Palmer sounds like he's had enough.

[Ripken]

Is there an Orioles fan who hasn't had enough?  Just another brutal mess last night.

[JR Oriole]

If you haven't had enough, you are nuts.  8-25 is ridiculous.  No MLB team has weak enough talent to be that bad unless your entire team is minor league call-ups.  No veteran team should ever be this awful.  Feel free to fire everybody....nobody should be safe. 

[Barnaby Graves]

I'm beginning to hate Davis on a personal level.  Like, you've got some nerve making that much money to be terrible for four more years.  But I know it's really our organization's fault for giving him such a bonehead stupid deal.  Watching him lazily whiff for the next four seasons is going to suck.

[atomic]

1 hour ago, Ripken said:

Is there an Orioles fan who hasn't had enough?  Just another brutal mess last night.

Glad I have skipped watching the last 2 games.  

[theocean]

12 minutes ago, atomic said:

Glad I have skipped watching the last 2 games.  

I've stopped watching. But, I've been watching other games via MLB.tv. Baseball is really great right now - there's so many exciting players. I'd encourage you to try that out, might help fill the empty void the 8-25 Orioles have created.

[El Gordo]

12 hours ago, atomic said:

I wouldn't have the current 25 man roster.   

That's not the manager's decision. Buck isn't the GM.That's just a dodge. How would you make better use of this current roster.?

[El Gordo]

12 hours ago, atomic said:

 

Also I don't think it matters.   I doubt a randomly generated line up would do any worse. Orioles are winning less than 25 percent of their games.  Not having  a manager and just letting the players decide wouldn't be worse. 

So why are you so adamant Buck should be fired if you don't the any manager would make a difference with this current roster?

[atomic]

Just now, El Gordo said:

So why are you so adamant Buck should be fired if you don't the any manager would make a difference with this current roster?

I didn't say that at all.   I said a random generated line up or letting the players work out the line among themselves is bound to better than 8-25.  I have mentioned numerous times what I think he has been doing wrong.   If you want to start a new thread about how to win more games I will reply in that 

[spiritof66]

5 minutes ago, El Gordo said:

That's not the manager's decision. Buck isn't the GM.That's just a dodge. How would you make better use of this current roster.?

There are those who believe that Buck has influenced the makeup of the current roster by  promoting, at least, the Davis and Tillman signings. I don't know whether that's true, but it's certainly plausible. Other than any influence like that, I believe Buck Showalter's bad decisions have been a tiny part of this team's problems -- unless there's something going on with the Orioles that I know nothing about.

As I've posted before, for me the question about Buck is whether he should be the manager during the Orioles' rebuilding process, when most of "his guys" who are still around are dealt or released, and a new crop of young, guys comes in to develop a team around (almost certainly losing a lot on the way). I think he's not, and that the beginning of that process will be the time to turn the page on Buck. I wouldn't be at all surprised to learn that he agrees with that.

So when will the rebuilding process get going and a new manager brought in? Could be next week, could be the trade deadline, could be after this season is over, could be never. The sooner the better.  And what's the process for the Orioles' decision when and whether to flip that switch? Those of us on the outside don't know; I sure hope those on the inside have figured it out by now.

[El Gordo]

2 minutes ago, spiritof66 said:

There are those who believe that Buck has influenced the makeup of the current roster by  promoting, at least, the Davis and Tillman signings. I don't know whether that's true, but it's certainly plausible. Other than any influence like that, I believe Buck Showalter's bad decisions have been a tiny part of this team's problems -- unless there's something going on with the Orioles that I know nothing about.

As I've posted before, for me the question about Buck is whether he should be the manager during the Orioles' rebuilding process, when most of "his guys" who are still around are dealt or released, and a new crop of young, guys comes in to develop a team around (almost certainly losing a lot on the way). I think he's not, and that the beginning of that process will be the time to turn the page on Buck. I wouldn't be at all surprised to learn that he agrees with that.

