We’re the worst team in the business (Ownership driving decisions) - Dan Duquette

[wildcard]

I think what Dan said is pretty factual.   The O's spend above their market position of the last 3 or 4 years to keep many of these players together.   To do that there cut back in other areas.  I think most mid market teams would do the same to compete with the Yankees and  Red Sox of the world.   

I do think Dan comes off a little weak here though.   A VP of Baseball Operations should have more influence with his owner.   He should make the case for why certain deals are good or bad for the organization.   The Davis 7 year contract is just one of several that the lead BB executive should be speaking against.  Taking some of that money to sign Manny early would have looked smart. Trading away #1 draft choices for poor pitchers looks real bad now.  

Dan did a lot of good things to get the O's to their peak in 2014 and many bad things caused the fall after that.

Maybe Dan just didn't have the vision to warn against many of these moves.  Maybe no one would have.   But isn't that what a lead baseball exec is paid for and what he is judged by at the end of his contract?

 

[weams]

24 minutes ago, wildcard said:

I think what Dan said is pretty factual.   The O's spend above their market position of the last 3 or 4 years to keep many of these players together.   To do that there cut back in other areas.  I think most mid market teams would do the same to compete with the Yankees and  Red Sox of the world.   

I do think Dan comes off a little weak here though.   A VP of Baseball Operations should have more influence with his owner.   He should make the case for why certain deals are good or bad for the organization.   The Davis 7 year contract is just one of several that the lead BB executive should be speaking against.  Taking some of that money to sign Manny early would have looked smart. Trading away #1 draft choices for poor pitchers looks real bad now.  

Dan did a lot of good things to get the O's to their peak in 2014 and many bad things caused the fall after that.

Maybe Dan just didn't have the vision to warn against many of these moves.  Maybe no one would have.   But isn't that what a lead baseball exec is paid for and what he is judged by at the end of his contract?

 

You think Buck was up for a rebuild before this season?  I think he had Peter's ear. I do. 

[wildcard]

16 minutes ago, weams said:

You think Buck was up for a rebuild before this season?  I think he had Peter's ear. I do. 

I don't think Buck wanted a rebuild in 2018.  Yes he had Peter's ear last fall but Peter must have had real health problems by the first of the year from what has been reported.

[Tony-OH]

5 hours ago, atomic said:

He probably hasn't heard anything and thus suspects the worst.   

That would be the Orioles M.O. They normally just let contracts run out and don't say anything. I have to imagine though with DD and Buck that they'll have to say something at the end of the season.

[weams]

6 minutes ago, wildcard said:

I don't think Buck wanted a rebuild in 2018.  Yes he had Peter's ear last fall but Peter must have had real health problems by the first of the year from what has been reported.

So, you admit it might have been five against one?  Could have been?

[OFFNY]

2 hours ago, SteveA said:

 

Five years is not an aberration. We did some GOOD things as an organization (both under McPhail and Duquette) to get those 5 years. We drafted and developed a Hall of Fame 3rd baseman, a good major league 2nd baseman, a good major league C, a great closer, a decent starter, some solid relievers, and a few other decent pieces. We traded for a very good starting pitcher and the greatest center fielder in franchise history in one deal.   We traded not very much to get a guy who led the major leagues in home runs twice, and cheaply acquired two guys who led the majors in home runs once each. We found a solid starting pitcher toiling in anonymity in the Mexican League, another in Taiwan, and another buried in the Indians' minor league system. We got an excellent setup man for several years for absolutely nothing.   We got useful production just when we needed it out of guys who were basically rejects from other teams like Pearce, McLouth, Valencia, Bourn, Young, Saunders and a couple rule 5 picks.   And we made the playoffs 3 out of 5 years in the toughest division to do so in baseball.

A lot of mistakes were made too that led to where we are now. We traded away too much of the future to try to maximize our talent during the "window." But this organization did a lot of things RIGHT to have one of baseball's best records for a 5 year stretch.

 

o

 

Good post, Steve.

2012 through 2016 was a long enough positive stretch that it had most Orioles fans considering the 81-81 record which they posted in 2015 to be a BAD season.

That sentiment (deeming an 81-81 season to be a bad one) would have been unheard of anytime between 2006 and 2010.

 

o

[weams]

17 minutes ago, OFFNY said:

o

 

Good post, Steve.

