Tillman should have never been brought up

[Sports Guy]

Disagree with you on Tillman's stuff tonight. I actually believe it was so bad that even good command wouldn't have been enough. He didn't even have enough on his fastball to bust anyone inside. It was really that bad. I don't think it's a health question. I think it's a mechanics problem. I've seen a few different looks from Tillman from the futures game, to last year, to this year. Plus, Tillman actually hit 93 on one pitch and started touching 90-91 in the second inning. Either he wasn't loose or it's a mechanical problem, or a combination of both. His stuff was awful, period. Tillman has a better, much more consistent curve than Penn had. The fastball and changeup are eerily similar. The physique and mechanics are eerily similar as well.

I meant his usual stuff not tonight.

[accinfo]

He is amassing service time which will send him into arbitration

Who cares about his service time? At this rate he will be out of the sport in two-three years.

[NickStckMattBat]

I do not have any idea what this statement means, but I am going to assume you are being sarcastic. If so, then what is your deal? You know how many times I on here people are like are you serious, that is crazy, what are you talking about and then time passes and what I said usually ends up being exactly what should have happened or not happened. What about the things I mentioned:

He is amassing service time which will send him into arbitration

He has zero control of his fastball

He does not have a valid changeup

His ERA was higher this round of AAA than last season

He has not had a sub 2 ERA in AAA that screams he should not be there

Does not make it logical to send him down?

Are you kidding me? He has not had a SUB 2 ERA?! SO HE SHOULD NOT BE THERE?!

SUB TWO?!!! HAHAHAHAHAHHAHHA.

[BaltBird 24]

Are you kidding me? He has not had a SUB 2 ERA?! SO HE SHOULD NOT BE THERE?!

SUB TWO?!!! HAHAHAHAHAHHAHHA.

And there's also a rumor going around that he can't walk on water. Until he can do that there's no reason for him to be on my favorite MLB team.

[jdouble777]

Are you kidding me? He has not had a SUB 2 ERA?! SO HE SHOULD NOT BE THERE?!

SUB TWO?!!! HAHAHAHAHAHHAHHA.

What I was stating is that if he did have a sub 2 then there is not one possible debate that could take place that would lead one to believe he needs to continue to refine his skills. There are countless pitchers who hover around a 3 ERA that come up, get blasted, and sometimes never recover. If you are giving up 2 or 3 runs a game in AAA there plenty of reason to believe that there could still be some tinkering that needs to happen. Which is clearly the case. If here were rarely giving up 2 runs a game then odds are he has polished just about everything. Although, there could still be room to get destroyed and need to work on some stuff at the lower level. Which was the case with Buccholz.

[jdouble777]

Are you kidding me? He has not had a SUB 2 ERA?! SO HE SHOULD NOT BE THERE?!

SUB TWO?!!! HAHAHAHAHAHHAHHA.

There were numerous other reasons listed.

[BIG R]

is batting practice. Tonight it was 87-89mph with no movement and up in the zone. Curveball was rolling up there. Change up had terrible location.

And this is against a terrible Giants lineup in that big ballpark. Brutal. Back to the minors for you Chris.

[jdouble777]

is batting practice. Tonight it was 87-89mph with no movement and up in the zone. Curveball was rolling up there. Change up had terrible location.

And this is against a terrible Giants lineup in that big ballpark. Brutal. Back to the minors for you Chris.

In four starts, two he has go 2 innings or less. If that does not scream demotion, what possibly could? Meanwhile, Berken and Albers come in and start putting up zeros. Ugh

[Stan P]

I remember when people said I was dumb for wanting Arrieta to be brought up in place of Tillman, lol.

[SrMeowMeow]

He is 22.

Seriously, end of story.

[Sports Guy]

He is 22.

Seriously, end of story.

Being young doesn't mean you can't be successful...and it doesn't mean you should look awful.

What it does mean is that you have a lot of time to improve.

[SrMeowMeow]

Being young doesn't mean you can't be successful...and it doesn't mean you should look awful.

What it does mean is that you have a lot of time to improve.

As far as prospect status goes, being 22 means a hell of a lot more than 13 innings in the majors. The velocity is not a good sign, but we're talking about a young, excellent prospect who dominated AA and AAA at 21 and 22, respectively. This thread is as knee-jerk as it gets.

[makoman]

I do not have any idea what this statement means, but I am going to assume you are being sarcastic. If so, then what is your deal? You know how many times I on here people are like are you serious, that is crazy, what are you talking about and then time passes and what I said usually ends up being exactly what should have happened or not happened. What about the things I mentioned:

He is amassing service time which will send him into arbitration

He has zero control of his fastball

He does not have a valid changeup

His ERA was higher this round of AAA than last season

He has not had a sub 2 ERA in AAA that screams he should not be there

Does not make it logical to send him down?

Like when you were complaining for a day plus that Arrieta shouldn't start against the Yankees?

Tillman is bad right now, I agree with you. He is also 22. 22 year olds often need work.

He has not had a sub 2 ERA, no. He had a 3.18 at age 20 in AA, then a 2.70 at AAA at 21, and a 3.12 at AAA this year at 22, including a no hitter. What do you want? If pitchers have to wait to be sub 2 to come up, they'll never come up.

Edit: I certainly do have concerns about Tillman. But it does not seem that he will learn anything else in AAA, he has done well there and knows how to succeed there. We need him up here, and we need him to learn how to succeed here.

[Sports Guy]

As far as prospect status goes, being 22 means a hell of a lot more than 13 innings in the majors. The velocity is not a good sign, but we're talking about a young, excellent prospect who dominated AA and AAA at 21 and 22, respectively. This thread is as knee-jerk as it gets.

Well, Tillman didn't look great last year...There were signs but nothing substantial.

And Penn dominated AA and AAA at very young ages as well.

Right now, Tillman's stuff isn't ML quality on a consistent basis. That is clearly a valid concern.

[SrMeowMeow]

Well, Tillman didn't look great last year...There were signs but nothing substantial.

And Penn dominated AA and AAA at very young ages as well.

Right now, Tillman's stuff isn't ML quality on a consistent basis. That is clearly a valid concern.

And Penn was an excellent prospect.