Tomase credits DD for rebuild of front office over 2012 on field production.

[waroriole]

We can improve the starting pitching by acquiring journeyman pitchers and having them pitch to a 4.00 ERA. We don't have to spend a ton of money on pitching to improve the rotation.

To get the offensive improvement that is needed though to back up that pitching, that's where the money has to be spent.

OMG, why didn't we think of this earlier. Those 4 ERA SP are just everywhere. What a great idea.

[JTrea81]

So, when we don't sign Fielder this year, are you going to advocate a complete rebuild in the same manner that you advocate a $20M+ a year 1B?

That's the only alternative I see. And I know they won't go there sadly.

Fielder is a golden opportunity, and they'd better put their best effort forth.

If he signs for a 8+ year deal, well then that's that, but I don't see that happening.

[JTrea81]

OMG, why didn't we think of this earlier. Those 4 ERA SP are just everywhere. What a great idea.

Look at how many there are out there now. Look at what the Yankees got from Colon. Heck we could get that from Wada and Eveland for all we know.

Depth and innings are the key for starting pitching.

The TOR starter can come next offseason when there will likely be many available. If the Orioles do enough this offseason, they might even go for one at the deadline to make a playoff run...

We don't have to have stellar pitching to make it to the playoffs. Once you get there is a different story, but we need to get there first before we worry about that.

[OrangeJerseys]

Hardy is a current Bargain. If H eis healthy this year as well his value sky rockets. Sky Rockets.

Sky Rockets

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/HQwzX8oLUnw" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[weams]

Look at what the Yankees got from Colon.

If you had talked about Garcia, I could have gone down that road a bit with you.

On Colon, the behind the curtain secrecy and late season poor performance...No.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/12/sports/baseball/disputed-treatment-was-used-in-bartolo-colons-comeback.html?_r=1&pagewanted=all

When there was no blood testing, and no test for HGH. Right.

[JTrea81]

Hardy is a current Bargain. If H eis healthy this year as well his value sky rockets. Sky Rockets.

The only thing "Hardy" and "healthy" have in common is that the two start with an "h"

Hardy missed a month last season and hasn't played in 140 games since he was 25.

If you acquire Hardy, you basically count on him for 100 games and somebody else for the rest.

[waroriole]

The only thing "Hardy" and "healthy" have in common is that the two start with an "h"

Hardy missed a month last season and hasn't played in 140 games since he was 25.

If you acquire Hardy, you basically count on him for 100 games and somebody else for the rest.

But you think that other teams don't know what you do, and we'll be able to get a lot for him, right?

[JTrea81]

If you had talked about Garcia, I could have gone down that road a bit with you.

On Colon, the behind the curtain secrecy and late season poor performance...No.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/12/sports/baseball/disputed-treatment-was-used-in-bartolo-colons-comeback.html?_r=1&pagewanted=all

Colon is the only one of his patients that he did not use the HGH supliment with. When there was no blood testing, and not test for HGH. Right.

Colon, Garcia, etc. Teams get that kind of performance from retreads all the time. Our scouting has always been terrible though, so that's why we never did.

If you want to talk scouting, that's where you can get an advantage. Find the journeyman pitcher that will get you those quality starts.

[JTrea81]

But you think that other teams don't know what you do, and we'll be able to get a lot for him, right?

No, our two main chips are Matt Wieters and Adam Jones.

The time to trade Hardy was at the last deadline. Now you won't get as much for him IMO. Ditto for Guthrie.

If we were going the firesale route, that's when it should have really begun.

[Roll Tide]

No, our two main chips are Matt Wieters and Adam Jones.

The time to trade Hardy was at the last deadline. Now you won't get as much for him IMO. Ditto for Guthrie.

If we were going the firesale route, that's when it should have really begun.

Guthrie & Hardy still have plenty of value.

[MrOrange82]

Guthrie & Hardy still have plenty of value.

This isn't on point, but does anyone know what happened with Hardy's fielding valuation as per fangraphs? I remember that he was hovering around average (slightly below average, actually) most of the way through the 2011 season. Now fangraphs lists his 2011 defense as +10.7. What happened?

[El Gordo]

When we don't sign Fielder, he will quietly leave the board. He has written that several times. That is still the plan, right?

I doubt it. He's already staking out his new plan.

[Bradysburns]

The only thing "Hardy" and "healthy" have in common is that the two start with an "h"

Hardy missed a month last season and hasn't played in 140 games since he was 25.

If you acquire Hardy, you basically count on him for 100 games and somebody else for the rest.

Fuff fuff fuff. Nice one!

But seriously... What people gotsta understand here is: first things first. You have to get your talent-evaluation team in place, and get your brain trust around you. And you have to evaluate intelligently. The stakes are too high to come in wheeling and dealing like a riverboat gambler.

There are posters on this board who probably have more statistical/factual knowledge about some of the Orioles' players than the majority of pro scouts. No matter how smart they are, they need to do a hell of a lot of statistical analysis and team analysis before they can intelligently decide the calculus for trading a player like Jones, for example. What's his value to this team? That's a very different question than what his value may be to any given trading partner, etc. There's a lot more to the next leg of this journey than some seem to think.

My point: It's kind of like the brain trust is the foundation of the building. So you have to make sure that's right first. Then you can start building on that. Otherwise, you're out buying the girders that are the wrong length, and paying guys to lay brick sidewalks to nowhere. Is this metaphor getting ridiculous enough for you?

[SammyBirdland]

The only thing "Hardy" and "healthy" have in common is that the two start with an "h"

That's not true. They both also end in "y" and contain an "a". The total number of letters in each are both prime numbers.

[BaltimoreTerp]

That's not true. They both also end in "y" and contain an "a". The total number of letters in each are both prime numbers.

Sounds like they are creepily in common.