2012 through 2016 was a long enough positive stretch that it had most Orioles fans considering the 81-81 record which they posted in 2015 to be a BAD season.

That sentiment (deeming an 81-81 season to be a bad one) would have been unheard of anytime between 2006 and 2010.

 

o

I like watching the Orioles win more times than they lose. So I am part of the problem as well. 

[OFFNY]

20 minutes ago, OFFNY said:

o

 

Good post, Steve.

2012 through 2016 was a long enough positive stretch that it had most Orioles fans considering the 81-81 record which they posted in 2015 to be a BAD season.

That sentiment (deeming an 81-81 season to be a bad one) would have been unheard of anytime between 2006 and 2010.

 

o

 

2 minutes ago, weams said:

 

I like watching the Orioles win more times than they lose. So I am part of the problem, as well. 

 

o

 

What problem ???

 

o

[weams]

The lack of a towel throwing ceremony halfway through a winning run.

[Frobby]

7 hours ago, Chromehill said:

The Royals are not much better than the Orioles this year (they will probably lose 100 games).  At least they have a World Series win and another AL Championship to show for it.  They are also several years ahead of the O's in their rebuild.  

Are they?    The Bleacher Report list that came out today ranks KC’s farm system 23rd, five spots behind us.   I don’t consider B/R very authoritative, but that doesn’t suggest that KC is far along on a rebuild.  

[Finisher]

30 minutes ago, Frobby said:

Are they?    The Bleacher Report list that came out today ranks KC’s farm system 23rd, five spots behind us.   I don’t consider B/R very authoritative, but that doesn’t suggest that KC is far along on a rebuild.  

Brad Keller and Jake Junis have looked solid in the rotation. Then they have Whit Merrifield, Ryan O'Hearn and Adalberto Mondesi (who is hitting out of his mind at the moment) all looking like potential keepers.

[Cumberbundy]

4 hours ago, OFFNY said:

o

 

Good post, Steve.

2012 through 2016 was a long enough positive stretch that it had most Orioles fans considering the 81-81 record which they posted in 2015 to be a BAD season.

That sentiment (deeming an 81-81 season to be a bad one) would have been unheard of anytime between 2006 and 2010.

 

o

Of the things Steve mentioned, how many was Dan involved in?

[OFFNY]

7 minutes ago, Cy Bundy said:

 

Of the things Steve mentioned, how many was Dan involved in?

 

o

 

Go through the post and see for yourself. I'm not your maid.

 

o

[Cumberbundy]

5 hours ago, wildcard said:

I think what Dan said is pretty factual.   The O's spend above their market position of the last 3 or 4 years to keep many of these players together.   To do that there cut back in other areas.  I think most mid market teams would do the same to compete with the Yankees and  Red Sox of the world.   

I do think Dan comes off a little weak here though.   A VP of Baseball Operations should have more influence with his owner.   He should make the case for why certain deals are good or bad for the organization.   The Davis 7 year contract is just one of several that the lead BB executive should be speaking against.  Taking some of that money to sign Manny early would have looked smart. Trading away #1 draft choices for poor pitchers looks real bad now.  

Dan did a lot of good things to get the O's to their peak in 2014 and many bad things caused the fall after that.

Maybe Dan just didn't have the vision to warn against many of these moves.  Maybe no one would have.   But isn't that what a lead baseball exec is paid for and what he is judged by at the end of his contract?

 

What are the many good things Dan did? I think he’s been the luckiest GM in the game, he was told to go for it, he had no regard for the system, the guys we won around weren’t his, and he’s got the excuse of Angelos to blame his many atrocious moves on. Gallardo and Ubaldo for two firsts should get a guy put in an asylum. The owner tells Dan to go all in with a team of assets someone else put together and when he finishes up we have little to show for it other than one nice playoff series and now we are setting records for futility. No matter how awful he is, many will defend him, it’s a charmed life disguised as something entirely different. He pulled it off, he turned a nice franchise into a joke and has no ownership in the futility but gets credit for the wins of a team built by someone else. His claim to success lies mostly with Cruz — who he probably should have resigned — being unwanted by anyone else. Blind luck. 

[Cumberbundy]

3 minutes ago, OFFNY said:

o

 

Go through the post and see for yourself. I'm not your maid.

 

o

Rhetorical question, my friend. But, I like that you stood your ground, the #metoo movement is really empowering, good for you OFFNY.