So when will the rebuilding process get going and a new manager brought in? Could be next week, could be the trade deadline, could be after this season is over, could be never. The sooner the better.  And what's the process for the Orioles' decision when and whether to flip that switch? Those of us on the outside don't know; I sure hope those on the inside have figured it out by now.

I agree Buck shouldn't be the manager of a rebuild. I bet he agrees too. But why fire him now? No rebuild will begin before the TD, and what would be the point then. I think we need the best, most effective, and unencumbered GM in charge of the rebuild. Some one who has the trust and confidence from PA to get a free hand. That would be Buck. More so than Brady or any one from out side the organization. 

[El Gordo]

26 minutes ago, atomic said:

I didn't say that at all.   I said a random generated line up or letting the players work out the line among themselves is bound to better than 8-25.  I have mentioned numerous times what I think he has been doing wrong.   If you want to start a new thread about how to win more games I will reply in that 

I didn't ask what he was doing wrong, I asked you to show me your better lineup. Why are you so afraid to do that., Is it because you really can't think of one.?

[spiritof66]

14 minutes ago, El Gordo said:

I agree Buck shouldn't be the manager of a rebuild. I bet he agrees too. But why fire him now? No rebuild will begin before the TD, and what would be the point then. I think we need the best, most effective, and unencumbered GM in charge of the rebuild. Some one who has the trust and confidence from PA to get a free hand. That would be Buck. More so than Brady or any one from out side the organization. 

I agree that if the Orioles are just going to play out the string through July or September, it doesn't really manager who the manager is while that happens.

I don't know for certain what Buck knows and doesn't know, but I am pretty sure from watching what he does and from listening to him that he  lacks the sort of state-the-art knowledge about what wins and loses baseball games, and zeal to develop and apply additional insights, that I would want to see in a general manager. What Buck appears to have is a large arsenal of baseball "truths" that he's built up over the years, like teams shouldn't draft young players with beards -- some of them probably valid, some of them not -- that have not  been exposed to testing and analysis and that he is unlikely to change.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/mvp-hamilton-blames-blue-eyes-for-hitting-woes/

It may be that, for the reasons you mention, Buck is the most effective effective GM on a team owned by Peter Angelos. I hope things aren't that bad, but maybe they are.

[Dale]

Pedro Araujo was the subject of Palmer's frustration last night.  Upon entering the game, Palmer (paraphrasing) mentioned that the A's must be feeling pretty good about the fact that the only reason the pitcher they are facing is in the majors is the Rule 5 draft. He also stated that if Araujo is one of your top options you need to fix your minor league system (again paraphrasing --- it was late or actually early as I watched on DVD this morning) 

 

[Beef Supreme]

1 hour ago, spiritof66 said:

I agree that if the Orioles are just going to play out the string through July or September, it doesn't really manager who the manager is while that happens.

I don't know for certain what Buck knows and doesn't know, but I am pretty sure from watching what he does and from listening to him that he  lacks the sort of state-the-art knowledge about what wins and loses baseball games, and zeal to develop and apply additional insights, that I would want to see in a general manager. What Buck appears to have is a large arsenal of baseball "truths" that he's built up over the years, like teams shouldn't draft young players with beards -- some of them probably valid, some of them not -- that have not  been exposed to testing and analysis and that he is unlikely to change.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/mvp-hamilton-blames-blue-eyes-for-hitting-woes/

It may be that, for the reasons you mention, Buck is the most effective effective GM on a team owned by Peter Angelos. I hope things aren't that bad, but maybe they are.

Would you detail a few of these "truths" that Buck believes?

Also, got a quote about Buck saying teams should not draft players with beards?

[accinfo]

6 minutes ago, Dale said:

Pedro Araujo was the subject of Palmer's frustration last night.  Upon entering the game, Palmer (paraphrasing) mentioned that the A's must be feeling pretty good about the fact that the only reason the pitcher they are facing is in the majors is the Rule 5 draft. He also stated that if Araujo is one of your top options you need to fix your minor league system (again paraphrasing --- it was late or actually early as I watched on DVD this morning) 

 

He said if Araujo is a better option then anyone in your minor leagues then you need to fix your minor league system.  He has a point.