse, lather, repeat.   Oh yeah, they get a few Carabao Cup games or whatever it is.  Just another year in Southampton or Crystal Palace.

Yes.  But when's the last time Crystal Palace told their fans to wait four years until they're going to try to win?

And when they got promoted back to the Premier League they celebrated like they won the World Series.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZFV7sWSdB7s

[Gurgi]

Lets face it we are just like Japanese teams that watch the greatest players go to America.   We already act like a AAA club for the big spending clubs.  

[eddie83]

28 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

Baseball's biggest problem is teams like the Orioles cannot regularly compete with teams that have 3-4 times the revenues.  Sure, the Rays are a thing.  But they are ruthless and cutthroat and super-efficient.  Everyone can't do that all the time.

The reality is that there's one trophy that matters, 29 teams go home disappointed, and on June 25th there are 9 or 10 teams that have been essentially eliminated.  They'll spend the next 90 games playing out the string.  By the All Star break there will be several more.  And there are 5-6 teams who were more-or-less eliminated on opening day.

The challenge in baseball is how to keep a modern fan with 1000 entertainment options engaged through a six-month, 162 game schedule when there's one trophy and some teams have $650M in revenues, some $200M.  The Yanks and Dodgers have player payrolls bigger than some teams total revenues, way bigger if you don't include revenue sharing.  Other sports have secondary competitions.  College sports have league titles and various tournaments and then the national championships.  Soccer has cups and relegation battles and Champions Leagues and international competitions.  Baseball has wait 'til 2024.

I think you are overstating the revenue equation. The best players are in their 20’s and they don’t come from FA. 
 

Obviously money matters but the Dodgers have a ton of homegrown talent. Boston has Devers, Bogaerts. 
 

You are always in any system going to have teams out of it at certain points in the year. 

[vab]

3 minutes ago, Gurgi said:

Lets face it we are just like Japanese teams that watch the greatest players go to America.   We already act like a AAA club for the big spending clubs.  

It would be a step up if we had players that big spending clubs wanted. 

[Robh21223]

Turned on the game Wednesday at 7:35pm, down 4-0 already in the 2nd inning. Turned it off. Tuned back in and it was bottom of the 9th and 13-0. By 7:35 last night, it was already 6-0. This team is completely unwatchable.

I predicted 55-107. This team might lose 110+.

[Tony-OH]

43 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

Baseball's biggest problem is teams like the Orioles cannot regularly compete with teams that have 3-4 times the revenues.  Sure, the Rays are a thing.  But they are ruthless and cutthroat and super-efficient.  Everyone can't do that all the time.

 

While be a pretty solid club overall, they don't draw fans. Partially its because of their awful dome stadium located in an area with increasingly terrible traffic, but also because fans probably don't want to get too attached to their players because they know they will be gone a soon as they get expensive. 

They haven't drawn over 1.5 million fans since 2013. 

 

[vab]

2 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

While be a pretty solid club overall, they don't draw fans. Partially its because of their awful dome stadium located in an area with increasingly terrible traffic, but also because fans probably don't want to get too attached to their players because they know they will be gone a soon as they get expensive. 

They haven't drawn over 1.5 million fans since 2013. 

 

Is that really a thing? I mean by that logic there probably wouldn't even be college sports since nobody stays there more than 4 years. I know it wouldn't effect my fandom if the Orioles were moving guys out like Tampa does if the team was consistently good. 

[OsFanSinceThe80s]

1 minute ago, Tony-OH said:

While be a pretty solid club overall, they don't draw fans. Partially its because of their awful dome stadium located in an area with increasingly terrible traffic, but also because fans probably don't want to get too attached to their players because they know they will be gone a soon as they get expensive. 

They haven't drawn over 1.5 million fans since 2013. 

 

Even with Tampa trading their top talent as soon as those players get expensive, I think a new ballpark in a better location would improve attendance assuming the Rays remain competitive. 

I haven't driven by the Rays dome in a long time, but the way I remembered it is instead of having OPACY imagine the Orioles played in a crappy dome on Pulaski Highway in East Baltimore.